Coaching discussion on Myth - Page 4

On July 18 2010 12:09 Nazgul wrote: Show nested quote + On July 18 2010 11:32 byrnesam wrote: Im not jumping on anyones side here, but how many are there that are almost 100% staked in all games they play? You seem to be misinterpreting what he said, everyone knows there are tons of players who share action in big tournaments to reduce the variance, getting staked in all games seems totally different though. No he is entirely right in that you will see known pros in lots of games being staked. Be it cash be it tournaments. Be it tournaments online and tournaments live etc. Staking is huge amongst poker players of any level.

Can you guys name any long term winners who are staked in all games they play?

Jean Robert Bellande comes to mind, im sure there are many others too.

Then, of these players - how many are coaching for $350/hr+ ?

It seems counter-intuitive to making money if youre a long term winner in the games to be staked constantly - whether PTR is accurate or not.

On July 18 2010 12:15 tomson wrote: Show nested quote + On July 18 2010 11:31 tutz_x wrote: edit: just to make it clear, I'm not in favor of losing players teaching, I think it's quite wrong. what I mean is if he is teaching in a way that people don't feel they are being scammed or something, why should we care so much? It's not like he is stealing anybody's students. So you're opposed to losing players giving lessons, UNLESS their customers are satisfied. Let me ask you this - what are your thoughts on selling placebo pills to ill people? Fair game?

Not the same situation. That analogy is a little unfair.

I dont see the point of this thread really. I mean, most people know that myth hasnt produced any solid online results in a very long time, and its not like he is trying to hide it. If cardrunners still wanna hire him and people still wanna pay $350/h thats up to them. If you dont atleast look up your coach on ptr before you hire him youre a moron anyways.

On July 18 2010 12:15 tomson wrote: Show nested quote + On July 18 2010 11:31 tutz_x wrote: edit: just to make it clear, I'm not in favor of losing players teaching, I think it's quite wrong. what I mean is if he is teaching in a way that people don't feel they are being scammed or something, why should we care so much? It's not like he is stealing anybody's students. So you're opposed to losing players giving lessons, UNLESS their customers are satisfied. Let me ask you this - what are your thoughts on selling placebo pills to ill people? Fair game?

i know you didn't address me with this but i'd like to comment anyway

the closest we can come to concrete proof in this discussion IS to listen to his students, and possibly seeing before/after graphs, but this is near impossible for us to see for many reasons

the same i think can be said for the placebo pills question. the placebo effect is inherent in all humans and has helped ppl numerous times, so the answer to your question if it's fair game has to be: Yes, if it helped the person become better. sometimes it really IS that simple. In both these situations there's little black or white, we have to look at the end results (with some significant sample size) to determine the morality level in both placebo, and the Myth situation.

myth coaching is worse than giving someone ill placebo pills because it will do harm to the students game and costs a shit load more.

On July 18 2010 12:21 byrnesam wrote: Can you guys name any long term winners who are staked in all games they play? Jean Robert Bellande comes to mind, im sure there are many others too. Then, of these players - how many are coaching for $350/hr+ ? It seems counter-intuitive to making money if youre a long term winner in the games to be staked constantly - whether PTR is accurate or not.

I can give you a huge list but courtesy to those people I won't. You'll just have to take my word for it.

afaik myth has long term students and even has a seminar where they fly out to him, he gets $x plus a % of profits so he's getting paid for the most part off of the success of his students which seems plenty fair. Also I will vouch for his skills as a poker player and i hold his morality in the highest esteem, he's not ripping anyone off. Mad respect for Corwin and his choices both on and off the felt.

ban dandydolly imo wtf he's just trolling like he has a blood feud w my man mythirino

On July 18 2010 12:26 SakiSaki wrote: I dont see the point of this thread really. I mean, most people know that myth hasnt produced any solid online results in a very long time, and its not like he is trying to hide it. If cardrunners still wanna hire him and people still wanna pay $350/h thats up to them. If you dont atleast look up your coach on ptr before you hire him youre a moron anyways.

just because you have come to this conclusion yourself doesn't necessarily mean the thread has no point... we're a small community and it is just reasonable to discuss these things. i mean if some people believe someone here is not acting ethically, wouldn't that someone want an occasion to clear off any dirt if he believes in his product? we've seen the opposite so far with that whole story, it's not the first time it's brought up and myth has ignored it before, which obviously raises suspicion. it's a good thing that we're having this thread because clearly many of us were curious and we can all voice our opinions about the situation.

i don't think it's the right way to approach the whole thing though, and people now know that he hasn't had solid online results, but it wasn't always this way. i feel like there was indeed an aura of him trying to hide it at some point and it's worth bringing up.

also, if we simplify what you're saying it's just like saying "well if people are naive enough, or wish to have faith, let it be", which tomson has eloquently responded to already. it's at the very least worth discussing anyway.

bahahahahahaaaaa

enough hatred on the whole "oh you coach but u get staked wtf?"

