TSL Ro16

The MSL final thread proved we have a lot of starcraft fans here still so I figure we could use a TeamLiquid Starleague thread to follow the action and excitement, and maybe even get some betting going on it.

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=111019

So who wants to give me odds on sen vs draco? (if i bet on sen)

ill take lefnaij if anyone wants gosl.

also
who wants to give me odds on Idra winning the whole tournament. 8 guys. Hows 13:1?

lol 13:1, it's more like 1,5 to 1 that Idra wins the whole tournament probably

wow wtf math is that 13:1.. u say 8 guys left and the favourite gets 13:1 lol

i'll give you 1.5:1 that idra wins the whole thing twisited

I'm not gonna bet on that, but I think that would be closer in terms of odds.

lol floofy why are you on semper's account

On January 30 2010 11:46 Ket wrote: lol floofy why are you on semper's account

rofl

damn we been discovered. had a 6 month long plan to scam u guys for 1.19k in SC bets and chess. back to the drawing board yo.



yeah maybe my problem is I don't really think anyone has a great edge. Sure idra has been practicing a lot in korea, but its still gonna be a challenge to win. maybe 8:1 is fair since once could reasonably say he has an edge.

compared to like the osl, TSL is like the special olympics of starcraft. they're good guys/good players, but we all know if we stuck a korean b teamer in there he'd clean up ( except for idra. =p).

im rooting for lafnaij. reaverssss

semper this may be really obvious but if you think 8-1 is a fair line then surely youd be making what in your mind is a very +ev bet by laying others 5-1 on idra winning it all. If you give me 5-1 with me betting idra wins it all I'll very gladly take action

jf is going to get rocked

btw who are all of those people Left to Right?

On January 30 2010 11:12 Ket wrote: So who wants to give me odds on sen vs draco? (if i bet on sen)

Isn't sen the heavy favorite in that matchup?

i'm casting the games tomorrow toooooo

sad but idra is gonna take it home :/

idra is such a douch


GOGO JF!!!

idra is probably 35-40% to win
ret maybe 15-20%
the rest is kinda spread out between brat, mondi, draco, and a couple others. anyone willing to give me 10000-1 on xiaozl? he used to beat up on me during wgt!

lag?

so how long till it starts?

On January 30 2010 13:09 Daut wrote: idra is probably 35-40% to win ret maybe 15-20% the rest is kinda spread out between brat, mondi, draco, and a couple others. anyone willing to give me 10000-1 on xiaozl? he used to beat up on me during wgt!

Lol I'd bet a few $100 on that but I guess I couldn't in good conscience since I'd be bankrupt if I lost. Even though Xiaozi has no chance at winning this.

On January 30 2010 13:28 CamilaPunt wrote: so how long till it starts?

10min delay from now

wow idra pwnage, hes really good

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL


wp draco!

omgwtf sen was 1000000 times better than draco

agreed. sen made him look silly

i laughed so hard when tasteless/artosis said "i guess ron123 was already taken" LOL

also laughed really hard when tasteless said that the pandabearguy was an avid poker player hahahaha

any streams for this?

yea we need links n stuff

draco was like
"omg muta?"
"omg lurkers?" etc
edit
and that quality post was number 5k lol
sick,now I have this cool vague shape as my avatar

the stream is off, you'll have to watch the vods of these games and catch the next games tomorrow live!

oh i guess we missed day one... that sux

Tomorrow Nony vs Tarson and Kollllllllllll vs Fenix, probaby 2 more one sided rape matches?

hmm

i think koll fenix will prob be good

On January 30 2010 12:25 Svenman87 wrote: btw who are all of those people Left to Right?

mondragon, idra, nony, brat_ok, jianfei, koll, draco, ret, ???

sen

nony's gonna rape tarson,
fenix vs koll is gonna be very good; fenix builds are always very good but koll is just brutal z v t

On January 30 2010 16:52 Ket wrote: Tomorrow Nony vs Tarson and Kollllllllllll vs Fenix, probaby 2 more one sided rape matches?

I dont think fenix/koll is gonna be 1 sided, nony/tarson mayyybe, but tarson is def better than horror so he can make an upset.

i dont get it, this koll kid is 14 yrs old or something, and he just rapes the shit out of everyone?

tarson my clan mate, hoping he can pull an upset

wasted my time wating for sen vs draco, what a fucking let down...

