[H] Building a desktop PC grindstation 9000

Here are the parts I am thinking of buying to put together a poker rig. I have no experience in building comps before but have just done a bit of reading around to find out what is what. I'd really like any feedback and advise I can get on this before I go ahead and start buying. Please also assume no knowledge and let me know if I've made some catastrophic mistakes like completely forgetting about a crucial part or getting bits that arent compatible.

My intended use will be mainly playing poker and heavily multitasking windows apps with a two-monitor setup including a 30inch (2560x1600) and a 20inch turned sideways (1200x1600), with also a light bit of gaming (just starcraft 2 when it comes out, nothing super demanding).


Case
Coolermaster Silver Stacker 831 - No PSU
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/128508

Power supply
Coolermaster Silent Pro 500W Modular PSU
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/147112

Motherboard
Asus P5Q3 DELUXE/WIFI-AP P45 Socket 775 8 channel audio ATX Motherboard With 2GB Ram
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/168085

Extra RAM
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/148818
Corsair 4GB (2x2GB) DDR3 1600MHz/PC3-12800 XMS3 DHX Memory Kit

So I have 6gb RAM in total:
2GB DDR3 1333 DUAL CHANNEL KIT that comes with the motherboard
and the above 4gb corsair DDR3 1600 kit

Processor
Intel Core 2 Quad Q9550 2.83GHz (FSB 1333MHz) Socket 775 L2 12MB Cache Retail Boxed
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/141515

CPU Cooler/heatsink (to replace the one that comes with the processor, as recommended by some guy's user review on that site)
Arctic Cooling AC-FRZ-7P Freezer 7 Pro Socket 775 Processor Cooler
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/105994

Graphics Card
XFX HD 4850 1GB DDR3 Dual DVI HDCP HDTV out PCI-E Graphics Card
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/168453

Hard Drive
Western Digital 1TB Hard Drive SATAII 32MB Cache - OEM Caviar Green
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/150245

DVD Drive
LG GH22NS40 22X SATA DVD±RW/DL/RAM Black Bare Drive - OEM
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/151999

An extra fan cause why not? (3 fans in total inc the 2 that come with case - should i get another one still??)
Antec TriCool 120mm DBB Case Fan
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/82253

Operating system
Microsoft Windows Vista Business w/SP1 - W/ Windows 7 Upgrade Offer Form - licence and media - 1 PC - OEM - DVD - 64-bit - English
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/167589


Comes to total of £826 which I am fairly happy with as I budgeted £1000 or under if possible before I started


Any glaring ommissions or suggestions for improvements? Is the RAM going to be OK? There are 4 DIMM slots on the motherboard so I was thinking I'd put the two 1333MHz 1GBs that come with the motherboard on first on separate channels, installing the OS and then adding the pair of 2GB corsairs in the 2 remaining DIMM slots and getting them set up in the BIOS. This would work right? I am assuming 500W PSU should be plenty, am I okay with 3 case fans total? My case has room for NINE 120mm fans but I don't want to overdo it due to noise issues. Maybe I should get 4-5 total?

Again thanks in advance for any feedback you experts can give on this (help me locoooooooo!!!!!)

eh, i don't have time to go over it all right now but i might later. just know that you cannot (well you can, but it's highly unrecommended) mix two different brands of ram together. and not only that those have different default clocks. either get the same that comes with the mobo or ditch it and get the corsair.

and just from real quick observations: i'd go for a corsair PSU and an nvidia video card

ah ok tys

as far as ram goes I think that 4gb will do for you exactly what 6 would do.

For sure drop the mobo packaged ram and get 2 sets of those 4gb corsairs, I find 8gb ram is a must if you're running vista. Personally had some issues with the WD caviar green series including 2 dead on arrivals and one that lasted little over 60days, would suggest a seagate barracuda series in it's place.

noted, thanks. 8gb ram does sound pretty ballin and i certainly dont want hard drives that dont work!

