ASL Season 10 - Page 10

Yeah, this is why Light was such a big favourite to get out of his group, but he fucked it up big time. He even beat all 3 players in his group without dropping a game in race wars the day prior to his ASL group.

Tbh I don't even think the maps were all that zerg favoured, with the exception of Benzene, or at least sponbbang stats do not show them to be Zerg favoured. Plasma, Ringing Bloom and Optimiser are all actually pretty bad for Zerg, statistically speaking. Unclear on Shakuras since sample sizes are very limited and Polypoid is somewhat neutral. I forget if there's any other maps in there, but I don't think this pool has been particularly great for Zerg personally.

I think largely Protoss players aren't really that strong overall at the moment. Bisu is great online, but kinda threw it in the group stages. Best and SnOw are good, but inconsistent and are both kind of let down by their PvZ. They also just simply did not perform as they are capable in the RO8 where they both got smashed 3-0 by Zergs, Best in particular was in a very good spot in a couple of those games.

Terran obviously suffered from FlaSh being random. Light fucked up in the group stages. Rush is strong vs P/Z, but ran into FlaSh. sOrry is performing well online but didn't perform as he can in ASL. Zerg has like 6 really strong and competitive players at this moment in time, I think they just have the greatest number of good players and that it is very little to do with the maps. There's just so much depth with Zerg players atm. Like the 6th best Zerg is a lot better than the 6th best Terran or Protoss imo. I actually do not think Queen is the best player in the world, AT ALL, despite winning 2 ASLs in a row. FlaSh is better if he just plays Terran, and I actually think Light has a higher peak than Queen also. Bisu is there or thereabouts when he performs to his ability. Last and Rain were also right up there too, but it seems they have quit and that also hurts T and P respectively.

Yea agree don't think Queen is the best in the world. Would also say Flash >>> Light > Queen, and think Rain/Last are also better when active. But don't think anyone else other than those 5 are particularly close.

Zerg definitely has more depth and strength like you said. The reason I thought the maps were good for Z were more so that they were good for ZvP -- I haven't watched much of Plasma, but man does ZvP seem lopsided there, quick lurker to kill the eggs just seemed to instantly kill every protoss player. Ringing Bloom seems like it should be pretty good for PvZ but then I just watched protosses get rekt over and over on it. Benzene super strong for zerg. The others all did seem relatively neutral. And had no opinions on ZvT TvZ.

Let's check sponbbang and see how Zerg favoured these maps are.

Filtering the maps to games played in 2020 only.

For 'average winrate' I just added up the win percentage from each map and divided by 7 to get an average winrate to avoid bias in terms of number of games played on each map.

Here is ZvP:
Polypoid - 951W 852L (52.7%)
Eclipse - 623W 523L (54.4%)
Optimizer - 226W 219L (50.8%)
Ringing Bloom - 175W 179L (49.4%)
Benzene - 159W 98L (61.9%)
Shakuras Temple - 133W 104L (56.1%)
Plasma - 10W 24L (29.4%)

Total - 2277W 1999L (53.3%)
Average winrate - 50.7%

Here is TvZ:
Polypoid - 1067W 795L (57.3%)
Eclipse - 583W 499L (53.9%)
Optimizer - 264W 132L (66.7%)
Ringing Bloom - 172W 123L (58.3%)
Benzene - 105W 135L (43.8%)
Shakuras Temple - 92W 59L (60.9%)
Plasma - 29W 12L (70.7%)

Total - 2313W 1755L (56.9%)
Average winrate - 58.8%

Here is PvT, to get a complete picture:
Polypoid - 619W 671L (48%)
Eclipse - 321W 322L (49.9%)
Optimizer - 149W 191L (43.8%)
Ringing Bloom - 164W 107L (60.5%)
Benzene - 94W 56L (62.7%)
Shakuras Temple - 87W 116L (42.9%)
Plasma - 18W 10L (64.3%)

Total - 1452W 1473L (49.6%)
Average winrate - 53.2%

I would call this a Terran favoured map pool really. On these maps T>Z is the most imbalanced matchup pretty much no matter how you slice it. Terran also very competitive vs Protoss, maybe even favoured depending on how you want to look at it. I think you could also make an argument to suggest Zerg is actually WEAKEST on these maps.

