Starcraft II Beta - Page 52

your strategy sucks, i just got raped doing it

roaches = gg

u fail

The hallucination looks kinda cool and might cause the Z to make some mistakes.

Like if you can make them back into their main like in game 1 then that ramp forcefield stuff obv looks awesome.

My only problem with it is that it looks like a normal 3/4 warpgate timing push build, which it essentially is. Z scouts 3-4 warpgate timing push -> mass roaches -> how does your first push not just get crippled? Like presumably you have a followthrough/adjustment you make if you see them go pure roach. Hallucinate 4 Immortals, scare the Z shitless and make him back into his main/sac his nat then do the ramp forcefield stuff?

It seems to only work vs retards i.e. "Did you really research all three tech trees?"

cool vids

Looking for someone to play 2s with I'm only a 1700-1800rating gold player

Hit me up Misplaced.JasonSpeed

zOObie has probably played 400 games+, and I'm sure he had never seen hallucination being used against him before that game, can you really say that he's retarded for it?

This is not an all-in strat that works "vs retards". It's an opening build/particular unit composition that works well for PvZ and that has many variations to it both early and mid game.

Here's an example of how the game develops against roaches and where my attempt to contain and kill the zerg's expo early on does not work:

http://www.sc2rc.com/index.php/replay/download/256

I would like to see any of the people criticizing my build/play do any better than Artosis did.

And zOObie never said nor thought that I researched every tech. I think now that he understood that they were hallucinations, but he didn't know that I could make them without having built the proper buildings for it. Nobody did in the first few weeks of the beta. I must have played 200+ games of protoss before noticing that hallucination was much different from the SC1 one.

On March 21 2010 22:59 FC wrote: The hallucination looks kinda cool and might cause the Z to make some mistakes. Like if you can make them back into their main like in game 1 then that ramp forcefield stuff obv looks awesome. My only problem with it is that it looks like a normal 3/4 warpgate timing push build, which it essentially is. Z scouts 3-4 warpgate timing push -> mass roaches -> how does your first push not just get crippled? Like presumably you have a followthrough/adjustment you make if you see them go pure roach. Hallucinate 4 Immortals, scare the Z shitless and make him back into his main/sac his nat then do the ramp forcefield stuff?

It's what it is, but it also allows you to expand. It's pretty hard to expend safely vs zerg with any other unit composition in my experience. Watch the game vs Artosis, it's exactly what you said.

its just that the Z failed pretty hard at building an economy without being harassed... i expected a lot more hydras out of him at that point and wtf why would he build muta?!

im 3-0 against artosis

does that give me ground to talk about strategy?

idk.. maybe if you've been #1 toss for the longest in your division yes

no, smuft is in my division, how am i supposed to pull that off?

Artosis kiiiiiiiinda looked like he butchered that game after your push. At the point you were backing with your zealot/sentry vs the roach/ling it felt like he had a pretty solid advantage and could pretty much immidiately expand to his 3rd and go into a muta switch. Instead he just kinda threw an army of roach/ling into certain death with the forcefield blocks+cannons, threw more roaches in in small groups vs 4 cannons+10 sentrys, then kinda realised he had nothing to defend a counter so had to repump a roach ball before he could expand to his 3rd at roughly the same time you did.

Basically, the opening didn't seem to put you at an advantage. It let you expand, but the roach/ling combo definitely seemed to be easily enough to stop the zealot/sentry push and so kinda gives the zerg a huge window of opportunity where you cant push again before immortal/collosus/HT, which you havn't got the setup for yet and won't for a while because youre busy cannoning/expoing. In this time he can just take a third, saturate all his bases, do a muta switch and simply outmacro you?

ofc but it's easier said than done

most zergs will definitely try to attack instead of turtling up, but turtling up is indeed what works vs my particular build if i don't expand early enough

well i liked the cannons for sure. A lot of tosses on euro are super agressive with zeals early on and i always thought to myself why dont they throw a couple of cannons in there that woulda been really hard for me to defend cos i have my hands full with zeals while teching to muta. But probably their builds are perfectly tuned and they dont have any extra for cannons.
Whats the point of hallucinations? FPS for sure, like i dont see a point at all. Clearly you cant have any collosus in this spot.
I liked the sentry wall in, definitely holds zerg back from macroing his ass off.
And most zergs are bad then if they try to attack. Attacking as zerg is generally bad and if u got ur expo denied its a complete and utter error.

lol.. it's far from being FPS wtf...

most zergs are confused if they haven't ever seen this strat before and their immediate reflex is to back the fuck off. even if they don't, what ends up happening is that i always put them in front in order to be the first thing the AI attacks. this means the hallucinations are meatshields and i have enough time to put down force fields before my real army is even damaged.

from the way that i understand it, unless you have detectors the AI will attack the hallucinations as if they were real, so your only chance not to waste your attacks would be to target my units which isn't nearly as good as normal AI attack in case there wouldn't be any hallucinations

haven't you seen how i retreated when mez got out? i spammed two colossus while backing off and his units immediately started attacking them instead of pursuing/attacking my army

i woulda thought an earlier storm research/an immortal or whatnot would deem a lot more benefitial then halucinations drawing a couple of attacks.

all in all would like to hear nazgul's take on it.
That'd be a bottom line, imo.

lol the hallucination build certainly is not noob friendly ((

except standard play like going fast immortal or templar is what the zergs are used to play against the most and they have adjusted very well against that

i think you underestimate how hard pvz is at the moment. doing the most standard builds won't win you any games at the highest level.