Family member's and scams

sounds to me like your a pussy. id chase everyone out of the house by appearing out of no where with a knife/bat screaming and cursing half in english and half in a jibberish. your half senile grandma will prob be mad or frightened but who gives a fuck, shel prob forget the next day anyway. after all, your protecting what u will inevitably inherit. you gotta ask yourself....do u wanna inherit 5 million or 50 grand.

and as for "respecting her decisions", you are not respecting her if your not protecting her fortune.

then id hang several signs on ur door and gate that say "beware of dogs"

she isn't in it to make money, but just enjoys all the attention and feels important about it. making her look stupid by convincing her its all a scam will only make her more stubborn imo. try agreeing with her decisions but subtely point out inconsistencies and holes in the salespersons pitch as if you were only curious how it all works, believe me once she sees you agree with her more, she will consult with you next time and you will gain control over her - that my friend is how old people operate. lol

On October 15 2010 10:13 whamm! wrote: she isn't in it to make money, but just enjoys all the attention and feels important about it. making her look stupid by convincing her its all a scam will only make her more stubborn imo. try agreeing with her decisions but subtely point out inconsistencies and holes in the salespersons pitch as if you were only curious how it all works, believe me once she sees you agree with her more, she will consult with you next time and you will gain control over her - that my friend is how old people operate. lol

your personality does not suit your name "whamm!". u should be more opt for the baseball bat idea of mine.

just teach her to play cards so she has something to do other than buying into scams

lol. hey night i know how that shit feels, ive been there man, trust me. what i said was the only thing that worked.

On October 15 2010 09:48 Night2o1 wrote: I just don't know what to do.

Just be creative with strategies on how to get her to understand. See what works, what doesnt, what fits her personality.

But the crux of the strategy imo is to keep at it and don't stop.

On October 15 2010 10:13 whamm! wrote: she isn't in it to make money, but just enjoys all the attention and feels important about it. making her look stupid by convincing her its all a scam will only make her more stubborn imo. try agreeing with her decisions but subtely point out inconsistencies and holes in the salespersons pitch as if you were only curious how it all works, believe me once she sees you agree with her more, she will consult with you next time and you will gain control over her - that my friend is how old people operate. lol

I hear you, and this is how I've approached it. But maybe I haven't been effective at it. I hate being or feeling even remotely deceitful or sneaky with her though.. idk. I will try again over time with what you've said fresh in my mind.

I also just don't know where to agree with her when its oh so much crap..

I dk what type of person your grandma is but mine is the bestest person ever! She definitely trusts anything I say so in my situation the conversation would go like this:

Grandma is meeting w/ scammer in kitchen:

Me: "yo, get the fuk out man, stop trying to scam my grandma"
Scammer: "huh?"
Grandma: "Hunny, what are you talking about dont curse at this man"
Me: "Nah grandma, this guy is a fukin scammer trying to take ur money, ive seen this crap before, trust me (KEY WORDS, TRUST ME)
Granda: "oh, really?'
Me: "Ya, really, now get the fuk out scammer before I beat ur face in"

On October 15 2010 10:30 YouGoTGoT wrote: I dk what type of person your grandma is but mine is the bestest person ever! She definitely trusts anything I say so in my situation the conversation would go like this: Grandma is meeting w/ scammer in kitchen: Me: "yo, get the fuk out man, stop trying to scam my grandma" Scammer: "huh?" Grandma: "Hunny, what are you talking about dont curse at this man" Me: "Nah grandma, this guy is a fukin scammer trying to take ur money, ive seen this crap before, trust me (KEY WORDS, TRUST ME) Granda: "oh, really?' Me: "Ya, really, now get the fuk out scammer before I beat ur face in"

BINGOOOOOO


USE VIOLENCE IF NEEDED.

If you need information on network marketing to back your arguments http://www.mlm-thetruth.com/ might help.

1.kill her and get the money...
2.
3.profit???

nah srsly old people never listen so you cant rly do anything

I gotta agree with Jsquids on dropping the bomb on the scammers. Maybe not as excessive but I'd be prettttty pissed if some random person tried to do that to my dad.

whamms strategy works for only somebody with a persuasive manipulating personality i would never do that personally id scare away the scammers, report them to the police etc.

