Politics thread (USA Elections 2016) - Page 166

We have gone over this already, you don't understand the very concept of a post-scarcity economy. The promise of a post-scarcity society is only that everyone can have their basic needs met, which is absolutely possible currently, materially speaking. It isn't about distributing the "current resources" equally, and it certainly has nothing to do with distribution under the current wasteful system. Also, you don't have a statistical understanding of what the currently available resources are, because it's not possible. They vary depending on the man-power and the technologies (and the visionary input) that would be used to access or generate them. The main obstacle of a post-scarcity society is extremely unlikely to be a lack of material resources, but rather a lack of visionary thinking and collective know-how. Those remain serious problems standing in the way and it's foolish to think they can be surmounted rapidly, but equally foolish to not work towards it because it appears very distant.

I can't be projecting because projection is an unconscious process. I have consciously and openly admitted that I have had a loveless life, at least as far as proximal human relationships went. It isn't the case anymore though, and even when it was, I still had the love of music, wisdom and literature: the indirect and distal love of those people who poured themselves into their works for my benefit. That counts for something. The love that you have experienced and the love that I am speaking of are not the same.

You don't join the Zapatistas or the SDF just because you want to. That conception comes out of an hyper-individualistic mindset. You don't join a revolution because you want to, you join a revolution because you are wanted and needed. That isn't always the case. And sometimes you are more needed elsewhere. That has been the case for me. The YPJ and the YPG aren't accepting many foreigners now, and for a long time they wouldn't even let them fight because enough had died and they felt like it was too much bad attention and they needed to protect foreigners more than their own. I know people who have went to Syria and just waited for half a year or more at the Academy doing little to nothing, and that was with ISIS still holding territory. They might not be on their couch at home but a lot of them spend their time gaming on their laptops at the Academy. I wouldn't feel useful there even if they accepted me (they wouldn't). What they need the most right now are not people like me lining up at the Academy, they need people with special skills that I don't have, resources to deal with the ISIS members they are holding and in order to support their farmers whose fields are frequently burned by ISIS/the Turkish gov. And of course they need people spreading the word and supporting their revolution however they can from wherever they are.

I only learned recently that I could make a trip and live in a Zapatista caracol for some time and learn some Spanish there and definitely want to go, but I have another more important trip lined up that I am making soon now that I am healthy again and able to travel.

Lots of people in North Korea don't feel oppressed. They believe their lives are in service of a great man who has sacrificed a lot for them. Just because you don't believe that you have been atomized or that your life has been negatively shaped by forces out of your control doesn't mean that it hasn't been. It has. It's just that you first have to be able to conceptualize it and have the experience of something else in order to know it, but you've been deprived of that. You might not suffer much, because you are well-adjusted to that narrow sphere of living and well-adapted to indifference, but I think the price you pay for existing in that narrow range is that you're underdeveloped and unable to appreciate life's greatest joys as a result.

Ah fan of cancel culture, what a surprise.

That has absolutely nothing to do with "cancel culture". You're just throwing buzzwords around again. Cancel culture is mostly about internet outrage and shaming celebrities. It's a basic human behavior to prepare for and react to negative social feedback. As social animals we absolutely hate feeling rejected and ashamed and we tend to conform accordingly, it's part of our instinct of self-preservation. Receiving negative criticism from friends because you are being shitty =/= getting "cancelled". One of those mental shortcuts at work again. "Something I disliked reading from Loco --> better associate it with some anti-SJW term I read online."

Didn't you post an article claiming there was no such thing as lazyness? haha

Yes, in the context of not wanting to or being able to adapt to hierarchical structures of domininance.

north koreans may not feel oppressed but as someone who has lived in a beverly hills mansion and had to go back to upper middle class suburbia I've begun to understand true deprivation

On September 30 2019 03:59 Baalim wrote: So brave of ANTIFA

That's two or three individuals acting like assholes towards an old lady with shitty politics who is attending a far-right rally, not "antifa". A rational individual knows that every single group or movement has assholes with poor impulse control in them and they don't take a sample of a few individuals to claim that they're representative of a movement as a whole.

in before "you are sharing the tweets of gamer-gaters!, you are spreading white supremacy

It's quite worse than that, I'm afraid. It's no coincidence that (again) the video has originated from an alt-right twitter account (thinGrayLine) and is being shared by the usual suspects (fascists and their amplifiers like Ngo and that Hitler praising dude you took it from). It's the same account that recently interacted with and boosted Shaun Walker, a recently ousted Neo-Nazi from the PPC who used to be a member of National Alliance (a neo-Nazi, Holocaust denial group). PPC is the same far-right group that is being protested in the clip.

