Cause they give in to weakness and fear that's why. Standard human behaviour that won't ever change, that's why the global leader cycle probably won't ever end as well. It sure as hell isn't a rational decision. Obviously racism is not a factor there, they just want to pick an option that would make them feel safe. Tbh between Hilary and Trump I don't see such option, but w/e, one is an idiot the other is a criminal.
@whamm its normal, the BRexit will negatively affect global political and economical conjuncture, why would anyone be happy about it.
A new referendum probably won't happen as that can go in a never ending cycle as Farage said e.g. BRemain wins 51-49% next, and repeat.Then again Farage is well aware that if the vote is repeated BRexit wont win. And If N.Ireland and Scotland go independent the UK's economy will suffer hard. I don't see any volunteers to trigger article 50 as well
@qwerty Was a post by an english guy, the majority election system they use is kind of messy to me and a bunch of stuff make no sense, seems to be working fine for them though.
@cariadon you are a weak individual, that only talks crap and never backs his words with shit, pretty pathetic and usually not worth the time spent answering even
On June 26 2016 05:56 JohnnyBologna wrote:
im guessing most the people that voted out are unhappy or tired of their miserable lives and wanted change. either that or they were tired of the EUs crap. kinda like how trump is with america lol. the irony of this world
Yeah I think people trend to project their life projections and simply vote for something drastically new, the sentiment is usually exploited by demagoges from the far extremes of the political espectrum, the crazy left in latin america with people like Chavez, and in the 1st world they are spiraling to a cycle of far right with Trump and in a future Europe
And why do you think people suddenly started to vote for Trump, SD, Marine Le Pen etc etc all over the western world ?
People suddenly got racist over night ?
No, many people are fed up with the regressive left, many are tired of political correctness, third wave feminism, many are reasonably concerned about immigration but their leaders do not engage in these conversations, their voices silenced and bunched up together with bigots, racist etc like has happened to Sam Harris of Richard Dawkings, so all these reasonable people are so frustrated that they are willing to vote for the demagoges, and ironically end up bunching themselves with the bigots.
Thats the reason why the right is gaining momentum in the 1st world, and the last time the extreme right got a hold of the 1st world the biggest war we have seen erupted, I think we are in general past that, but who knows despise being a misanthropist I often underestimate peoples stupidity.
Harris is strongly for Hillary Baal, he hates the idea of Trump actually. He went on Rogan the last time and talked a good solid hour on why nobody should vote Trump. It was one of the best podcasts of rogan and lasted 4 hours 30minutes and had over 4million downloads. Sometimes when you go against the left these days they expect you to be right wing on every issue (coz most leftists now are like that) which is the problem I see with them.
On June 26 2016 10:25 Spitfiree wrote:
Cause they give in to weakness and fear that's why. Standard human behaviour that won't ever change, that's why the global leader cycle probably won't ever end as well. It sure as hell isn't a rational decision. Obviously racism is not a factor there, they just want to pick an option that would make them feel safe. Tbh between Hilary and Trump I don't see such option, but w/e, one is an idiot the other is a criminal.
@whamm its normal, the BRexit will negatively affect global political and economical conjuncture, why would anyone be happy about it.
A new referendum probably won't happen as that can go in a never ending cycle as Farage said e.g. BRemain wins 51-49% next, and repeat.Then again Farage is well aware that if the vote is repeated BRexit wont win. And If N.Ireland and Scotland go independent the UK's economy will suffer hard. I don't see any volunteers to trigger article 50 as well
@qwerty Was a post by an english guy, the majority election system they use is kind of messy to me and a bunch of stuff make no sense, seems to be working fine for them though.
@cariadon you are a weak individual, that only talks crap and never backs his words with shit, pretty pathetic and usually not worth the time spent answering even
On June 26 2016 05:56 JohnnyBologna wrote:
im guessing most the people that voted out are unhappy or tired of their miserable lives and wanted change. either that or they were tired of the EUs crap. kinda like how trump is with america lol. the irony of this world
Yeah I think people trend to project their life projections and simply vote for something drastically new, the sentiment is usually exploited by demagoges from the far extremes of the political espectrum, the crazy left in latin america with people like Chavez, and in the 1st world they are spiraling to a cycle of far right with Trump and in a future Europe
And why do you think people suddenly started to vote for Trump, SD, Marine Le Pen etc etc all over the western world ?
People suddenly got racist over night ?
