Politics thread (USA Elections 2016) - Page 309

It's crazy how biased ppl are, for example I'm certain Loco think's he is gulity of murder. As an "excersize" I've tried to vividly picture the inverse happening, some unruly patriot rally where Antifa shows up and the same thing happens to him I would absolutely think he is innocent.

On November 11 2021 08:19 Baalim wrote: Show nested quote + On November 11 2021 04:13 Stroggoz wrote: All of the diseases that have led to the rise of Trump haven't been remedied. There are a few obvious ways to deal with it, the democratization of the tech industry and bringing back a manufacturing-based economy would be one way. All the oligarchy did was ban him from their media platforms. So basically their strategy was to silence him and pray he or someone like him doesn't come back, meanwhile continuing to do the exact same thing as before. I can't predict the future but it wouldn't surprise me if Trump becomes president. This is all pretty relevant to anyone in the world right now, since many countries have their own version of Trump right now (Bolsonaro, Modi, ScoMo, ect). lol @ "democratization", such a commie buzzword... ironically tech is in the process of decentralization and transitioning into DAOs (decentralized autonomous organizations) where token holders vote on the protocols actions, but of course leftists are against crypto under the pretense that PoW uses energy lol, but in reality what happens is that they don't want "tech bros" getting rich in the process of building it.. they could join and help build and also aquire wealth to perhaps re-distribute it later with his comrades, but they as always they won't, they wan't others to do so, not themselves.

I actually haven't really heard much about DAO, but I'll look into it if you provide some links for me. The Wikipedia page doesn't tell me much. It doesn't bother me if democratization is a buzzword, so long as it aligns with my political ideals.

On November 11 2021 22:13 Baalim wrote: It's crazy how biased ppl are, for example I'm certain Loco think's he is gulity of murder. As an "excersize" I've tried to vividly picture the inverse happening, some unruly patriot rally where Antifa shows up and the same thing happens to him I would absolutely think he is innocent.

I spend close to 0% of my time on this controversial shit that doesn't affect me in any way. I've barely paid attention to the news in the past year and none on this kind of viral political stuff. You're not going to be successful baiting me into some left vs right debate over current events like these since I don't keep up with them - just letting you know. I know next to nothing about this guy and this case and I won't do research into it and "present my position" because fuck you, I have better things to do.

And FFS learn to resize pictures before posting them.

On November 11 2021 22:21 Stroggoz wrote: Show nested quote + On November 11 2021 08:19 Baalim wrote:   On November 11 2021 04:13 Stroggoz wrote: All of the diseases that have led to the rise of Trump haven't been remedied. There are a few obvious ways to deal with it, the democratization of the tech industry and bringing back a manufacturing-based economy would be one way. All the oligarchy did was ban him from their media platforms. So basically their strategy was to silence him and pray he or someone like him doesn't come back, meanwhile continuing to do the exact same thing as before. I can't predict the future but it wouldn't surprise me if Trump becomes president. This is all pretty relevant to anyone in the world right now, since many countries have their own version of Trump right now (Bolsonaro, Modi, ScoMo, ect). lol @ "democratization", such a commie buzzword... ironically tech is in the process of decentralization and transitioning into DAOs (decentralized autonomous organizations) where token holders vote on the protocols actions, but of course leftists are against crypto under the pretense that PoW uses energy lol, but in reality what happens is that they don't want "tech bros" getting rich in the process of building it.. they could join and help build and also aquire wealth to perhaps re-distribute it later with his comrades, but they as always they won't, they wan't others to do so, not themselves. I actually haven't really heard much about DAO, but I'll look into it if you provide some links for me. The Wikipedia page doesn't tell me much. It doesn't bother me if democratization is a buzzword, so long as it aligns with my political ideals.

its a buzzword because what you really mean is expropiation.

I don't know if I can provide a link but many protocols in decentralized finance are DAOs, actually a DAO just bought the unreleased Wu-Tang clan album the government seized from Martin Shkreli, so now DAOs own stuff in the real world.

The way the operate is through polls, token holders vote (kinda like shareholders the more you have, the more you have a say), the kind of thing you vote for is things like adding functionalities, liquidty pools or allocate financial incentives to certain things, marketing, education funds etc. The developing of the software itself is done by a team, anyone can fork their own project though, but some projects are even starting to allow decentralized building kind of like a wikipedia style thing.