Anybody want to bet on iefnaij game? I will take action on gosi if I get odds...

gosi[terran] is the huge favorite...

would be sick if they all got flown to korean to compete and see which ones would win courage

On January 30 2010 16:38 CrownRoyal wrote: the stream is off, you'll have to watch the vods of these games and catch the next games tomorrow live!

links to vods?

On January 31 2010 01:36 Sicks Macks wrote: Show nested quote + On January 30 2010 16:38 CrownRoyal wrote: the stream is off, you'll have to watch the vods of these games and catch the next games tomorrow live! links to vods?

TL's youtube account - http://www.youtube.com/user/nevake

http://www.xlbet.com/LiveLines.aspx?lg=199

Dont wanna show some disrespect but dont know what nazgul has done on the scene for being respected as he is. Kind of ignorant on the starcraft scene

xlbet is a rip off. I understand that volumes for starcraft betting will be low, but even still, their spreads are absolutely ridiculous.

For example nony is 1.18 and tarson is 4.30. Those are decimal odds, if you convert that to american odds that is -556 on nony and +330 on tarson. If there were no juice or vig then it should be identical, -556 on nony and +556 on tarson. Typical bookies will set the lines so that if nony is -556, then tarson will be +430 or so. xlbet is effectively charging twice the vig of standard bookmakers.

On January 31 2010 01:48 BG1 wrote: Show nested quote + On January 31 2010 01:36 Sicks Macks wrote:   On January 30 2010 16:38 CrownRoyal wrote: the stream is off, you'll have to watch the vods of these games and catch the next games tomorrow live! links to vods? TL's youtube account - http://www.youtube.com/user/nevake

gracias

anyone for helping me with my last question ?
Plus i might be blind but cant find if there is one, the search function on this forum

On January 31 2010 09:19 FullBRing wrote: Dont wanna show some disrespect but dont know what nazgul has done on the scene for being respected as he is. Kind of ignorant on the starcraft scene

I believe one of the founders of teamliquid.net, where liquidpoker originates from

Ok thanks

WTF noobs.. nazgul raped xellos on Korean tv with mass speedshuttles back when xellos was considered a beast

On January 31 2010 09:19 FullBRing wrote: Dont wanna show some disrespect but dont know what nazgul has done on the scene for being respected as he is. Kind of ignorant on the starcraft scene

lol not sure whether this is a troll or not, so I'll answer you seriously.
Among other things, he's the (co-)founder of teamliquid.net (which I'll assume you know) and he also was a progamer in Korea (around 2003). He's anything but ignorant about starcraft and its scene.

lol no way ....

im amazed of how many people here are still interested in the e-games scene

one sided games =[

wow this kolllllll kid is pretty damn good

On January 31 2010 14:35 HaiVan wrote: wow this kolllllll kid is pretty damn good

jinx

i really didnt think that shit would b so boring..

i was suprised chill said fenix wasn't one of the top tier players. he seems to have really good results whenever ive seen him play, and incredible good understanding of developing gameplans and transitions. extremely smart player imo.

hope games will get better next week T_t

i was really glad the commentators did such a good job

lol they did actually

On January 31 2010 15:51 lebowski wrote: lol they did actually

are you deaf? chills kinda a moron

On January 31 2010 15:39 Day[9] wrote: i was really glad the commentators did such a good job

I agree too. I actually like the day/chill team better than artosis/tasteless. Not to knock them at all since I think they do a good job as well but your announcing team does a bit more analysis while I feel like the other team focuses more on emotion and clever phrases.

^DO YOU NOT APPRECIATE THE CLEVAR

On January 30 2010 23:51 CrownRoyal wrote: gosi[terran] is the huge favorite...

Doubt he's a favorite... JF won the last TSL, and GosI[Terran] is a relatively unknown player who won WCG Mexico. I mean obviously I'm betting on him because I personally think he will win, and he's a close friend, but the maps are all protoss favored, and JF is definitely considered a better player.

