200nl tough spot vs nit - Page 2

Ye and I will jump on the train that says that we should fold flop or turn at least if we are pitching this river

Edit: Which implies never folding blank river.

he may have SC and missed FD on river
I think he would bet 88 a lot of time on the turn to get value from monsters (because you can check behind AA on turn vs. him)

i think you can fold......im just not sure where. but i think you have to fold somewhere.

this is never KQ/KJ imo.

seriously,don't fullring nits ever spazz? what he reps is ridiculously small

lol FR.

looks like a FH that knows you cant fold a king almost always

I agree that he's never KQ/KJ, but putting him on just 3 combo's that played fast right from the start is gross. I think his range is more polarized towards 88, maybe AK, and something like JTs missed fd. Nits definitely spaz out and if he's shown any indications of being on tilt or off his normal game this session I'd further lean towards calling.

fold flop and keep the day a happy one.

On January 19 2010 14:47 Maynard! wrote: I'd probably fold on flop to be honest w/ you.

I can't tell if this is a level, but I probably do fold flop vs this guy.

def fold river tho

Even nits can spazz out.. They are completely aware of their image and i think this is the perfect board for them to pull the trigger. They know we have 1010, JJ, QQ, AA, Kx and are most likely folding to a river shove vs THEM.
As said before we only need to be good 33% of the time to break even... I call

i call this down ;0
btw your read on this player blows

even against a super pesimistic range of 88/AK/KQs (only KQs not KQo) its a slightly +EV call

yea this is pretty nasty imo, but it feels so weak to fold.. only 88 beat us and u would expect him to slowplay some % of the time w that too so its just so unlikely that he would have it T_T but no one is bluffing here so, dunno, vs some regs id fold here honestly

for you who dont play fr, should not comment on this its different from SH play

I would certainly call even if he's quite nitty, it seems standard (yes nit will certainly spazz esp if they haven't had shit for a while). Just too bad if he has boat seriously, this isn't even deep.

ofc they do spazz sometimes, but the fact is basically his range is 88/AK + % spazzout. i dont think his % spazzout makes up for our lack of equity against his range.

mr. longple "for you who dont play fr, should not comment on this", just because you play a certain game dosnt make you an expert at it.. if you understand poker you can correctly analize any situation, if your not good you cant comment on anything

just because 100% of your play is full ring does not make you an expert, i would not want to hear the advice of 95%+ of the regulars I play with on a daily basis

the nittyness at 200 fr is ridiculous guys. For the 400nl+ 6max regs, play 200 fr for a few days and youll completely understand why this is a very close spot. If your calling its for a split, plain and simple, a weak tight 12/9 never plays kq this way.

I used to play FR exclusively and I've been dabbling in it recently. Something about not having to pay blinds, ever pretty much, takes away anyones need to get it in light. There are still lots of fish and people will still hero call so people seem to just sit and wait for nuts. I was pretty much close to 100% serious when I said fold flop. Realistically, against a 12/9 who is calling your UTG raise, you're against a pure bluff, AK(unsure if they'd raise) or 88. Against that range you just simply need to fold.

You might say to yourself, wait that doesn't make sense. If people always have nuts here why wouldn't people just represent nuts w/ air. I'd respond, good question fine sir, but there are two things that'll prevent that. The first being the fact that people still hero and he knows that he's up against a very tight range. He'll know that you know that he's only representing 1 single hand and you will level yourself into not folding AK or JJ+. He expects you to fight w/ premium pockets and probably go to town w/ AK.

Secondly and most importantly, HEM HUD destroys games. It destroys both but FR much moreso than SH. If a 12/9 started doing moves like raising the flop w/ crap his stats would start to change. His raise cbet would rise. If he were the type to mix it up he would also not play 12/9. He would play much looser. It really is as simple as seeing his stats as 12.9, looking at his cold call CO, then looking at his raise cbet, and making your decision based on that.

So I say again, on the flop you're against a small % of time that guy is bluffing, 88 and AK. You cant even put KQ in his preflop range really. Him playing KQ here would be as likely as him playing K8. In theory against a 12.9 multi-tabling nit, who called an UTG raise, I'd say fold. If you're going to be ahead in this spot you'll just simply know for sure that AK is good (Due to changes in actions).

Edit: It might change based on your stats. I'm guessing tho you're raising UTG tight (88+, AK, AQs) and not cbetting 100% of hands. If you are things might change.

On January 20 2010 20:24 TalentedTom wrote: mr. longple "for you who dont play fr, should not comment on this", just because you play a certain game dosnt make you an expert at it.. if you understand poker you can correctly analize any situation, if your not good you cant comment on anything just because 100% of your play is full ring does not make you an expert, i would not want to hear the advice of 95%+ of the regulars I play with on a daily basis

i was mostly targetting the

"LOLOLOLOL NIT LOL INSTACALL" nobrainer comments

obv a good pokermind can help alot in this situation since they can adjust their brain enough for a FR example poker is poker, that was not what i meant

i dunno why u felt so attacked and had to attack me, i didnt mean anything really?

im just saying this example imo is nothing to laugh about cuz its "nitty" it is actually pretty close spot

(imo, without trying to sound like an FR expert)

well don't say "for you who don't play FR don't comment" then.

why not target the speicific replies instead, the ones you felt were bad and ignorant.

anyway - isnt KQs in villains range in these spots?