On November 11 2021 23:54 Loco wrote: Show nested quote + On November 11 2021 22:13 Baalim wrote: It's crazy how biased ppl are, for example I'm certain Loco think's he is gulity of murder. As an "excersize" I've tried to vividly picture the inverse happening, some unruly patriot rally where Antifa shows up and the same thing happens to him I would absolutely think he is innocent. I spend close to 0% of my time on this controversial shit that doesn't affect me in any way. I've barely paid attention to the news in the past year and none on this kind of viral political stuff. You're not going to be successful baiting me into some left vs right debate over current events like these since I don't keep up with them - just letting you know. I know next to nothing about this guy and this case and I won't do research into it and "present my position" because fuck you, I have better things to do. And FFS learn to resize pictures before posting them.

Good for you my man, don't take the bait, not like its needed I already know your take



lol fuck your 1080p monitor pleb

Of course Loco has no comment. We've been trying to tell him for years how violence begets violence and how it's stupid to support antifa or the "punch a nazi" type of tactics. It's a clear lack of understanding of how violence escalates. It doesn't end with punching, the other side comes back with pepper spray, then the other side hits people with bike locks and metal pipes, then guns get involved, and now you have people getting blasted with an AR-15. I'd also want no part of a debate that plainly reveals the end result of stupid beliefs I hold.

funny thing, when we were arguing about the punch nazi thing he was very proud that Antifa hadn't killed anyone, now they have a few bodies under their belt lol

On November 12 2021 01:54 Baalim wrote: Show nested quote + On November 11 2021 22:21 Stroggoz wrote:   On November 11 2021 08:19 Baalim wrote:   On November 11 2021 04:13 Stroggoz wrote: All of the diseases that have led to the rise of Trump haven't been remedied. There are a few obvious ways to deal with it, the democratization of the tech industry and bringing back a manufacturing-based economy would be one way. All the oligarchy did was ban him from their media platforms. So basically their strategy was to silence him and pray he or someone like him doesn't come back, meanwhile continuing to do the exact same thing as before. I can't predict the future but it wouldn't surprise me if Trump becomes president. This is all pretty relevant to anyone in the world right now, since many countries have their own version of Trump right now (Bolsonaro, Modi, ScoMo, ect). lol @ "democratization", such a commie buzzword... ironically tech is in the process of decentralization and transitioning into DAOs (decentralized autonomous organizations) where token holders vote on the protocols actions, but of course leftists are against crypto under the pretense that PoW uses energy lol, but in reality what happens is that they don't want "tech bros" getting rich in the process of building it.. they could join and help build and also aquire wealth to perhaps re-distribute it later with his comrades, but they as always they won't, they wan't others to do so, not themselves. I actually haven't really heard much about DAO, but I'll look into it if you provide some links for me. The Wikipedia page doesn't tell me much. It doesn't bother me if democratization is a buzzword, so long as it aligns with my political ideals. its a buzzword because what you really mean is expropiation. I don't know if I can provide a link but many protocols in decentralized finance are DAOs, actually a DAO just bought the unreleased Wu-Tang clan album the government seized from Martin Shkreli, so now DAOs own stuff in the real world. The way the operate is through polls, token holders vote (kinda like shareholders the more you have, the more you have a say), the kind of thing you vote for is things like adding functionalities, liquidty pools or allocate financial incentives to certain things, marketing, education funds etc. The developing of the software itself is done by a team, anyone can fork their own project though, but some projects are even starting to allow decentralized building kind of like a wikipedia style thing.

If it operates like shareholder ownership then it sounds like the current system, where a few people own all the shares and therefore make all the decisions. This is the opposite of 'decentralized' under any reasonable interpretation of what that word means. Wikipedia is a great idea but I can't see Sergey Brin and Larry Page spending a bunch of money on it once they buy up all the tokens. All of the major tech industries spend their investments in trying to find new ways to harvest data on people, like virtual reality for example. How does Wikipedia allow us to sell things to people? Currently, it doesn't, so it's a waste of money and time. Wikipedia is one of those rare examples of something being developed under capitalism despite the fact that it runs at a loss. I have nothing against this technology though, you could probably convince me that it has a decentralizing effect if people got one token each.