Optimizer and Shakuras are pretty hardcore Terran maps. Benzene is a pretty hardcore Zerg map. Plasma and Ringing Bloom are pretty hardcore Protoss maps. The other 2, Polypoid and Eclipse, are somewhat reasonable maps, although ZvT and PvZ are still difficult matchups to play on those maps. This map pool was just shit overall imo. Either that or we really need more innovation from players

wtf was this really a bad season comparatively? That's it I'm going back to binge watch everything I missed

Yeah I don't think it was overall a good season either tbh. Not very many close matchups or memorable games. Plus shit map pool. And a mirror matchup final. Only thing that really set this season apart is that FlaSh tried random

Maybe the Ps just shit the bed every time I watched them. Have probably seen like 5 different PvZ on Plasma and Protoss never made it to 15 minutes lol

I mean sample size on sponbbang for games played on Plasma is obviously tiny. When the pros first started playing the map Zerg was getting smashed. Best beat Queen 4:0 there that I saw on Queen's stream, and might have even been worse than that. With my limited Korean skills I could tell that Best felt very confident on that map vs Queen, and that Queen felt like he was fighting uphill. Somehow Best fucked up in the game that mattered though. His build was dogshit, trying to somehow go down every tech tree path at once. He knew Queen was all in, all he needed to do was continue making goons, add reaver and he would hold. Or he could have made more cannons near the eggs than the one he made. Action picked that map on ASL vs someone, maybe that was Best too, brought some proxy hatch build, killed a nexus and still lost lol... It might be that over time Zerg's have faired better there, but I'm still of the belief that it's a pretty big anti Zerg map.

On November 16 2020 02:02 Daut wrote: One of the least enjoyable seasons in recent memory, but still not too bad with some fun Flash random mixed in, but most of the games/series were just a little lopsided and the maps favored zerg a bit too much. Can't help but wonder how much different everything would have been if Light made it through. Light is absolutely wrecking people in the ultimate battle event, which is basically him playing a bo9 vs top protoss/terran players until he loses. I think he's won about 10 straight, and only person who came close was Soulkey. edit: Light has won 8 in a row: 7-2 hero 5-4 shuttle 7-2 larva 7-2 queen 5-4 best 5-4 soulkey 7-2 mini 6-3 snow Really impressive stuff.

Are those available somewhere?
Also why are they playing the full 9 games? If someone loses 0-5 its unlikely they will have their A game for the last 4 games

On November 17 2020 15:27 Spitfiree wrote: Show nested quote + On November 16 2020 02:02 Daut wrote: One of the least enjoyable seasons in recent memory, but still not too bad with some fun Flash random mixed in, but most of the games/series were just a little lopsided and the maps favored zerg a bit too much. Can't help but wonder how much different everything would have been if Light made it through. Light is absolutely wrecking people in the ultimate battle event, which is basically him playing a bo9 vs top protoss/terran players until he loses. I think he's won about 10 straight, and only person who came close was Soulkey. edit: Light has won 8 in a row: 7-2 hero 5-4 shuttle 7-2 larva 7-2 queen 5-4 best 5-4 soulkey 7-2 mini 6-3 snow Really impressive stuff. Are those available somewhere? Also why are they playing the full 9 games? If someone loses 0-5 its unlikely they will have their A game for the last 4 games

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCNymqCXr3sxL8dnmO_jScuA/videos

All of the vods available there. Look for anything ended Sc1-xx for the Ultimate Battle 9 game series. Latest one is Sc1-67 Light vs SnOw