Truth Discussion Time - Page 48

seems to be a divide between virgin coconut oil and coconut oil, even in the picture loco linked. That's consistent with what I've heard myself, when people talk about coconut oil as healthy, they're talking about virgin. And people used to live significantly shorter lives than they do nowadays, that 'people survived' eating something isn't evidence of it being healthy, it merely proves that it's not highly toxic.

400 grams of 'carbs' being the problem also sounds meaningless to me. That can be white bread, sugar, rice, or sweet potato. Western diets don't suffer from people eating too much of the latter two.

"American government says butter is bad" I already told you many times in this thread how much their advice is worth. There are too many conflicting interests. And especially in USA... I dont know what USA governmemt DID NOT manager to fuck up yet, but im sure advice on nutrition were not spared. So yeah, I'll take the 1400 studies on coconut oil over Donald Trump and the dumbest government in the worlds word, sorry Loco. NOT convinced !!

On October 10 2017 01:26 Liquid`Drone wrote: seems to be a divide between virgin coconut oil and coconut oil, even in the picture loco linked. That's consistent with what I've heard myself, when people talk about coconut oil as healthy, they're talking about virgin. And people used to live significantly shorter lives than they do nowadays, that 'people survived' eating something isn't evidence of it being healthy, it merely proves that it's not highly toxic. 400 grams of 'carbs' being the problem also sounds meaningless to me. That can be white bread, sugar, rice, or sweet potato. Western diets don't suffer from people eating too much of the latter two.

1. They found tribes that live as long as us without modern medicine. 2. Modern medicine... 3. Hygiene.. doctors didnt even wash their hands before... everyone died.... Why dont you look at nutrition like you review your ranges in HEM ? The only thing we increased after obese epidemic started was out intake of carbs. Protein same, fat same. Statistical fact.. ! The guy you know that eats steak and potatoes, he probably eats a lot healthier than the average Norwegian.

I've never reviewed any ranges in HEM. My nutritional opinion is really simplistic, I don't understand why people are complicating stuff so much, because it all seems fairly straight forward and obvious..

Basically, plant based is the healthiest. But adding some smallish quantities of lean meat or fatty fish doesn't really hurt, fatty fish can even be downright healthy (although it's possible to get the same nutrients through just plants). White bread is bad. Whole grain or pumpernickel or whatever is good. Portions are super important. Cheese is obviously bad, but so tasty that I don't care. Exercise is really important - the sedentary lifestyle of the western man seems to be as big of a health issue as the diet is, although the diet is probably easier to fix in an increasingly automated society. (Back when I was a full time hard manual worker, I could eat huge quantities of whatever I wanted. Did not gain weight. ) Butter isn't healthy, but it's not necessarily a big deal to use not too big quantities of it. Obviously olive oil is better though. Every vegan I know is slim and healthy - but I don't know if they are significantly healthier than people who cut the meat consumption to 10% of average western meat consumption, those 90% seems highly beneficial though.

Also, I've honestly never heard of any tribes where the life expectancy or average life span is even close to the 85-90 you find in the healthiest regions of the world, but I'm incredibly curious, so please tell me about them. But even so, I'm quite certain they don't eat a lot of butter, and I'd be surprised to see them eat a lot of eggs, and I'm even more certain they live incredibly active lives, and while not all aspects of diet can be regulated through exercise, I'm also confident a lot of aspects can be. (Although, as my post above mentions, I'd be curious if anyone actually knows what aspects can, or rather, can't, be influenced. Like obviously obesity is less of a problem for someone who runs 10km every day, but I guess you might be equally prone to red-meat-triggered cancer?)

Cheese is obviously good, i ate a lot of it on my diet and I only got healthier. Butter has a lot of important vitamin + anti cancer/anti tumor that u otherwise only find in coconut oil and breastmilk... Margarin most vitamins are destroyed in the process to make it. Margarin was originally not ment as food to be consumed for Humans... I know vegans til and they have a lot of problems, fe with their skin. They are not getting a lot of the important B vitamins in their diet, even with supplyments.

I think I've thought of a compromise. I can go vegetarian trending towards vegan. I think vegan is just too extreme for me. If I am in a time pinch I can still grab a black bean burrito even if it has cheese in it. I can have a chocolate croissant for breakfast. I can grab a margherita pizza at work. I can have some ice cream. It's not like I need to have these things all of the time or even most of the time but other times I can find myself at a restaurant with just nothing vegan unless I order just vegetables off the menu which I never actually want to do. It's funny Loco you posted that interview of that moderate guy and I think that is really where I am at. Ideally I eat vegan but it just seems like too much of a strain and inconvenience. Vegetarian trending towards vegan seems more doable and it is certainly better than a Southern diet.