On November 12 2021 06:12 blackjacki2 wrote: Of course Loco has no comment. We've been trying to tell him for years how violence begets violence and how it's stupid to support antifa or the "punch a nazi" type of tactics. It's a clear lack of understanding of how violence escalates. It doesn't end with punching, the other side comes back with pepper spray, then the other side hits people with bike locks and metal pipes, then guns get involved, and now you have people getting blasted with an AR-15. I'd also want no part of a debate that plainly reveals the end result of stupid beliefs I hold.

The problem is the hypocrisy of most people that critique ANTIFA. I think what makes Loco have an aneurysm are the people that are critiquing Antifa for its violence and supporting far more violent ideologies at the same time. It's kinda like those people that say life is precious when arguing against abortion and then they invade a couple of countries and kill a million people. If that doesn't make you have an aneurysm then you really need to question your own apathy.

On November 12 2021 08:11 Stroggoz wrote: Show nested quote + On November 12 2021 06:12 blackjacki2 wrote: Of course Loco has no comment. We've been trying to tell him for years how violence begets violence and how it's stupid to support antifa or the "punch a nazi" type of tactics. It's a clear lack of understanding of how violence escalates. It doesn't end with punching, the other side comes back with pepper spray, then the other side hits people with bike locks and metal pipes, then guns get involved, and now you have people getting blasted with an AR-15. I'd also want no part of a debate that plainly reveals the end result of stupid beliefs I hold. The problem is the hypocrisy of most people that critique ANTIFA. I think what makes Loco have an aneurysm are the people that are critiquing Antifa for its violence and supporting far more violent ideologies at the same time. It's kinda like those people that say life is precious when arguing against abortion and then they invade a couple of countries and kill a million people. If that doesn't make you have an aneurysm then you really need to question your own apathy.

Quite sure that's why most liberals are liberals.

On November 12 2021 07:47 Stroggoz wrote: If it operates like shareholder ownership then it sounds like the current system, where a few people own all the shares and therefore make all the decisions. This is the opposite of 'decentralized' under any reasonable interpretation of what that word means. Wikipedia is a great idea but I can't see Sergey Brin and Larry Page spending a bunch of money on it once they buy up all the tokens. All of the major tech industries spend their investments in trying to find new ways to harvest data on people, like virtual reality for example. How does Wikipedia allow us to sell things to people? Currently, it doesn't, so it's a waste of money and time. Wikipedia is one of those rare examples of something being developed under capitalism despite the fact that it runs at a loss. I have nothing against this technology though, you could probably convince me that it has a decentralizing effect if people got one token each.

In your leftist utopia workers own the workplace and make decisions about its future, giving a random guy across the world who has no knowledge or stake whatsoever as the an actual worker makes no sense.

That idea of token distribution has been floated but it would require the biggest personal data collection in history, fuck that shit, a database of every human on earth so you can get your token, also these tokens would need to be untransferable, somehow when they die that token gets burned and when somebody is born one is minted lol, its simply not feasible.

Decentralization is a spectrum, from a single entity with absolute power being perfectly centralized to 7+billion majority consensus to be perfectly decentralized and as I explained above, perfect decentralization isn't ideal for the vast majority of protocols.

On November 12 2021 06:12 blackjacki2 wrote: Of course Loco has no comment. We've been trying to tell him for years how violence begets violence and how it's stupid to support antifa or the "punch a nazi" type of tactics. It's a clear lack of understanding of how violence escalates. It doesn't end with punching, the other side comes back with pepper spray, then the other side hits people with bike locks and metal pipes, then guns get involved, and now you have people getting blasted with an AR-15. I'd also want no part of a debate that plainly reveals the end result of stupid beliefs I hold.

Your response is a poorly thought-out bait attempt. I've been involved in many arguments on here discussing cases where violence escalated and I was paying attention to the news at the time and commented on them and my stance remained the same about Antifa. You seem to be even admitting to this by saying "we've been trying to get through to him for so long". So, what the fuck are you even talking about? What are the odds that there is something so unique about this case that would change anything? My guess is close to none.