Give me her number. Ill help................. 8)

just walk in and poo on the floor when hes giving his pitch.

it will distract your grandma and the salesman will leave.

over time she will become conditioned that everytime she lets a salesman into the house to give a pitch, you walk into the room and poop on the floor and she will no longer allow them into the house.

lol sam & others


so this is what's going on in this particular case.... this guy is selling an annuity product that is advertised to tie up your money in an investment for 10 years, but they don't tell you that at the end of that ten years you can't actually take the money out, you have to take it out at a very small % over the next TEN MORE years or you get very large penalties. I just showed this to my grandma and obviously she is more doubtful of what I say than what this salesguy says. My only choice now is to make him show us the surrender policy.. and I'm trying to show her that if he can't produce this document then she should drop out of this investment. She almost did all the paperwork at once just now for fuck's sake I had to work myself into the conversation and stuff to slow the process down. There are TONS of complaints even class action lawsuits have been brought against this company. Its amazing that my grandma doesn't find all of this very convincing so far..:/

If anyone (ie tenbagger etc) knows anything about the annuity products that "Allianz" sells and can give me some info I'd really appreciate it.

We're talking about $70k btw.

night if your grandma is a bit senile like mine you can actually get a court order to let someone else manage her money, i.e. your parents or another relative.
or proactively manage her money: i.e. give her just enough for living expenses every month with bigger expenses having to be approved/signed by another member of the family.

honestly just go to this guy and say get the fuck out. Be rude!

i was at the bank and this old guy wanted to open a new bank account because some scammers wanted to direct deposit money into his account. The old man was like "This is my only chance to win tickets to florida. I know it's probably a scam that's why I want to open a new bank account".

the tellers just told him no.

Baal how is calling the cops gonna work if those guys are legit but just dont present all the information to their customers the police wont be able to do anything
Also whamm your strategy probably works but in a longer period of time.It seems to me that Night needs a much more faster solution

Cant you just walk in and start asking questions that will ruin the salesman strategy?

Wow I just really fucked up and I wasn't thinking.. I'm REALLY worried after reading this:


"

Sharyn of Austin TX (03/19/07)
I met Larry B. on the pretense that he wanted to date me. Immediately he started to try to sell me Allianz Bonus Dex Annuities. This was in 2002 when my stocks were plummeting. The guarantee of no less than 3% on my money sounded good. I got very anxious though when it came time to notarize the papers. He became very angry with me and I felt threatened. So unfortunately I signed. I told him that I did not want to touch my equities and options. But I had signed an extra paper for another annuity. I was negligent in not getting the paper back from him. About a month later he called me from Dallas and said that I needed to get in on this great deal because the %age was going down in a couple of days. I was very ill at the time and I don't remember the whole conversation. I do know that I never gave him permission to sell the remainder of my stocks. About 2 weeks later I received information in the mail that all of my stocks had been sold, 113,000 worth at their lowest possible point. He had taken the paper, initialed it with his own initials, and dated it for the date the stocks were sold.

Read more: http://www.consumeraffairs.com/insurance/allianz_p5.html#ixzz12RsFE7dO

"

My grandma gave him the paper and information to write a letter to the company she is selling the stocks from for this investment (he said he's write the letter but not send it b4 she signed it, but this just seems wayyyyyyyyy too easy for him to do this without actual authorization from us). She signed several places on the paper work (I don't know why, I should of said WAIT don't sign anything until we're ready). This guy has all the information he needs to write a letter requesting the sale of her stocks and to place the money in this annuity.... I'm going tocall him right now and tell him to return that paper work.. but my grandma is still sold on this..and its my grandma's signature not mine on there.. I wonder if he will return it. I'm not going to try to call it all off without it being grandma's decision obviously.. but theres NO reason for him to have that paperwork with her signature and I don't know why I didn't bring that up when it happened.. he's smooth


btw gma isn't senile just extremely easy to lead on and deceive, standard for many older people especially

take point on this shit. get that money in a joint account or something so you at least have some control over it and dont let those fucks even talk to granny. if shes just lookin for attention and someone to talk to, get her a cellphone and give a list of family/friends to call and that will keep her busy.

also, if anyone is ever trying to 'sell' you a stock, 99% of the time its bullshit.

grandma is in full control of her faculties, I couldn't and I have no interest in taking any sort of direct control over her finances

fwiw i dont think he will let you call it off without your grandmas authorization.

but, maybe you can lure him back to the house then get the papers and destroy them.

but get on that shit asap - anything that is considered authorization will be processed and if its an amount like $70k he will be getting decent commission and in this economy everyones swinging for home runs like this.