Continually the strategy of far-right propagandists and Neo-Nazis on social media is to make use of the outlier bias in such a way so that useful idiots like you associate antifa with everything bad, and by contrast associate these guys with far-right views and ties to Neo-Nazi groups as the good side/counter to antifa. It works. It is just one process of a chain reaction that predictably leads to more right-wing radicalization and violence. You claim to be against political violence but you gladly participate in the process of creating more of it by sharing these videos from these sources with the exact message that they want you to share.

Wonder how many people have been killed or harmed today by far-right extremists. A couple radical left-wing teenagers yelling at rich old lady with shitty politics: real shit though.

On September 30 2019 07:40 Loco wrote: A rational individual knows that every single group or movement has assholes with poor impulse control in them and they don't take a sample of a few individuals to claim that they're representative of a movement as a whole.

that's obv true but it's also an inherent weakness of such movements (that don't have official representatives, specific policies etc)
It seems impossible to guard your reputation or win vs targeted and well thought out propaganda. Not only that, but it's hard for the people who disagree with those harassing the old right wing lady to feel responsible, courageous or certain about fighting off this sort of behavior right when it's happening, because they could be accused of being "movement cops" or because what's acceptable behavior is just not clearly defined.

It's impossible to guard your reputation against people that don't have critical thinking regardless... if you associate a movement based on a single unit then you're most likely reacting emotionally or being dumb, there s really no 2 ways around it. Its the most common fallacy known to mankind

If A is B, and some B are C, then all A are C ...

the fact that such a fallacy is so common shows that having a way to win the propaganda game is crucial, such movements seem like they will always struggle on that area unless something unexpected happens

Propaganda is not won by abusing fallacies, since they exist for both sides so its EV0. There's practically two ways IMO - one you are extremely lucky and have the perfect timing matching your agenda e.g. Hitler he built a reputation for the Anschluss over decades, while that "fruit" was riping in Germany since WW1 (Germans were extremely frustrated for 2 decades cause of losing the previous one - people tend to either not even know what WW2 was about or simply forget), in a dark way that is probably the best timing anyone could get.

Or you have enough power to create artificial problems e.g. war on drugs, war on terrorism, war on [insert random shit] in the US (except there you also have the illusion of 'free market' even though mass media are controlled by a bunch of people all representing the same caste, even if they push different agenda)

That doesn't mean such movements are bound to fail making a change though there're plenty of examples that prove me wrong, its just rather unlikely, but you know.. for every Gandhi there's probably thousands of dead Indians that failed.

I agree, the far-right is definitely winning the online propaganda war, but it hasn't translated to winning in the streets, which is all that matters to antifa. They are not interested in electoral politics, so they have no reason to care about winning over the general public. It's also not necessary to be a majority if there is an insurrection which is how antifa want to change society. Revolutions don't succeed because everyone or even a majority of the population actively participates in overthrowing an oppressive regime, but because the armed forces of the old order and the population at-large are no longer willing to defend it against a militant and resolute minority. For that purpose, it's better to have one person who is willing to be part of an insurrection than 100 loudmouths who are only ever going to be "politically engaged" behind their keyboards.

It's true that it's difficult to control for these kinds of excesses, as they exist in a gray area for a lot of activists. I have to admit the whole thing is extremely funny to me though. Right-wing Twitter outrage is truly hilarious. On a scale of bad, shouting at an old right-wing lady is like 1/10-2/10, but they blow it up to epic proportions. Some people are like: "oh my god, I'm not going to be surprised once antifa members start getting killed... after seeing this, they really have it coming!". They are so much like the "SJWs" they love to hate: proportionality is an alien concept to them.

Anyway, I don't want to resume posting regularly here. Have fun peeps.

Yeah, Twitter is basically a perfect design for propaganda. It's messages being limited to several characters, you can only argue with short paragraphs and video clips. This is why the right excells on it i guess, (and the sjw types as well).