"Violence begets violence" is a trite saying that you learn in first grade. It's not some nugget of wisdom that flew over my head. Did defeating the Nazis ~with ViOLeNCe~ in WW2 lead to more violence, or more Nazis in the world, Mr. Smartpants? Things aren't always black and white in the world and there is no perfect rule of thumb that applies to every single situation. Sometimes when you try to avoid all violence in the short-term it leads to more violence in the long-term, and we are not gifted with omniscience so none of us can be absolutely certain about the effects that specific acts of violence will have. The kindergarden understanding of "no matter what you should never be violent unless someone is violent against you first" ignores the complexity of the ways that we can be victims of violence in this world or any concept of positive morality where violence will result from inaction.

Do you know anything about working-class history? Do you know where the 40 hour week/8 hour day standard comes from? Do you realize how violently people were exploited before there existed such a thing as modern "worker's rights"? Do you think this standard we benefit from today was accomplished by having everyone sing Kumbaya to their capitalist overlord? And on the flip side, do you think every non-violent protest was met with non-violent resistance from the state? Obviously fucking not.

Bait better. Everyone should disconnect from the news cycle from time to time - there is no shame in it and it isn't cowardice not to have an informed opinion on every fucking viral thing happening the world. You have no idea what I've been going through in my life that has made me remove all focus from the Twittersphere etc. You remind me of a kid in my Starcraft days who'd think that I'm dodging him because I have to go out with friends or eat dinner and am not accepting a rematch: "Of course you dodge, you know you'll lose - that strat you used won't work twice against me. Run, coward!!". Self-serving reasoning. You think way too highly of your beliefs and argumentative skills, my friend.

Bait better brah

Lol...

On November 12 2021 08:11 Stroggoz wrote: Show nested quote + On November 12 2021 06:12 blackjacki2 wrote: Of course Loco has no comment. We've been trying to tell him for years how violence begets violence and how it's stupid to support antifa or the "punch a nazi" type of tactics. It's a clear lack of understanding of how violence escalates. It doesn't end with punching, the other side comes back with pepper spray, then the other side hits people with bike locks and metal pipes, then guns get involved, and now you have people getting blasted with an AR-15. I'd also want no part of a debate that plainly reveals the end result of stupid beliefs I hold. The problem is the hypocrisy of most people that critique ANTIFA. I think what makes Loco have an aneurysm are the people that are critiquing Antifa for its violence and supporting far more violent ideologies at the same time. It's kinda like those people that say life is precious when arguing against abortion and then they invade a couple of countries and kill a million people. If that doesn't make you have an aneurysm then you really need to question your own apathy.

Yeah. And along these lines, you have to admit it is kind of funny (and worrying) that we have a person on this website (hiems) who has openly praised fascist dictators and that these people-- these voices of reason -- on liquidpoker who keep bleating that "the left is biased" were no where to be found to condemn him or express their disgust. A real mystery. What a lovely world we live in where "reasonable people" are more offended by those who hold the belief that punching Nazis is ok than they are offended by those who are not afraid to put their fascist beliefs on full display.

Yeah I mean our role model pacifist on this site said he'd "merely" sentence me to forced labour. (playing poker for the rest of my life) once he becomes a dictator. I guess he was being half-serious? There's no way to satire politics, because politics is satire in itself, under the black comedy genre.

On November 13 2021 03:13 Loco wrote: we have a person on this website (hiems) who has openly praised fascist dictators and that these people

lol you are reaching some serious hypocrisy levels my dictator praising friend.

Hiems is a just a major troll, you can't take what he says seriously either way. He's good at triggering people, too bad that you can't actually do anything valuable with that