Orchestrate a total collapse of her finances. Find copies of her bank statements and any other material she regularly looks at, and forge fake copies of it indicating that she has been robbed, is now broke, and will be out of her home in a month. Make her believe it was because of one of her recent endeavors, and now her life is destroyed due to her own gullibility. After she's in tears begging for forgiveness, telling you how right you were all along and how sorry she is not to have trusted you, tell her it was all a joke to let he realize what *will* happen if she doesnt stop fucking around.

well I just called him and he said he will come return the papers in 2 hours, I said cool (I said I was interested in reading it over again and learning some more about the industry, but specifically the things she signed). He was planning on coming back to meet my grandma and finalize the deal anyways btw. I dunno if I should of given him that 2 hours.

this is so hard cuz it is sort of a gray area.. I mean its obviously a bad investment and the product is crappy, but it isn't illegal.. just unethical. and its a huge chunk of money that he currently has the means to fiddle with now that she has her signature and shit.

what time is it at the moment?

I'd try and gather up as much objective evidence on this dude's company as possible and show it to your grandma. Tell her she should consider the risks when making such a large investment and that reading over a little history on her business partner would be prudent. If she doesn't want to even question this dude shes pretty much hopeless until she realizes she's been screwed.

1.47pm


ROFL I'm reading about the specific product he's selling and it may be like the nut low of this type of product.. the googling is unclear so far..

http://seniorjournal.com/NEWS/GuardWealth/2007/7-03-12-EquityIndexed.htm

its called the Masterdex 10 gonna see if I can find info about it

make sure you call him just before 2 hours and find out where hes at, if need be sound keen like its 90% go deal once he comes to finalise.

dont let him do the old "oh hey sorry i couldnt make it stuck in traffic" and skip out at 5pm.

also: regarding her not listening to you

what about taking her along to a financial advisor with some of these brochures of what theyre hocking to her and let him explain theyre junk

financial advisors are kind of junk themselves lol, most are very uneducated and are just dressed up salesmen for mutual funds and annuities



I'm going to use this post to collect information in the following spoiler, this is for my use... just a bunch of links for info I find that I will otherwise forget

+ Show Spoiler +

Yeah.. its pretty much 100% that at the end of this 10 year annuity we have to spend another 10-20 years withdrawing at 5% a year LOL CHRIST I Hope my grandma listens

Dude you need to man up when this fuck puddle comes creeping into your grandma's house. He's a scammer. Get the papers back, throw the shit you found on the internet in his face, see if he can defend his company, when he can't, tell him he's a scammer and to GTFO. ez game

aside: when I was in Mexico over the summer there was this slammin' hot teacher from Los Cabos that was friends with my uncle's wife, we went out for drinks and I was pretty sure I was gonna be hittin' it within that week. Come to find out she's in the Amway scheme and was probably just trying to get me/my family's hotel in on it. Bitch.

yeah I kind of deferred all of this to my uncle (my grandma's son), they have a good relationship and I think she will respect what he has to say more since he's older, I hope..

WHY IS THIS SO HARD?????? USE VIOLENCE WTF

CLOSE THREAD

wow night you gotta be fucking kidding me

you can't beat nl50 and sure thats whatever

but you're like doing nothing and watching your grandma get scammed out of SEVENTY THOUSAND DOLLARS. at your rate of playing nl50, it would take SEVENTY YEARS.

SO GET ON IT AND FUCKING PROTECT HER MONEY YOU DUMB SHIT

On October 15 2010 12:00 Night2o1 wrote: If anyone (ie tenbagger etc) knows anything about the annuity products that "Allianz" sells and can give me some info I'd really appreciate it. We're talking about $70k btw.

the company has a z at the end of its name. insta scam

Whats her address/phone number if you dont mind

oh my fucking god. If anyone tried to shit with my family it wouldn't even go half a smoothly as it is with your grandma. If you love your family then you gotta watch out for em. Sometimes they might not like it but tough shit.