Bah tarson choked really bad and the other set wasnt that great too. Still high hopes for mondi vs bratok and maybe jf vs gosi will be good too.

tarson never had a chance
draco didn't either, he hasn't adjusted to modern pvz at all
jf won't have a chance - terran is the second best terran in the tourney and incredibly good, jf basically hasn't produced any great results since last tsl..
fenix was underrated by everyone (more so than kolll being overrated, although that is also a factor)
bratok vs mondragon is gonna be good, ret vs castro will be good for a zvz (and while ret is a favourite, castro can beat him. ret seems to depend on lan latency more than anyone else, and this one will prolly be played on high)
white-ra vs tt1 is the last match and ra is a big favourite but the result is not a given.

thanks for the informative post drone

should ret not consider going tvz to reduce variance vs a... i was gonna say lagtard but that implies something else

The thing is castro has really good ZvT, at least early/mid game from what Ive seen he chokes late game quite often, so if ret isnt in top shape on that MU he would prolly get raped

ah gotcha. i guess its probably also likely based on his recent courage performance ret's zvz is now way above every other foreigner.

hope bratOK beats mondi, he was the most entertaining player in the previous TSL for me

JF always has a chance.

Be sure to catch the vod of Jianfei vs Terran game 3 if you didnt see it live

On February 06 2010 16:06 Ket wrote: Be sure to catch the vod of Jianfei vs Terran game 3 if you didnt see it live

Yes that was a great game

jf looked really sharp

artosis mad overhyped terran. i mean its jf ofc hes got a chance. hes superclutch and super good

Gr8 games today ;>

Yea very good games today and tomorrow looks promising as well. Can't wait for Brat vs Mondi!

Ra will unfortunately get raped by JF. JF's strength's are exactly Ra's weaknesses. Unless he prepares some seek ridiculous builds, but even then, Ra's micro is just nowhere near JF's level.

JF totally destroyed Terran in every aspect. Terran is pretty much a robot kid who practices builds 24/7. When he gets thrown off balance by a smart player ala JF he crumbles so fast. I think that really showed in the series. Every straight up game he got destroyed.

better games than last week.

I think tasteless and artosis were still half asleep tho, missed so much.

=/

TT1 = iamtt1 on tlnet right? If so you did a really good job many people picked you to lose vs strelok and then even more people thought white ra would run you over. Obviously disappointing but having such a good competitive series against one of the best foreign ps of all time in the biggest foreign tournament ever is something to be proud of for sure.

thats what everyone has been telling me but the dissapointment doesnt go away, it feels even worse because it was a 2-3.. i would have preferred getting 0-3ed because i at least then i wouldnt have cared lol

once the games are over all u think about are the small mistakes you made that could have easily turned a game around

TT1, thx for an entertaining series. I thought you had that game on fighting spirit. I didn't think he could bust out of that contain.

Yea while its not the exact same I have had very similar feelings in big poker tournaments that have meant a lot to me. Even if you ft and get deep it still feels so so terrible right after you bust and the only thing that runs through your head are what ifs thinking through all the different scenarios about what you could have done to prevent losing, especially if you didnt play 100% perfect and it always hurts 100x more to get close and just miss than it does to bust early on. But after some time has passed the disappointment will fade you will be able to look back at it more objectively and realize even tho you didnt win you still did really well and you should take pride in what you accomplished.

On February 06 2010 19:59 Twisted wrote: JF totally destroyed Terran in every aspect. Terran is pretty much a robot kid who practices builds 24/7. When he gets thrown off balance by a smart player ala JF he crumbles so fast. I think that really showed in the series. Every straight up game he got destroyed.

My thoughts exactly, its nice to see SC isnt dead and all figured out and it takes more than having awesome macro and having the best BO, jf pretty much crushed him with builds I used to do 5 years ago but he also has the macro and game sense to rape it late game as well.
Im a bit sad that JF/Ra Mondi/Bratok have to play this soon cuz theyre easily my favorite players left, lower brackets stink cuz its a bunch of zvz

Jf's play was very sexy. I didn't think he was in any shape at all and kinda forgot all about him. But I'm happy he can still play cause todays games were the best games of the tourney so far. Game 3 of that series was fucking amazing.

