Real Conspiracy(healthcare bill) - Page 2

i believe the next things lets see if anyone disagrees:

- The current healthcare system is fucked, the prices are ridiculous so sick ppl without insurance have a death sentence, while all companies try to do is to dodge paying bills of insured people on technicalities.

- Functional free healthcare is possible as we can see in some european countries.

- The united states is currently sunken in corruption and passing through one of the worst crisis in its history with an unprecedented deficit and a massive government and an inflation that doesnt seem to stop.


Thats why free healthcare in USA right now is a terrible choice, just think about it, the government is drowning in debt spending money it doesnt have, printing money to bail out their corrupt corporate friends, and you are advocating that they spend another trillion in healthcare? Your current economy cannot withstand it, it is going to collapse that is certain.

UK NHS ftw!

goddamn capaneo i thought u had quit LP

although i knew this thread was you before i clicked it

On December 21 2009 05:10 Baal wrote: Your current economy cannot withstand it, it is going to collapse that is certain.

quoting for future inyourfacements

lolzcapaneo

agree w/ baal cept our economy wont collapse...national healthcare of somekind is possible for the US and is long over due. We will find a way to pay for it fine...just have china bail us out again or something

the biggest critics of universal health care have a direct economic interest in the privatized system.

they also have an overwhelming inability to even remotely look into and consider opinions of neighboring governments who employ such a plan. i'm yet to hear many citizens/subjects of the UK or Canada actually tell me any real personal stories of devastation or suggesting they would prefer a privatized system.

i find it odd that the only people who i talk to who seem overwhelmingly in support of a private system live in a country presently employing one and garner most of their information from said countries media.

hello Canadian and UK LP'ers, please do tell me the reasons you wish to have private health care in your countries over the present system?

On December 21 2009 09:28 palak wrote: agree w/ baal cept our economy wont collapse...national healthcare of somekind is possible for the US and is long over due. We will find a way to pay for it fine...just have china bail us out again or something

Rome falls

On December 21 2009 00:34 WRAWRAWRAWRA wrote: IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIINBOU

hahah, great anime

On December 21 2009 04:06 ShaperofDreams wrote: Also education about the politics/actions and informed opinions very very very rarely exist. To really have an informed opinion you have to..well you cant unless you are a leet hacker i guess.

This.

Unfortunately, what is being done in DC right now is not universal health care.

What it is is just another spending package. Period. They start with a price tag (read that as a budget amount the president will let us spend) and then try to spend it in a way they can sell to their constituents as reform.

This bill is going to make health care cost more for everyone. There will be a small minority who directly benefit from it, I'm sure, but the price tag is so high, you might as well just give those people cash.

Most of what this bill is intended to do can be done with regulation and without spending a trillion dollars, dollars which Baal has correctly pointed out we simply don't have, and are just printing money to pay for, which will have consequences similar to what we experienced in the mid to late seventies.

Once again, the debate is framed in a way that misses the point. I can be for universal health care and against this bill, because this bill is not even close to universal health care. And the argument that doing something (this bill, for instance) is better than doing nothing is completely ridiculous.

On December 21 2009 11:17 nolan wrote: the biggest critics of universal health care have a direct economic interest in the privatized system. they also have an overwhelming inability to even remotely look into and consider opinions of neighboring governments who employ such a plan. i'm yet to hear many citizens/subjects of the UK or Canada actually tell me any real personal stories of devastation or suggesting they would prefer a privatized system. i find it odd that the only people who i talk to who seem overwhelmingly in support of a private system live in a country presently employing one and garner most of their information from said countries media. hello Canadian and UK LP'ers, please do tell me the reasons you wish to have private health care in your countries over the present system?

capaneo's original post is a troll right?

anyone who is against public health care is basically a horribly selfish person, regardless of if they realize it

some people do get sick, and some of those people don't have money. hell, some of those people are children.

argue with that


oh and also, some of the posts about the 1 am vote being "against the spirit of democracy" is ridiculous. xenocidegs explained why

LOL HEY GAIZ IT'S OKAY BECAUSE BUSH SPENT MORE.

On December 21 2009 14:13 asdf2000 wrote: anyone who is against public health care is basically a horribly selfish person

Or they believe that the efficiency/incentive gains from a private health care system trump the importance of covering every single person.

cap this is totally standard procedure and it's not like it was some secret, they've been saying forever that the vote was gonna be done before xmas so really we have 3 days, obviously it's gonna happen sometime now, and 1am votes before holidays are totally standard procedure. What would be BS is doing last minute changes before the 1am vote that no one had a chance to review. I didn't hear anything like that happening, but that's what they did to get poker and the UIGEA into the port security bill.

As for how horrible this is for the nation, that's a different discussion and I totally disagree with you - without a doubt in my mind this is a great thing and I'm very happy that the bill is going through. It's not perfect, it needs changes, and it won't solve all of our problems, but it's progress in the right direction. As for the financial results, this is huge for SAVING money, as a huge chunk of the forecasted deficit is related to medical expenses and this bill addresses them. So passing this bill reduces the projected deficit, which is a good thing.

"For all those who are continually carping about how this is somehow a big spending government bill, this cuts our deficit by $132 billion the first 10 years, and by over a trillion in the second," Obama said. "That argument that opponents are making against this bill does not hold water."

its basically like any other issue involving a large chunk of money. there are the ones benefiting from same old routine, status quo and then there are the scavangers, reaking benefit were oportunity lies. same with climate, same with terrorism, same with healthcare, same with agriculture.

the wheel keeps on spinning.

On December 21 2009 11:17 nolan wrote: the biggest critics of universal health care have a direct economic interest in the privatized system. they also have an overwhelming inability to even remotely look into and consider opinions of neighboring governments who employ such a plan. i'm yet to hear many citizens/subjects of the UK or Canada actually tell me any real personal stories of devastation or suggesting they would prefer a privatized system. i find it odd that the only people who i talk to who seem overwhelmingly in support of a private system live in a country presently employing one and garner most of their information from said countries media. hello Canadian and UK LP'ers, please do tell me the reasons you wish to have private health care in your countries over the present system?

this, Xenocidegs, and k2o4, thanks for talking some sense... I don't have the energy or desire after dealing with this ignorance every day with my family.

On December 21 2009 11:34 ToTehEastSide wrote: Show nested quote + On December 21 2009 11:17 nolan wrote: the biggest critics of universal health care have a direct economic interest in the privatized system. they also have an overwhelming inability to even remotely look into and consider opinions of neighboring governments who employ such a plan. i'm yet to hear many citizens/subjects of the UK or Canada actually tell me any real personal stories of devastation or suggesting they would prefer a privatized system. i find it odd that the only people who i talk to who seem overwhelmingly in support of a private system live in a country presently employing one and garner most of their information from said countries media. hello Canadian and UK LP'ers, please do tell me the reasons you wish to have private health care in your countries over the present system?

yea well i rather wait 5 hours + then pay 20k because my insurer has a clause for skateboarding accidents.