On September 01 2009 12:24 CrownRoyal wrote: as far as ram goes I think that 4gb will do for you exactly what 6 would do.

hmm actually yes you may be right, I read on 2+2 that for decently heavy poker use 4gb is the 'sweet spot'

You can get by on 4gb for just poker but you said you would be multitasking/lite gaming as well which would bump you into the 8gb range

im really not qualified to talk in this thread and will probably get owned because im so 2002 with my computer nerd knowledge. BUT as far as i know there is almost no circumstance where you need 6gb of ram or more, but im pretty sure notsorry has built even more computers with better knowledge than i have and he is saying go for 8, so wait for someone to refute what i said or reassure you.

Well it isn't like you can't just buy an extra 4gb set a week later if you find yourself taxing out your system, so it's really a personal choice. I use 8gb because I go over 55% when playing a game while watching movies and ram is so cheap these days just figure why not.

4gb ram is totally fine
i have 8gb and it gives me some peace of mind knowing im very rarely gonna use that much (i have several times though)

the only reason to get 6gb right now is if youre going for the new corei7 type build. 4gb is plenty of vista. I have a vista box that runs Crysis, Farcry2, Fallout3, all the latest games just fine on 4gb. Certainly not any less though. 8gb is massive overkill even for multi-tasking. Im at work right now so Ill take a stab at the build too. Ultimately its not horribly wrong or anything, if you put this together it will boot. Just a few mismatched parts that dont compliment each other very well, possible bottlenecking etc.

people are very confused about RAM in this day and age. they don't understand the major difference between how XP and Vista manages ram. let's just say very briefly that you cannot have too much ram with Vista 64-bit. it makes use of superfetch and will preload applications in memory, which means that the more memory you have, the faster everything will load. if xp 32-bit could handle 8gb of ram, it would not be able to utilize more than half of it, but vista will always use most of it, and freeing it up whenever necessary. it will also make you be able to make only a very small pagefile on your hard drive (if any) so that ram is used instead of hard drive cache (ram is extremely faster).

if we consider the cheap price of RAM nowadays it's pretty much a no brainer for all new builds with vista 64 to get 8gb ram

i run everything fine on vista with 2gig ddr 3, so 4 will be plenty imo but if you find yourself somehow needing more its very easy to ship and stick some more in

the only people who will ever say "its not necessary to get more than X amount of RAM" are either running xp or are running vista 64 but never upgraded their RAM to test it themselves.

the difference was like night and day for me going from 4 to 8. everything runs smoothly with 4gb but if you want a good experience of vista that's the strict minimum if you ask me.

hmm maybe i should buy another stick to throw in my laptop, i'm curious.

On September 01 2009 12:52 Loco wrote: people are very confused about RAM in this day and age. they don't understand the major difference between how XP and Vista manages ram. let's just say very briefly that you cannot have too much ram with Vista 64-bit. it makes use of superfetch and will preload applications in memory, which means that the more memory you have, the faster everything will load. if xp 32-bit could handle 8gb of ram, it would not be able to utilize more than half of it, but vista will always use most of it, and freeing it up whenever necessary. it will also make you be able to make only a very small pagefile on your hard drive (if any) so that ram is used instead of hard drive cache (ram is extremely faster). if we consider the cheap price of RAM nowadays it's pretty much a no brainer for all new builds with vista 64 to get 8gb ram

Sounds like a direct quote from an Anandtech review, but I strongly agree with it

idk a lot about this but wouldnt it be sexy to get a 10k rpm hdd to use for vista + programs?

that's so sick.

vista the programs i use most preloaded into the ram for quicker load times??? And when it needs to close out of those programs for more ram it does it its self?