People tend to have "extremists" attitudes when economy does not perform well (global economy has stagnated since 2008, and wealth has diminished in the global middle class (china probably the exception) and in developing/third world countries. That is the sole reason for shift in the populations political shift towards the extremes (left or right).
I wish one of your guys had children if I could kick them in the fucking head or stomp on their testicles so you can feel my pain because thats the pain I have waking up everyday -- Mike Tyson
On June 26 2016 05:56 JohnnyBologna wrote:
im guessing most the people that voted out are unhappy or tired of their miserable lives and wanted change. either that or they were tired of the EUs crap. kinda like how trump is with america lol. the irony of this world
Yeah I think people trend to project their life projections and simply vote for something drastically new, the sentiment is usually exploited by demagoges from the far extremes of the political espectrum, the crazy left in latin america with people like Chavez, and in the 1st world they are spiraling to a cycle of far right with Trump and in a future Europe
And why do you think people suddenly started to vote for Trump, SD, Marine Le Pen etc etc all over the western world ?
People suddenly got racist over night ?
No, many people are fed up with the regressive left, many are tired of political correctness, third wave feminism, many are reasonably concerned about immigration but their leaders do not engage in these conversations, their voices silenced and bunched up together with bigots, racist etc like has happened to Sam Harris of Richard Dawkings, so all these reasonable people are so frustrated that they are willing to vote for the demagoges, and ironically end up bunching themselves with the bigots.
Thats the reason why the right is gaining momentum in the 1st world, and the last time the extreme right got a hold of the 1st world the biggest war we have seen erupted, I think we are in general past that, but who knows despise being a misanthropist I often underestimate peoples stupidity.
There is a difference between Sam Harris and Dawkins, Sam comes out and intentionally says controversial things loudly but then walks it back quietly. He knows his words will spread hatred towards a specific identifiable group. And the fact that he knows this and keeps doing it is why he is a despicable guy. He is practically doing same thing Bill Oriley did in regards to abortion. Calling it "tiller the baby killer" and then quietly says I condone any violence, knowing full well who his audience are.
Don't get me wrong though, I do admit a large group of people on the left are retarded. There is a valid argument to have about the systematic problem of terrorism in Islam. But they way you you do this is very important.
In US everyone is happy as long as all the prices are rising. Unless its crude oil - Marc Faber
Last edit: 26/06/2016 19:22
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Stroggoz New Zealand. Jun 26 2016 23:01. Posts 5297
On June 26 2016 07:22 Stroggoz wrote:
Books written by economist yanis varoufakis have interesting insight into how the eu got into this mess. I have no opinion on brexit, hard to find a rational argument on the topic
Didn't Varoufakis and Tsipras get elected only to disappoint ? People of Greece voted basically for not getting a worse economy than they had (which in itself was ridiculous to begin with).
Yes, and
Yes, they got elected and dissappointed their electorate. Greece never could have won without outside help. I believe yanis resigned over the agreement greece made.
One of 3 non decent human beings on a site of 5 people with between 2-3 decent human beings
1.) How many people here believe that the EU IS an anti-democratic institution?
2.) How many people here believe that the EU ISN'T an anti-democratic institution?
If you believe #1, why would you vote remain? What is your justification?
If #1 was the only reason to vote leave, it seems like a good enough reason to me and everything else is secondary.
1
soberstone United States. Jun 27 2016 04:11. Posts 2662
On June 26 2016 12:17 whamm! wrote:
Harris is strongly for Hillary Baal, he hates the idea of Trump actually. He went on Rogan the last time and talked a good solid hour on why nobody should vote Trump. It was one of the best podcasts of rogan and lasted 4 hours 30minutes and had over 4million downloads. Sometimes when you go against the left these days they expect you to be right wing on every issue (coz most leftists now are like that) which is the problem I see with them.
I'm not a Trump guy at all. That said...
Between 10:00 and 18:00 Harris goes on a diatribe about Trumps "policy" of rounding up 11,000,000 illegal immigrants and shipping them home.
Not once has Trump ever said this to my knowledge. All he ever said was "they need to go" when asked. He's obviously just playing to his base to a degree, and that the policy would be to deport anyone who gets arrested - which we are not doing currently and we obviously should be.