I missed the rA/tt1 games I heard they were just as good. I kinda thought all week that tt1 would pull the upset.

hahaha lol what a zvz Ret vs Castro game 1

JF gosi[terran] G4:

4:44 - what is wrong with this picture?

if JF were 1 gate range expanding, he wouldn't care what you saw. he'd at least check your ramp to make sure he had 0 attack timing before falling back to that position, and he wouldn't need to do it with 3 goons, he'd field 2 up front so that you at least have to watch ur units come down the ramp as you FD expand or whatever (which sucks on tornado anyways), and he'd have the 3rd blocking his own ramp, as a nexus builds, because with forward ranged goons the build is no mystery - the only issue is the followup. 4:44 into the game - well, no, 4:25 or whatever, my bad - and we have 3 goons, no range, standing out in the middle of nowhere guarding nothing. ok. and, by the way, range goon expand on this map? so fucking terrible. no way he plays that. it beats NOTHING.

5:52 - gosi[terran] actually has exactly the right unit composition given the situation. his build is perfect given the map and circumstances. i love the 4 rine tank seige tank factory. here's the part i don't like: seiging the tank on low ground and having the rines bucknaked, up front.

ok, ya, JF can be dt here, sure, of course.

i think you just have to suck it up, seige 1 tank on high ground, withdraw into the main, and mentally prepare yourself to either immediately defend a drop, or scv swarm your front turret. if you get dt dropped right on top of your high ground tank, i think u just eat it. since we've already decided to eat the tank in that exact situation, i think we can save the money on a high ground turret in that position, and instead place one right by our cc.

here gosi[terran] is sort of trying to defend EVERYTHING and ends up really defending nothing aside from walking dts, which i think we can all agree, is the least likely thing to happen given what he saw at 4:44.

6:05 - saprize! you can see just how short the interval is from between when you have to decide exactly what your defensive philosophy is to the time u have to actually execute it at a very high level against a player who already knows exactly what he has to do. bw is so fucking hard. gosi[terran] gets a little lucky, for awhile, but the strain of continuous movement eventually breaks him down. the rest is noise. JF advances to the round of 8.

68 seconds to break it down
15 seconds to select your defensive posture
13 seconds during which you expect attack
30 seconds of proof

rofl wtf sawseech your analysis is like unintelligible

bratok vs mondi series lived up to expectations

ownage:D mondi showed great games

yeah i didnt want brat to lose though lol

at first i was rooting for brat cause his play was exciting in the last tsl and i just assumed mondi would be a past-it oldtimer. but after game 1 i instantly swung to rooting for mondi as his play was definitely still super cool and dominant. ro8 is when the shit is gonna get real

Missed the first matchup so I dont know if there were any good games there, but def watch mondi vs brat on destination, sick play by winner.

how can you not root for mondragon when he decides to do something like take the bottom left expansion near the terran base in that last game =P

Yea Mondi is pimp! Great games today and excellent casting by Day and Chill. I like the duo better than Tasteless/Artosis I must say, although they're all good.

god damnit brat, oh well

Both series today were really good and day/chill did an amazing job casting.

just watched last 4 matchups and i was impressed with both games and casting too. analysis seemed really like watching a legit technical sport lol. far cry from the first 2 casts

this game was crazy lol



it starts about halfway in

day owns imo

pretty excited with betting here soon, but prob waiting for last 4 remaining players before betting.

fantastic series
bratok showed alot more sense than i expected and mondi was mondi

one thing in the mondi/brat_ok series, did mondi have a mic hooked into the feed? what's with all the clicking noises?

On February 08 2010 02:25 sawseech wrote: one thing in the mondi/brat_ok series, did mondi have a mic hooked into the feed? what's with all the clicking noises?

i think that was from one of casters.

That's just day and chill clicking around I think.

On February 07 2010 14:59 exalted wrote: rofl wtf sawseech your analysis is like unintelligible

what's so hard to understand about it? after the sequence has played out, JF emerges with a significant advantage.

going into the sequence gosi[terran] has a minor build order win. he has like 55-58% wins the instant the reaver flies into his base.

JF emerges with an advantage not because of superior control or a control miss by gosi[terran], but because for the few seconds preceeding the attack, gosi[terran] was unclear in his defensive philosophy. he knows he's on defense, he knows something is coming, but he hasn't correctly ranked the threats and his defense is reactive. instead of anticipating specific threats and having planned responses, he is reading the situation and then reacting. by having both tanks seiged at his front, one on low ground, and with his marines in front of that tank he further harms his ability to react. is that really so difficult to understand?