If your planning to use this setup for 2+ yrs u should scratch the quad core and go with the i7. I'm running on Q9550 right now but after toying with i7 last week i'm sold

wtf, if your gonna get a 64 bit processor/64 bit version of windows why wouldn't you get 6 + gigs of ram?

and wtf is with that graphics card -.- get ati or nvidia please ^^

seems like more than a grindstation you want an all purpose computer with some gaming capabilities. in which case this is fine. (if u wanted a computer to only play poker, it would cost u like 200-300 bucks -.-)

On September 01 2009 13:18 jasper5408 wrote: wtf, if your gonna get a 64 bit processor/64 bit version of windows why wouldn't you get 6 + gigs of ram? and wtf is with that graphics card -.- get ati or nvidia please ^^ seems like more than a grindstation you want an all purpose computer with some gaming capabilities. in which case this is fine. (if u wanted a computer to only play poker, it would cost u like 200-300 bucks -.-)

30" monitors tend to require good gfx cards

a look at the i7 line wouldn't be a half bad idea either, altho there is a considerable price jump in both mobo and cpu if you don't plan on upgrading for a few years

yeah i did think about i7ing it up but saw the price jump and thought sticking with quadzilla for now is best due to:
- still looks like solid processing power for much more reasonable cost
- im happy to overclock its nuts off
- im happy to upgrade to i7 without delay when the time becomes right

sounds reasonable?

jasper the card is an ati lol... different manufacturers make ati and nvidia cards

and interesting info on the ram, i get kinda annoyed with my current laptop being slow and struggling sometimes, i really like the idea of a comp that will just take everything i throw at it effortlessly and manage with tons of heavy multitasking going on all at once without breaking much of a sweat so 8gb it is i think

I'd suggest getting 2 500gb hd's, if u ever have to reinstall ur operating system it makes it super ez

Or an external hd

Already got an external hd with a ton of stuff on it m8

On September 01 2009 12:48 NewbSaibot wrote: the only reason to get 6gb right now is if youre going for the new corei7 type build. 4gb is plenty of vista. I have a vista box that runs Crysis, Farcry2, Fallout3, all the latest games just fine on 4gb. Certainly not any less though. 8gb is massive overkill even for multi-tasking. Im at work right now so Ill take a stab at the build too. Ultimately its not horribly wrong or anything, if you put this together it will boot. Just a few mismatched parts that dont compliment each other very well, possible bottlenecking etc.

plz tell me more about the mismatched parts that dont compliment and possible bottlenecking. this is exactly the sort of feedback i need before i do it!

oh weird, that must be a uk thing -.-

all i can say is if your planning on getting 64bit version of windows i like 6 gb, if you're getting 32bit, 3gb is the max the computer can use
-if you have good experience with overclocking, u should def look into i7

are u planning on overclocking ram/gpu?

SSD harddisk for sure, improves performance way more than any other component, prob the intel x25 is the way to go!
harddisk will be the bottleneck otherwise

The man asked for advice, not for everyone's two cents. I understand you mean well, but if you do not recognize one of the largest video card manufacturing brands in the world or if you have not built a computer in the last two years then I don't think you should be giving advice to someone trying to build an efficient machine right now.

As for the HDD, I would go smaller x2 as it seems once you make the jump to 1TB+, failure rates go through the roof regardless of what brand/model hard drive you're using. Since you set a higher budget, you should go with a solid state drive for your OS and other vital apps and then just get a WD 640gb drive for internal storage?

Also, definitely purchase matching RAM kits (I'm with Loco at 8gb) and make sure your motherboard plays nice with the brand that you choose.

I don't think the i7 is worth the price hike, nor is a more expensive video card for what you want to do. (The 4850 is one of the greatest [now] entry-level priced cards ever)

With that said, you should be good to go with a great (big)bang for the buck machine.

On September 01 2009 18:42 jasper5408 wrote: oh weird, that must be a uk thing -.- all i can say is if your planning on getting 64bit version of windows i like 6 gb, if you're getting 32bit, 3gb is the max the computer can use -if you have good experience with overclocking, u should def look into i7 are u planning on overclocking ram/gpu?

why do you like 6gb over 8gb?

thanks deezy, looking into different hdd options now.