The article is up on forskning.no. The tribes live on a "hunter and gather" diet.

On October 10 2017 01:56 Liquid`Drone wrote: I've never reviewed any ranges in HEM. My nutritional opinion is really simplistic, I don't understand why people are complicating stuff so much, because it all seems fairly straight forward and obvious.. Basically, plant based is the healthiest. But adding some smallish quantities of lean meat or fatty fish doesn't really hurt, fatty fish can even be downright healthy (although it's possible to get the same nutrients through just plants). White bread is bad. Whole grain or pumpernickel or whatever is good. Portions are super important. Cheese is obviously bad, but so tasty that I don't care. Exercise is really important - the sedentary lifestyle of the western man seems to be as big of a health issue as the diet is, although the diet is probably easier to fix in an increasingly automated society. (Back when I was a full time hard manual worker, I could eat huge quantities of whatever I wanted. Did not gain weight. ) Butter isn't healthy, but it's not necessarily a big deal to use not too big quantities of it. Obviously olive oil is better though. Every vegan I know is slim and healthy - but I don't know if they are significantly healthier than people who cut the meat consumption to 10% of average western meat consumption, those 90% seems highly beneficial though. Also, I've honestly never heard of any tribes where the life expectancy or average life span is even close to the 85-90 you find in the healthiest regions of the world, but I'm incredibly curious, so please tell me about them. But even so, I'm quite certain they don't eat a lot of butter, and I'd be surprised to see them eat a lot of eggs, and I'm even more certain they live incredibly active lives, and while not all aspects of diet can be regulated through exercise, I'm also confident a lot of aspects can be. (Although, as my post above mentions, I'd be curious if anyone actually knows what aspects can, or rather, can't, be influenced. Like obviously obesity is less of a problem for someone who runs 10km every day, but I guess you might be equally prone to red-meat-triggered cancer?)

Why is white bread bad?

On October 10 2017 02:06 VanDerMeyde wrote: Cheese is obviously good, i ate a lot of it on my diet and I only got healthier. Butter has a lot of important vitamin + anti cancer/anti tumor that u otherwise only find in coconut oil and breastmilk... Margarin most vitamins are destroyed in the process to make it. Margarin was originally not ment as food to be consumed for Humans... I know vegans til and they have a lot of problems, fe with their skin. They are not getting a lot of the important B vitamins in their diet, even with supplyments.

Losing weight does not just automatically mean healthy. You can eat cheese and lose weight. That does not mean it is healthy. Dairy is even worse than meat that has not been fried or blackened.

because it raises bloodsugar levels way too high, no fiber, little nutritional value... And you are hungry again very quickly. Most restaurants found their customers will eat more if they serve some free white bread before their food arrive

Yes, losing weight when obese without gastric bypass, any drugs or ruining my body in any way is healthy. My diet is superhealthy and my great resultats does not disprove that ROFL

On October 10 2017 01:16 VanDerMeyde wrote: Use some common sense for christ sake. If eggs and meat were harmfull foods our ancestors would not survive and we would not be here. 400 grams of carbs per day in the western diet is the reason for out health our problems

You are preaching the paleo/keto gospel bro. The cult would be proud. That image that talks about the Southern diet is what the problem is. If you look at my blood work where it is actually good I ate mostly carbohydrates.

You can call it whatever you want. I builded my own ranges. GTO. Maybe one day you will understand that this extreme high carb nonsense doesnt make any sense