We need a pathway to legalization (not citizenship, never let them vote IMO, they jumped the line, atleast not for 10 years) but that means stemming the tide of immigration before you are going to get the disenfranchised populist movement to buy in and get something passed in Congress. That means actually stopping illegal immigration, which "the Wall" is really just a metaphor for as far as I'm concerned. Point is he's one of the only guys serious about it, which is a good thing. The bullshit part is when he says he was the one who brought this up. He's actually just riding the coat-tails of guys like Ted Cruz and Jeff Sessions who have been fighting the Republican and Democratic establishments who are soft on immigration. (The Republicans because they like the cheap labor and are afraid to sound racist, the Democrats because they like the easy votes)
Sam Harris seems to think Trump could get elected and be a Populist dictator. That would require a Populist Supreme Court, which is infested with activist Liberals. Never gonna happen. Because of the nature of the Courts, the only threat of an Executive Dictatorship-Style governance is currently on the Left, as we've already begun to see with Obama.
As far as the Climate Change scaremongering, I can't believe Harris buys into this shit. What exactly are we doing to curb this Climate Change that Trump would somehow ruin? I don't buy most of the Statist Climate Change arguments, the computer models have been completely wrong. I believe we contribute to Global Warming but I don't think for a second we know how much and are ever going to effectively stop if we already do. This should be the absolute last issue on anyone's concerns as far as who our next President is.
The UK isn't obligated to accept "refugees" via imposed quotas like other EU nations because it isn't a member of the Schengen agreement. The UK is however bound to comply with free movement. Freedom of movement grants other EU citizens an automatic right to live in the UK even if they've murdered someone. Being unable to choose the quality of your citizens is a problem.
There have been talks of Brussels threatening to stop Briton from sending back asylum seekers who have already lodged claims else where in Europe if Briton refused to join the quota scheme.
The EU has also considering fining nations $287,000 or €250,000 for each Asylum seeker they refuse. (Not applicable to the UK, Ireland or Denmark.) This goes to further illustrate the kind of anti-democratic tyranny the EU has become and even more reason for EU nations to regain their sovereignty whether they are in the Schengen area or not.
Brexit is a joke and please remember it's UNITED Kingdom who voted, not England.
So this union (#irony) of countries, voted to leave this union of european countries
Now Scotland is planning a referendum to leave UK in order to be able to stay in EU. Northern Ireland is considering talks to join Ireland to be able to stay in EU.
within hours of the result on Friday morning, the Ukip leader, Nigel Farage, had distanced himself from the claim that £350m of EU contributions could instead be spent on the NHS, while the Tory MEP Daniel Hannan said free movement could result in similar levels of immigration after Brexit.
Hannan said: “Frankly, if people watching think that they have voted and there is now going to be zero immigration from the EU, they are going to be disappointed.”
Worse thing is you can see they have literally NO plans at all to deal with brexit (even the pro-brexit). Shows how much thought was put in this thing.
free movement could result in similar levels of immigration after Brexit.
Hannan said: “Frankly, if people watching think that they have voted and there is now going to be zero immigration from the EU, they are going to be disappointed.”
Is free movement still applicable after Brexit? From the article: "Free movement *may not end."
Of course migration will continue, but people wanted better quality controls and a sensible intake policy. Neither of which existed before.
I don't think I even see the intake numbers changing, but the option is there.
Options are good, no?
On June 26 2016 05:56 JohnnyBologna wrote:
im guessing most the people that voted out are unhappy or tired of their miserable lives and wanted change. either that or they were tired of the EUs crap. kinda like how trump is with america lol. the irony of this world
Yeah I think people trend to project their life projections and simply vote for something drastically new, the sentiment is usually exploited by demagoges from the far extremes of the political espectrum, the crazy left in latin america with people like Chavez, and in the 1st world they are spiraling to a cycle of far right with Trump and in a future Europe
And why do you think people suddenly started to vote for Trump, SD, Marine Le Pen etc etc all over the western world ?
People suddenly got racist over night ?
No, many people are fed up with the regressive left, many are tired of political correctness, third wave feminism, many are reasonably concerned about immigration but their leaders do not engage in these conversations, their voices silenced and bunched up together with bigots, racist etc like has happened to Sam Harris of Richard Dawkings, so all these reasonable people are so frustrated that they are willing to vote for the demagoges, and ironically end up bunching themselves with the bigots.
Thats the reason why the right is gaining momentum in the 1st world, and the last time the extreme right got a hold of the 1st world the biggest war we have seen erupted, I think we are in general past that, but who knows despise being a misanthropist I often underestimate peoples stupidity.