I posted my proposed build on a uk computer building community and they gave me the feedback I should just stick with DDR2 memory for now since theres a price hike for ddr3 (and id save money on a p45 mobo for ddr2 memory) and if im gonna upgrade to i7 in a couple years i should just wait till then to go ddr3 when it becomes cheaper and faster

I'm now looking at this mobo/memory combo:

Asus P5Q Deluxe P45 Socket 775 8 Channel Audio ATX Motherboard
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/145748

Corsair 4GB (2x2GB) DDR2 800MHz/PC2-6400 XMS2 DHX Memory Kit Non-ECC Unbuffered CL5
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/140132

thoughts on that?

Also holy crap solid state drives seem expensive. How much space do you think I'd need for the OS, frequently used progs, HEM and potentially large HEM databases? Anything else I'd wanna put on the SSD? And I notice SSD drives are 2.5 inch SATA whereas harddrives would be 3.5 inch SATA, they'd still just fit on the regular SATA slots on the mobo right?

edit: scratch that, SSD seems overkill. Gonna go for this,
Western Digital WD3000HLFS 300GB Hard Drive SATAII 10000rpm 16MB Cache - OEM WD VelociRaptor
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/149435

I was going to recommend the velociraptor. It's a smarter decision for now, SSD are still too expensive, although I'm sure they are really impressive. I own that same velociraptor and it's fast enough.

I also like the idea of getting DDR2 ram, it's very cheap for not that big of a difference and you can upgrade the whole build later. 8GB of corsair DDR2 is a good choice. I'd try to find higher clocks than 800MHz though, even though they generally can be overclocked to 1000Mhz easily.
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/146918

nice, decided on the raptor then. but lol that memory you linked is very much in ddr3 price territory, it would feel wrong getting that haha. is Crucial a good memory brand? I was thinking of getting this memory

Crucial 4GB (2X2GB) DDR2 800MHz/PC2-6400 Ballistix Memory CL4 2.0V
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/143844

Also the mobo I linked before (my second mobo choice) is now out of stock so here's my third candidate for mobo:
ASUS P5Q SE iP45 Socket 775 8 channel audio ATX Motherboard
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/150285

decently cheaper than the other two I was looking at, I suspect this may be exactly the right mobo for me and I was looking at ones that had too much for my uses prior to this.

I'm hoping to have stuff finalised and ordered in a few hours so I can get it all delivered tomorrow (friday) in time for weekend grinding. So one last blat of final feedback on everything I have would be massively appreciated, i'll post the finalised list of everything im getting in one post in a little bit

Final(????) build proposal


Coolermaster HAF 932 Full Tower Case - High Air Flow Design - No PSU
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/148685
Splashing out here, but the case is the one thing that won't need replacing in future upgrades so I figure why not

Coolermaster Silent Pro 500W Modular PSU
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/147112

ASUS P5Q PRO Turbo iP45 Socket 775 8 -Channel Audio ATX Motherboard
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/165395

Crucial 4GB (2X2GB) DDR2 800MHz/PC2-6400 Ballistix Memory CL4 2.0V
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/143844
two of these

Intel Core 2 Quad Q9550 2.83GHz (FSB 1333MHz) Socket 775 L2 12MB Cache Retail Boxed
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/141515

Arctic Cooling AC-FRZ-7P Freezer 7 Pro Socket 775 Processor Cooler
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/105994

XFX HD 4850 1GB DDR3 Dual DVI HDCP HDTV out PCI-E Graphics Card
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/168453

Western Digital WD3000HLFS 300GB Hard Drive SATAII 10000rpm 16MB Cache - OEM WD VelociRaptor
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/149435

LG GH22NS40 22X SATA DVD±RW/DL/RAM Black Bare Drive - OEM
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/151999

Microsoft Windows Vista Business w/SP1 - W/ Windows 7 Upgrade Offer Form - licence and media - 1 PC - OEM - DVD - 64-bit - English
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/167589




Let Us GoGoGoGoGoGo?

crucial ballistix is good stuff.

dont know anything about that mobo. wouldn't expect to get great overclocking result with it.

definitely would pick a corsair PSU... so reliable and 450W from a corsair is more efficient than 500 from coolermaster
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/152606

rest looks cool

cable management with a modular PSU is also a charm.