On October 10 2017 02:10 RiKD wrote: Show nested quote + On October 10 2017 01:56 Liquid`Drone wrote: I've never reviewed any ranges in HEM. My nutritional opinion is really simplistic, I don't understand why people are complicating stuff so much, because it all seems fairly straight forward and obvious.. Basically, plant based is the healthiest. But adding some smallish quantities of lean meat or fatty fish doesn't really hurt, fatty fish can even be downright healthy (although it's possible to get the same nutrients through just plants). White bread is bad. Whole grain or pumpernickel or whatever is good. Portions are super important. Cheese is obviously bad, but so tasty that I don't care. Exercise is really important - the sedentary lifestyle of the western man seems to be as big of a health issue as the diet is, although the diet is probably easier to fix in an increasingly automated society. (Back when I was a full time hard manual worker, I could eat huge quantities of whatever I wanted. Did not gain weight. ) Butter isn't healthy, but it's not necessarily a big deal to use not too big quantities of it. Obviously olive oil is better though. Every vegan I know is slim and healthy - but I don't know if they are significantly healthier than people who cut the meat consumption to 10% of average western meat consumption, those 90% seems highly beneficial though. Also, I've honestly never heard of any tribes where the life expectancy or average life span is even close to the 85-90 you find in the healthiest regions of the world, but I'm incredibly curious, so please tell me about them. But even so, I'm quite certain they don't eat a lot of butter, and I'd be surprised to see them eat a lot of eggs, and I'm even more certain they live incredibly active lives, and while not all aspects of diet can be regulated through exercise, I'm also confident a lot of aspects can be. (Although, as my post above mentions, I'd be curious if anyone actually knows what aspects can, or rather, can't, be influenced. Like obviously obesity is less of a problem for someone who runs 10km every day, but I guess you might be equally prone to red-meat-triggered cancer?) Why is white bread bad?

I have no idea but it seems like the overwhelming consensus among people who do know.

On October 10 2017 02:17 VanDerMeyde wrote: Yes, losing weight when obese without gastric bypass, any drugs or ruining my body in any way is healthy. My diet is superhealthy and my great resultats does not disprove that ROFL

Ok, by that definition it is "healthy" but you technically could have done that eating bacon. It would be silly to say eating a straight bacon diet is healthy even if you lost 200 lbs. Paleo/keto is not the only choice. What disproves your beliefs is many peer reviewed studies not backed by corporations. There is also anecdotal evidence in the form of "blue zone" areas.

My range is eating moderate protein. I doubt you would get my results and win 20bb/100 in poker by eating bacon only diet. My brain works better than ever and im getting in super good shape. I think my results speak for itself

On October 10 2017 02:08 VanDerMeyde wrote: The article is up on forskning.no. The tribes live on a "hunter and gather" diet.

I've read a lot about hunter-gatherer societies. I've never seen any historian claim that hunter-gatherer had life expectancies or average living ages that are even remotely close to the 85+ you see in particularly healthy current day societies. Yes, there's a lot of stuff indicating that the agrarian revolution was bad for health, that's not the same as hunter-gatherer tribes lived as long as people do today. (I mean, greek philosophers also lived until they were 80, so sure, there were individuals. But individuals are irrelevant, there are also individuals who smoke and drink and eat whatever who live cancer free lives as 95 year olds. )

You did not read the article, you have to scroll down a bit to find it, couple of days old

On October 10 2017 02:22 VanDerMeyde wrote: You can call it whatever you want. I builded my own ranges. GTO. Maybe one day you will understand that this extreme high carb nonsense doesnt make any sense

Of course extreme high carbs doesn't make sense. If people are eating candy and sweetened drinks that is obviously not good. I was doing pretty well eating less than 100 carbs a day so I thought. Then my blood work comes back pretty bad. Heart disease and cancers are the future for low carbers. Of course heart disease and cancers are the future for most. You obviously aren't going to change what has seemingly worked so well for you unless given a reason to. There are reasons written in papers. The studies on Adventists are really enough.

On October 10 2017 02:34 RiKD wrote: Show nested quote + On October 10 2017 02:22 VanDerMeyde wrote: You can call it whatever you want. I builded my own ranges. GTO. Maybe one day you will understand that this extreme high carb nonsense doesnt make any sense Of course extreme high carbs doesn't make sense. If people are eating candy and sweetened drinks that is obviously not good. I was doing pretty well eating less than 100 carbs a day so I thought. Then my blood work comes back pretty bad. Heart disease and cancers are the future for low carbers. Of course heart disease and cancers are the future for most. You obviously aren't going to change what has seemingly worked so well for you unless given a reason to. There are reasons written in papers. The studies on Adventists are really enough.

They call it "Western diseases" for a good reason RikD.. Western diseases are not the future for me most likely ofc. Those diseases are from western diets. Western diet is not GTO so i dont eat it. Complain all u want..lot of those diseases were not know until 15-20 years after Coca cola and those companies hit the market. Which makes sense, it takes about 20 years to ruin your heart with a bad diet. But low carbers must eat a lot of vegetables/ salads and moderate protein.