There is a difference between Sam Harris and Dawkins, Sam comes out and intentionally says controversial things loudly but then walks it back quietly. He knows his words will spread hatred towards a specific identifiable group. And the fact that he knows this and keeps doing it is why he is a despicable guy.
I have listened to Harris talk for hours on different subjects and I never got this impression. Can you give some examples?
Peace of mind cant be bought.
1
Santafairy Korea (South). Jun 27 2016 20:31. Posts 2226
On June 25 2016 11:01 Spitfiree wrote:
Pretty well summed up
If you voted out because of "unelected politicians" then well done because we're about to get an unelected prime minister.
firstly, all prime ministers are "unelected" in the strict sense; secondly, Gordon Brown wasn't elected in the loose sense either; thirdly, that is a short-term effect of transitioning, comparing it with being the EC's bitch for the next century is simply a red herring
If you voted out because of immigration then well done, because you just lost the right of free movement too. Just wait 'til you have to get a visa to go to Glasgow or Belfast.
open to being wrong but the person who wrote that is a potato-tier shit-for-brains retard because the CTA has nothing to do with the EU
If you voted out because people were "stealing your jobs" then well done, because you're about to see Germany and France "steal" Nissan and a bunch of other companies who only manufacture here as a gateway to the eu market.
those certainly sound like valuable companies to have around, a veritable economic backbone
If you voted out because you think we'll get a great trade deal with the EEA "like Norway did", think again. Take a look around your Sainsbury's Local and try and find any fruit and veg that's grown in the UK. We need them more than they need us, and like the EEA, we'll have to accept EU policies like free movement as part of a trade deal anyway - except now we won't be able to have any say in them.
in other words, Norway is a strong country that can stand on its own by selling ice, renting out seed vaults, and selling heavy water to the Nazis, but Great Britain is shit
If you voted out because of vague scaremongering headlines like "Migrant Crisis" then please, feel free to remind me when it was that Syria joined the EU.
the European migrant crisis, which is real, is not simply about Syria - and saying Syria isn't part of the EU is slim comfort to all the people in Germany and elsewhere dealing with the EC's incompetent lack of management
If you voted out because Farage promised £350m for the NHS, then I'm sure you'll be happy to watch him on This Morning revealing that that was a lie.
oh no 350 million pounds, the equivalent value of everyone in the country skipping one fish and chips meal at once
If you voted out and you're heading into retirement, then great job! Because now the working people of this nation will break their backs to afford your pension without the influx of young, economically active and skilled EU migrants.
oh my god a country is forced to rely on training its own labor force to be skilled and contribute instead of taking in the high supply of Polish postgraduate materials science engineers to fill the gap, the end is near
If you voted out because you think we'll be better off, the £ has just fallen by 8% against the dollar.
just market alarmism because nothing substantive has even happened yet
And if you voted out because you love this country, prepare to see it crumble, with threats of a unified Ireland and an independent Scotland just hours after the result was confirmed.
and after that there might be an independent United States of America and Australia and Canada! something happened to the millennial upbringing where they thought the world map as it existed when they were a daft infant is how it's necessarily supposed to look forever
Well done, Britain.
<thumbsup>
It seems to be not very profitable in the long run to play those kind of hands. - Gus Hansen
On June 26 2016 12:17 whamm! wrote:
Harris is strongly for Hillary Baal, he hates the idea of Trump actually. He went on Rogan the last time and talked a good solid hour on why nobody should vote Trump. It was one of the best podcasts of rogan and lasted 4 hours 30minutes and had over 4million downloads. Sometimes when you go against the left these days they expect you to be right wing on every issue (coz most leftists now are like that) which is the problem I see with them.
Im aware that Harris isnt from the right and he obviously doesn like Trump, I think you misunderstood me somewhere.
On June 26 2016 05:56 JohnnyBologna wrote:
im guessing most the people that voted out are unhappy or tired of their miserable lives and wanted change. either that or they were tired of the EUs crap. kinda like how trump is with america lol. the irony of this world
Yeah I think people trend to project their life projections and simply vote for something drastically new, the sentiment is usually exploited by demagoges from the far extremes of the political espectrum, the crazy left in latin america with people like Chavez, and in the 1st world they are spiraling to a cycle of far right with Trump and in a future Europe
And why do you think people suddenly started to vote for Trump, SD, Marine Le Pen etc etc all over the western world ?