I'm a firm believer in tough love. They might hate your guts temporarily but eventually they'll thank you later. And even if they don't and are too retarded to realize it later on then I guess there's no stopping them from getting fucked later too.

But regardless I feel as a close friend/relative/etc you are morally obligated to help him/her to the best of your ability and even to the point of them disagreeing/hating you. Does the little kid hate his mom for a day for not buying him that cool looking gun/knife/other dangerous toy/weapon? Or little boy hates mom/dad for not letting him/her eat that shitty food that'll destory his/her health?

gotta watch out for the people close to you man.

Lol

Ok, so I've spoken to the guy again and I got quite a lot more information. It actually looks like a very legitimate investment. Going to do a bit more looking around the intertoobs to double check and take a look at the paperwork.

Exalted you suck hard kid

On October 15 2010 16:21 Night2o1 wrote: Lol Ok, so I've spoken to the guy again and I got quite a lot more information. It actually looks like a very legitimate investment. Going to do a bit more looking around the intertoobs to double check and take a look at the paperwork. Exalted you suck hard kid

Are you sure he didn't just smoothtalk/scam you right in your face?

that is why I'm still going to research this specific product

On October 15 2010 16:21 Night2o1 wrote: Lol Ok, so I've spoken to the guy again and I got quite a lot more information. It actually looks like a very legitimate investment. Going to do a bit more looking around the intertoobs to double check and take a look at the paperwork. Exalted you suck hard kid

a "legitimate" investment doesn't mean it's a good investment vehicle.

You'd be 1000x better off by just shoving the money into iShare ETF's or something.
If the bond market didn't completely blow ass right now, that would be an option too since she is an elderly person - though her strategy would depend on whether her financial goals are to provide for herself, or to leave the maximum possible amount to her descendants.

On October 15 2010 12:29 Bigbobm wrote: also, if anyone is ever trying to 'sell' you a stock, 99% of the time its bullshit.

I'd go so far as to say it's 100%.

its an annuity, not a stock

yes I know there are other investment options, she wants to do an annuity and it fits her needs

well, idk how much this product pays per year, but for instance, a preferred stock ETF pays 7.5% in dividends atm.
Not saying you should buy this product I mention, but there are a lot of alternatives :O.

(also consider taxation issues too!)

I hear ya This honestly seems like a very reasonable investment and if the terms are as described I'm happy. Its actually the MasterDex X, not the masterdex 10 and there is a big difference... still going to google it up for an hour or two this weekend to make sure

On October 15 2010 15:13 bane wrote: Show nested quote + On October 15 2010 12:00 Night2o1 wrote: If anyone (ie tenbagger etc) knows anything about the annuity products that "Allianz" sells and can give me some info I'd really appreciate it. We're talking about $70k btw. the company has a z at the end of its name. insta scam

Allianz is a pretty big company lol unless he just using the name to scam idk

double post

On October 15 2010 18:22 Mortensen88 wrote: Show nested quote + On October 15 2010 15:13 bane wrote:   On October 15 2010 12:00 Night2o1 wrote: If anyone (ie tenbagger etc) knows anything about the annuity products that "Allianz" sells and can give me some info I'd really appreciate it. We're talking about $70k btw. the company has a z at the end of its name. insta scam Allianz is a pretty big company lol

yeah its a massive company, but neither I nor my grandma had ever heard of it lol. I'm pretty sure their name is not well known around these parts.

omg night has been scammed as well

somebody poop in his room

massive company doesnt mean all their products are sound either.

Definitely look at what fees you're being charged for. 99% of the time you'll see outrageous maintenance and management fees, even in investment instruments that shouldn't even need them...

lol night, although i worded my advice harshly, it would be prudent to get your act together since fucking this up would be a much larger decision than "getting it allin with AK vs AA [for the nth time] and crying about it"

tough love man, tough love

go watch glengarry glen ross (a movie about salespeople) and maybe you'll understand where I'm coming from. matchstick men is an OK watch too.

people need to earn a living (i.e. the person selling to your grandma) and it would be a shame to have you write a blog post 3 months from now saying you got scammed and how you are so ul and the world hates you etc. i know it would sure as hell tilt the shit out of me