On November 13 2021 01:48 Loco wrote: Show nested quote + On November 12 2021 06:12 blackjacki2 wrote: Of course Loco has no comment. We've been trying to tell him for years how violence begets violence and how it's stupid to support antifa or the "punch a nazi" type of tactics. It's a clear lack of understanding of how violence escalates. It doesn't end with punching, the other side comes back with pepper spray, then the other side hits people with bike locks and metal pipes, then guns get involved, and now you have people getting blasted with an AR-15. I'd also want no part of a debate that plainly reveals the end result of stupid beliefs I hold. Your response is a poorly thought-out bait attempt. I've been involved in many arguments on here discussing cases where violence escalated and I was paying attention to the news at the time and commented on them and my stance remained the same about Antifa. You seem to be even admitting to this by saying "we've been trying to get through to him for so long". So, what the fuck are you even talking about? What are the odds that there is something so unique about this case that would change anything? My guess is close to none. "Violence begets violence" is a trite saying that you learn in first grade. It's not some nugget of wisdom that flew over my head. Did defeating the Nazis ~with ViOLeNCe~ in WW2 lead to more violence, or more Nazis in the world, Mr. Smartpants? Things aren't always black and white in the world and there is no perfect rule of thumb that applies to every single situation. Sometimes when you try to avoid all violence in the short-term it leads to more violence in the long-term, and we are not gifted with omniscience so none of us can be absolutely certain about the effects that specific acts of violence will have. The kindergarden understanding of "no matter what you should never be violent unless someone is violent against you first" ignores the complexity of the ways that we can be victims of violence in this world or any concept of positive morality where violence will result from inaction. Do you know anything about working-class history? Do you know where the 40 hour week/8 hour day standard comes from? Do you realize how violently people were exploited before there existed such a thing as modern "worker's rights"? Do you think this standard we benefit from today was accomplished by having everyone sing Kumbaya to their capitalist overlord? And on the flip side, do you think every non-violent protest was met with non-violent resistance from the state? Obviously fucking not. Bait better. Everyone should disconnect from the news cycle from time to time - there is no shame in it and it isn't cowardice not to have an informed opinion on every fucking viral thing happening the world. You have no idea what I've been going through in my life that has made me remove all focus from the Twittersphere etc. You remind me of a kid in my Starcraft days who'd think that I'm dodging him because I have to go out with friends or eat dinner and am not accepting a rematch: "Of course you dodge, you know you'll lose - that strat you used won't work twice against me. Run, coward!!". Self-serving reasoning. You think way too highly of your beliefs and argumentative skills, my friend.

Unlike Baal I don't really care if you post here or not. But maybe it was foolish of me to think you would see the death of these 2 people as senseless instead of a couple comrades dying in an eternal battle of good vs evil. I hope they were able to have some solace in their final moments by being as delusional as you and thinking that attacking a 17 year old was their role in preventing the next holocaust and dying as heroes.

On November 13 2021 10:27 Spitfiree wrote: Hiems is a just a major troll, you can't take what he says seriously either way. He's good at trigger people, too bad that you can't actually do anything valuable with that

Yes, literally nobody here takes hiems seriously

On November 12 2021 20:44 Baalim wrote: Show nested quote + On November 12 2021 07:47 Stroggoz wrote: If it operates like shareholder ownership then it sounds like the current system, where a few people own all the shares and therefore make all the decisions. This is the opposite of 'decentralized' under any reasonable interpretation of what that word means. Wikipedia is a great idea but I can't see Sergey Brin and Larry Page spending a bunch of money on it once they buy up all the tokens. All of the major tech industries spend their investments in trying to find new ways to harvest data on people, like virtual reality for example. How does Wikipedia allow us to sell things to people? Currently, it doesn't, so it's a waste of money and time. Wikipedia is one of those rare examples of something being developed under capitalism despite the fact that it runs at a loss. I have nothing against this technology though, you could probably convince me that it has a decentralizing effect if people got one token each. In your leftist utopia workers own the workplace and make decisions about its future, giving a random guy across the world who has no knowledge or stake whatsoever as the an actual worker makes no sense. That idea of token distribution has been floated but it would require the biggest personal data collection in history, fuck that shit, a database of every human on earth so you can get your token, also these tokens would need to be untransferable, somehow when they die that token gets burned and when somebody is born one is minted lol, it's simply not feasible. Decentralization is a spectrum, from a single entity with absolute power being perfectly centralized to 7+billion majority consensus to be perfectly decentralized and as I explained above, perfect decentralization isn't ideal for the vast majority of protocols.

anarcho-syndicalism is a federated system. You elect delegates in the workplace, and those delegates themselves will vote with other delegates from other industries on certain policies. And the delegates can be recalled by their voters if they don't do a good job. So if exxon-mobil is affecting everyone's lives, the rest of the people in other industries would have a large say on its policy. I'm not sure what the exact best system would be but that's a general idea.

Not sure why you think any of that stuff is unfeasible since we have birth-certificates and mass data collection (voter registration) already. It's necessary to ensure fair elections and prevent voter fraud.