People suddenly got racist over night ?
No, many people are fed up with the regressive left, many are tired of political correctness, third wave feminism, many are reasonably concerned about immigration but their leaders do not engage in these conversations, their voices silenced and bunched up together with bigots, racist etc like has happened to Sam Harris of Richard Dawkings, so all these reasonable people are so frustrated that they are willing to vote for the demagoges, and ironically end up bunching themselves with the bigots.
Thats the reason why the right is gaining momentum in the 1st world, and the last time the extreme right got a hold of the 1st world the biggest war we have seen erupted, I think we are in general past that, but who knows despise being a misanthropist I often underestimate peoples stupidity.
There is a difference between Sam Harris and Dawkins, Sam comes out and intentionally says controversial things loudly but then walks it back quietly. He knows his words will spread hatred towards a specific identifiable group. And the fact that he knows this and keeps doing it is why he is a despicable guy. He is practically doing same thing Bill Oriley did in regards to abortion. Calling it "tiller the baby killer" and then quietly says I condone any violence, knowing full well who his audience are.
Don't get me wrong though, I do admit a large group of people on the left are retarded. There is a valid argument to have about the systematic problem of terrorism in Islam. But they way you you do this is very important.
I am not a big of Harris, however you once said that he is worse than Jihadis that kill innocents, so your opinion on the subject is worthless to me
On June 27 2016 00:37 Quest2Know wrote:
1.) How many people here believe that the EU IS an anti-democratic institution?
2.) How many people here believe that the EU ISN'T an anti-democratic institution?
If you believe #1, why would you vote remain? What is your justification?
If #1 was the only reason to vote leave, it seems like a good enough reason to me and everything else is secondary.
democracy does not mean virtue, it just means popular vote, the UK does not elect the prime minister so it isnt a true democracy.
Going for anything democratic and rejecting anything non-democratic without even listening to the merits of both sides is narrow-sighted and idiotic.
I dont know if leaving the EU is good or bad, I think its a very complex subject economically I think for having a proper opinion I would need to know all the regulations and how they specifically affect the market, how the UK economy behaved post 1993 etc.
What I know is that if you form your opinion based on "brussels dictators, muslim invasion, soverignity and democracy!" you are an idiot
In before somebody makes a very broad economic assessment that coincidentally supports their preconceived opinion
The EU will make an example of them and the UK most likely won't even exist by the time they are done with them. Even the prime endorser of the BRexit campaign is holding off. Boris Johnson wants to slow the process as much as possible and get negotiations faster. That won't happen. No one will give them a safe exit as they expected. Good luck changing your whole legislation and economic agreements with the whole continent in just 2.5 years.
Can't believe that there are people actually believing the immigration argument here. Amazing.
On June 27 2016 08:12 Quest2Know wrote:
The UK isn't obligated to accept "refugees" via imposed quotas like other EU nations because it isn't a member of the Schengen agreement. The UK is however bound to comply with free movement. Freedom of movement grants other EU citizens an automatic right to live in the UK even if they've murdered someone. Being unable to choose the quality of your citizens is a problem.
There have been talks of Brussels threatening to stop Briton from sending back asylum seekers who have already lodged claims else where in Europe if Briton refused to join the quota scheme.
The EU has also considering fining nations $287,000 or €250,000 for each Asylum seeker they refuse. (Not applicable to the UK, Ireland or Denmark.) This goes to further illustrate the kind of anti-democratic tyranny the EU has become and even more reason for EU nations to regain their sovereignty whether they are in the Schengen area or not.
First no, the UK isnt obliged to take refugees quota, but considering they are a part of a union and even a country like mine which also isnt a part of Schengen agrees to accept refugees and a world top economy cant accept 15,000 people, around which was their quota, then they are fucking twats.
Second, what you are implying is that the UK has no prevention methods towards people coming inside the country, which is a joke. And no what do you mean, they have to let someone in, even if they are a murderer? Pretty sure they d be in jail. Quality of life of citizens's main problem sure as hell isn't coming from migrants .
Third, the 250k euro fine proposal was obviously done by a braindead commission and would never have passed, sadly every government has laughable people in it. The free travel visa for turks would also never pass, those are just part of the terms of the agreement with Erdogan, which the EU actually needs to make look like is going to happen for as long as possible, considering Erdogan can flood the whole continent with refugees with the wave of a finger.
Poland. Jun 27 2016 19:23. Posts 1982