The mobo seems solid and supposedly has tons of good overclocking options, a sicko with 30k posts on a uk building forum recommended it to me as a step up from a more basic model I was looking at. Also the PSU efficiency is quoted at 85% for both PSUs and 450W might be cutting it a little fine esp if i decide to add stuff.. my calculated 'estimated' wattage atm is at 412W I believe.

On September 01 2009 12:01 Ket wrote:...Operating system Microsoft Windows Vista...

Don't. Stick to XP till W7 is ready.

Hm interesting choice of grafic card.
might do well for you in case u only need it for poker + sc2

However a XFX 4890 is an average of 40% faster in video games + only costs 65£ more
It can probably play every upcomming game of the next 2 years in good/medium quality

I just mention this cause i am really surprised u talk about overclocking options of the motherboard

On September 02 2009 08:27 anheway wrote: Show nested quote + On September 01 2009 12:01 Ket wrote:...Operating system Microsoft Windows Vista... Don't. Stick to XP till W7 is ready.

I hear so many vista haters all around.


I myself got Vista64 SP1 some month ago being a Windows XP 32 bit user for 4 years.
I yet fail to notice how Vista is worse than XP.

I had some problems with 32bit drivers at first (Logitech MX310mouse, D-Link Network adapter,some older software) ... but they all could get fixed with the help of the Internetz.

Recent Benchmarks of different hardware magazines have shown that Vista64 sp1 is on average only 1% slower in Video games than XP 32 ( Which means difference will be 0,3 - 2 fps maximum)

other than that Vista 64 runs smooth for me and looks nice

On September 02 2009 07:41 Ket wrote: The mobo seems solid and supposedly has tons of good overclocking options, a sicko with 30k posts on a uk building forum recommended it to me as a step up from a more basic model I was looking at. Also the PSU efficiency is quoted at 85% for both PSUs and 450W might be cutting it a little fine esp if i decide to add stuff.. my calculated 'estimated' wattage atm is at 412W I believe.

trust me these estimations are bs. i ran my $3k machine with that power supply when i had only one video card.

On September 02 2009 08:34 PplusAD wrote: Hm interesting choice of grafic card. might do well for you in case u only need it for poker + sc2 However a XFX 4890 is an average of 40% faster in video games + only costs 65£ more It can probably play every upcomming game of the next 2 years in good/medium quality I just mention this cause i am really surprised u talk about overclocking options of the motherboard

i dont think im ever gonna get into gaming though, too much of a time waste. gfx card i just want something that runs sc2, plays movies and handles lots of monitor space so i cant really justify anything better than what i have, even what i have may be too much and 512gb may have been ok for my needs perhaps

Okay taken delivery of all the bits, tyvm for all the help in here, much appreciated. Will build later today and hopefully be posting on lp from it by the end of the day

hf hf I hope it rules, messing around on a fast new computer feels so good hahaha /sick nerding

hehe ty... sickest nerding idd

haha
gl hf

OT: i ve got vista for 9 month and i basically only installed pokersoft + msn + 3 games and some codecs and its starting up slower and slower, i obv run defragmentation, comodo system cleaner and clear startup registry every but its not helping

i recommend the intel i7, esp if ur using vista or windows 7
with at least 6gb ram, so you can run it in triple channel
a solid state HD, or 2x velociraptors (10k rpm) http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136322

if you already got the parts, gl

Thanks a lot for the help all, I just got the stuff delivered today and damn near took the best part of the day building it. Everything went fairly smoothly except now im having a big problem getting it working with all 4 DIMMs in place. It works fine with just one dimm in there but when I try to put two or four there are problems and vista won't start, will just give some brief blue screen error while loading up and reboot. is there something obvious im missing that im supposed to be doing here when i add more memory so that vista wont bugger up? thanks in advance for any help on this, v frustrating when im so so close to getting it all put together but just cant quite seem to complete it and use all my ram.