there are tons of reasons players get staked. they're jews and dont wanna risk anything but their time, they degened all their money away, etc

or in my case you stopped enjoying online poker and couldn't bear to grind out tons of hands online and didnt have money for 10ks live yet wanted to play them so i quit grinding hard online and attacked live poker and fell in love with it and play it primarily



Some people are just born instructors ... the two i know are myth and dzoo. almost all their students give them sick good reviews.

who cares what those people pay? i mean u dont have to pay it or deal w/ it in any way except knowing that the site cardrunners.com is there



unless you take lessons from him or have played a fair amount with him and can honestly say he's crap and give reasons why i dont rly think u should be attacking

plenty of people have played with him and some of the best players i know that have think hes amazing

On July 18 2010 12:24 Maynard! wrote: Show nested quote + On July 18 2010 12:15 tomson wrote:   On July 18 2010 11:31 tutz_x wrote: edit: just to make it clear, I'm not in favor of losing players teaching, I think it's quite wrong. what I mean is if he is teaching in a way that people don't feel they are being scammed or something, why should we care so much? It's not like he is stealing anybody's students. So you're opposed to losing players giving lessons, UNLESS their customers are satisfied. Let me ask you this - what are your thoughts on selling placebo pills to ill people? Fair game? Not the same situation. That analogy is a little unfair.

The analogy is meant to address that just because both sides are satisfied does not make it ok / ethical.

frinkx, if there were really "attacks" going on, this thread would be closed. nazgul re-opened it for a reason. all i see is people expressing a valid concern on an important topic.

and fwiw, most of us who still grind have stopped enjoying the grind a long time ago and we just aren't as fortunate as you guys were. while you guys degen it out living lavishly because of your luck in life, we have to grind to put food on our plate, y'know? most of us would love to be able to do what you're doing but we can't.

i don't think it's completely unreasonable to be a bit irritated at someone who's charging $350/h for coaching because of his reputation (which he has gotten by being very fortunate mainly) and not because of his raw talent nor particularly hard work.

i'm not a jealous guy by nature, but i can honestly say i wouldn't even feel like railing myth if he had made the main event final table, whereas i was stoked about fayth making it this deep because from my perspective it's not even close who deserves it the most.

On July 18 2010 12:45 thewh00sel wrote: afaik myth has long term students and even has a seminar where they fly out to him, he gets $x plus a % of profits so he's getting paid for the most part off of the success of his students which seems plenty fair. Also I will vouch for his skills as a poker player and i hold his morality in the highest esteem, he's not ripping anyone off. Mad respect for Corwin and his choices both on and off the felt.

A few testimonials or students coming forth woudl be good. Saying that he has had satisfied students w/o providing satisfied students is unsatisfactory. If enough people hear that he has many satisfied students it starts to be perceived as true even if it might not be.

JizzleSmits saying he was satisfied is worth a lot more than an outsider saying "he has many satisfied students."

Ye loco I guess u are right. Whats up with this though:

On July 18 2010 13:15 Loco wrote: while you guys degen it out living lavishly because of your luck in life, we have to grind to put food on our plate, y'know? most of us would love to be able to do what you're doing but we can't. .

"food on the table" haha cmon man you cant be running that bad

it isn't really about me, it's a valid generalization my friend. but anyway if you want to understand where i'm coming from for including myself in there, i really mean to say that if i stop grinding completely i might have food now but for how long? cost of living isn't cheap, i'd be broke before i know it, and i'm not extravagant by any means. whether i grind now or choose to do it later it's still with the same purpose of putting food on my plate and a roof over my head because i'm very far from having secured that for many years.

Loco looked mad ripped in some pic and eats only green stuff. He'd probably have to eat like one million apples each day to keep that up.

^lol

i mostly skimmed peoples posts cuz there were too many and they were too long so i used to word "attack" too lightly

while you guys degen it out living lavishly because of your luck in life, we have to grind to put food on our plate, y'know? most of us would love to be able to do what you're doing but we can't.

man this really irritates me. who cares how much we spend. that has nothing to do with any of this. i got to where i am because of my luck in life? sure i was lucky as fuck to discover poker, but what in the fuck? myth and i have grinded live tournaments so fucking hard over the last 2-3 years. i dunno about him but i COMPLETELY gave up the online grind and completely risked my entire bankroll by playing huge high variance tournaments on a stake without grinding cash for myself besides some live cash... while having lavish spending habits. if u cant get to where we are its because u arent as good or just havent tried to get into them

u realize i havent won anything in since december of 2008 when i got 3rd in wpt? i havent grinded online for real once, now I have to because I need $.

dont talk about things u dont have a fucking clue about as fact

i'm not a jealous guy by nature, but i can honestly say i wouldn't even feel like railing myth if he had made the main event final table, whereas i was stoked about fayth making it this deep because from my perspective it's not even close who deserves it the most.

what the fuck?

deserves?

in poker?

what the fuck is wrong with you