Youtube as well. In general the whole online platform is effective for propaganda, there are zero intellectual standards. Anyone can say what they want. and it's all open to algorithmic manipulation as well. Where as at least in a university or a news media there for the most part some actual standards, even with the clear ideological biases, the standards are well above the online social media platforms. The right seem to have this idea that universities coddle students, in reality your held to standards there. the one's that are coddled are people making video's on youtube with millions of viewers, they don't have to pay attention to criticism, there is no repurcussion in being wrong about anything.

On September 30 2019 21:39 Loco wrote: I agree, the far-right is definitely winning the online propaganda war, but it hasn't translated to winning in the streets, which is all that matters to antifa. They are not interested in electoral politics, so they have no reason to care about winning over the general public. It's also not necessary to be a majority if there is an insurrection which is how antifa want to change society. Revolutions don't succeed because everyone or even a majority of the population actively participates in overthrowing an oppressive regime, but because the armed forces of the old order and the population at-large are no longer willing to defend it against a militant and resolute minority. For that purpose, it's better to have one person who is willing to be part of an insurrection than 100 loudmouths who are only ever going to be "politically engaged" behind their keyboards. It's true that it's difficult to control for these kinds of excesses, as they exist in a gray area for a lot of activists. I have to admit the whole thing is extremely funny to me though. Right-wing Twitter outrage is truly hilarious. On a scale of bad, shouting at an old right-wing lady is like 1/10-2/10, but they blow it up to epic proportions. Some people are like: "oh my god, I'm not going to be surprised once antifa members start getting killed... after seeing this, they really have it coming!". They are so much like the "SJWs" they love to hate: proportionality is an alien concept to them. Anyway, I don't want to resume posting regularly here. Have fun peeps.

But you are an SJW who also advocate for "corrective violence" and think clapping is triggering lol.

Anyway about anarchists or antifa not doing harm:

Mexican left-wing anarchist trashed many businesses on the street, burned down a library with the employees inside (apparently the emplyees survived) while chanting "reading is burgeous" , our leftist preisdent the next day told to the press that they weren't leftists, that they were conservatives because burning books is a conservative tactic LOL

Trump's media team stepping it up:

Trump withdraws support from Kurds... Turkey will be going into North Syria - fuckin hell

It was always just a matter of time, Turkey have been poised to invade for 8+ months and it has been especially apparent in the last month that they were about to. Like I said before, the last thing Trump will ever support is a working socialist society, the US could never be trusted to remain allied with the Kurds' struggle, but the SDF had no choice. Possibly their only chance was an international no-fly zone on the authority of the UN security council enforced by another country. Now not only did the US withdraw, but they also had the SDF remove fortifications from the border to weaken them against the upcoming Turkish invasion. This is shaping to be a massive genocide.

Armenian Genocide 2.0

First Turkey has to get rid of the intellectuals. It may be more difficult in today's world. Although they still can probably get away with it without most of the world knowing about it.

...

First bombing took place a few hours ago. "The Turkish bombing took place near Khanke which is an Ezidi village and near a refugee camp that holds many orphanages of the ISIS genocide."

"I've told President Ergogan I hope he's going to treat everybody with respect," Trump says in reply to a reporter's question in a room with military leaders.

On October 07 2019 22:44 Loco wrote: It was always just a matter of time

I thought (and still do) that if not for any other reasons, at least for geopolitical the Kurds are a strong ally to have there, gives the USA another way to control the region.

Hopefully, this piece of shit Erdogan will get overthrown soon, he s already losing his positions in Turkey, but I wouldn't be surprised if he enforces martial law at some point.

On October 07 2019 23:00 RiKD wrote: First Turkey has to get rid of the intellectuals. It may be more difficult in today's world. Although they still can probably get away with it without most of the world knowing about it.

They've been doing that for years. People have been thrown in jails or pushed towards immigration, while religion has been pushed in the very core of the "educational" system.

Obviously they won't be doing a Pinochet like clear-up. There is no way you can get away from that


The problem is the Kurds are an immediate threat to Turkey's borders in the eyes of Erdogan. This looks like the same situation Finland was in with Russia pre WW2. Except its not just geopolitical issues, there s major belief and cultural difference and hate building up for decades...

cant we just nuke em all