fwiw i got this mobo
ASUS P5Q PRO Turbo iP45 Socket 775 8 -Channel Audio ATX Motherboard
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/165395/show_product_overview

and two of this RAM (4 DIMMs total)
Crucial 4GB (2X2GB) DDR2 800MHz/PC2-6400 Ballistix Memory CL4 2.0V
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/143844

it cant be that 4 dimms total is somehow 'too much' for my mobo because it doesnt even work when I use two dimms in slot 1 and 3 (matching colour like its supposed to be done)

wtf help how do you install more ram and not have epic fail ensue. is there some tinkering youre supposed to in the bios or something, the bios does recognise its installed not sure what else i can do, then when i try to boot windows, errors

After a quick google around, try disabling the 'Legacy USB Support' in the BIOS. If that fails to work, twiddle around with bios settings a little bit.

source:
http://social.technet.microsoft.com/F.../17320679-1a2e-4e76-87c0-e830aeb024bc

the other thing you could try is booting vista with each individual stick of ram and see if it boots, if one crashes/fails or something perhaps theres a problem with that stick.

Several things. First of all, wait a few weeks because the next generation of video cards is about to launch from ATI, which will introduce great new options, or at the very least drive the price of current crop of video cards down. Additionally, since you have a 30" screen, I would guess you need a beefier video card to run SC2 with all perks turned on. So I would go with at least HD4890 or GTX275 or GTX285 from NVIDIA. They are not too expensive, and you are probably going to be glad you have that with the screen that size. I know since I use a 30" too.

I would also opt to build a Core i7 system over the last generation Core 2 Quad. It should come out to almost same price with the parts you got picked out. The new processor is a lot better.

Also Windows 7 is about to launch in October, so I would strongly consider waiting for that. It's supposed to be far superior to Vista.

Check out some recent guides from www.anandtech.com for a better idea of what parts you should be looking at. As is, I really don't think you have a very good build.

Ket,

You may have to go into your BIOS settings and verify that your timings/voltage are set correctly. Not to mention you may have to manually set the sticks to run in dual-channel mode if they aren't by default.

I would simply visit the official forums for your mobo/ram and post your setup and explain your case. Hopefully someone more familiar with your hardware can post any recommended settings that can help you get up and running. Fairly often there is a hardware guru waiting to walk you through it for the sake of being helpful.

I've just 99% worked out it's a motherboard problem. Here's what I found: 1 stick of ram in the first slot runs fine no matter which of my 4 sticks I use (ok i was too lazy to try them all but was going to before I found this problem). using two sticks in dimm slots 1 and 3 fails no matter which two i use even though both the sticks work individually when I boot with just that one stick in slot 1. then I tried loading up with just one stick in slot 3 and it failed with the same bsods making me think theres something wrong with slot 3 on the mobo?. I tried with just one stick in slot 2 to make sure it doesnt just dislike having a single stick in a diff slot to slot 1 (motherboard manual says I should be able to install just 1 stick in any slot i like anyway) and that works fine. I tried out booting up with two sticks in slots 2 and 4 incase it was just slot 3 that was working but that failed. One stick in slot 4 failed. So it seems to be that the only thing that works is one stick in slot 1 or 2 implying perhaps slots 3 and 4 on the mobo are somehow faulty? Based on my findings here I was thinking of getting a replacement mobo from ebuyer seeing if i fare any better with a fresh one. Thoughts on this?

get a power supply much larger than 500W!

I had a 500W one that seemed to work fine until I started to play fallout 3 (which actually demanded full use of my graphics cards). Normally, my graphics card uses like 30W or so when idle, but it bumped up to 150W and my power supply blew out!

I think i have a 800W one now and all works fine. I'd say settle on all the parts you want, then find out how much power everything demands and get a power supply that's 100W or so more than that. yeehaw