How to play TT preflop - Page 3

tomson has a point

zzz

as dumb as tom is somtimes

he > weak tight pussies like 87% of the people here

My question is, if you were in the "zone" and put him exactly on AK why not flat call the raise and see a flop? You put it all-in preflop and you let AK see 5 cards to pair instead of seeing 3 cards to pair. I don't mind the original raise, but when you get reraised you should just call. If your opponent is a tight / passive / solid player, the re-reraise makes a little bit more sense (especially if your putting him on AK), because a tight / passive player will either smooth call or muck (even if your table image is loose / wild, 3 bets preflop usually merits a lot of respect in any ring game table). Obviously this poor boy wasn't "tight" or "passive" and if you knew from previous action that he overplays hands like this, why do you let him have an even edge on you in a coinflip when you can make him make a bigger mistake on the flop.

I'm not the type of poker player who likes huge preflop action, as I love seeing flops and playing after flops. The original hand posted isn't educated poker, it's stupid gambling on by both players. I hope no one learns anything from this...

Tom i think you're a good player, you just haven't had a really bad run yet.

On March 17 2006 14:33 Fraser wrote: Tom i think you're a good player, you just haven't had a really bad run yet.

hmm apparently you have not seen any of my legendary tilt streaks (anyone who's played with me knows) I have my tilt 100% under control now so that's overwith but a bad run for me i drop 10-13 buy ins ins in one day that was in the past, i cant immagine losing this much anymore im much better now than i was back then.

Don't make that statement cause the bad runs ive had are ridicilous, im one of the most overbankrolled players at the stakes i play. that's why it looks like i dont care about the money. I just focus on the poker and make whatever play i feel is correct instead of worring about losing a certain # of $$

i had no idea this thread would turn into a penis measuring contest... jeez

what did you expect?

theres some interesting discussion about your hand too so itll stay open for a bit

On March 17 2006 14:20 JonnyCosMo wrote: My question is, if you were in the "zone" and put him exactly on AK why not flat call the raise and see a flop? You put it all-in preflop and you let AK see 5 cards to pair instead of seeing 3 cards to pair. I don't mind the original raise, but when you get reraised you should just call. If your opponent is a tight / passive / solid player, the re-reraise makes a little bit more sense (especially if your putting him on AK), because a tight / passive player will either smooth call or muck (even if your table image is loose / wild, 3 bets preflop usually merits a lot of respect in any ring game table). Obviously this poor boy wasn't "tight" or "passive" and if you knew from previous action that he overplays hands like this, why do you let him have an even edge on you in a coinflip when you can make him make a bigger mistake on the flop. I'm not the type of poker player who likes huge preflop action, as I love seeing flops and playing after flops. The original hand posted isn't educated poker, it's stupid gambling on by both players. I hope no one learns anything from this...

You had a great read tom, but this guy has a very good point. NH

Mr.Cosmo - I played it like this because when I feel I have an edge, I will push it as far as I can, that's how I play poker. You obviously don't agree with this theres nothing wrong with that I don't expect many people to. Most of the hands I now-a-days are simple demonstrations of me trusing my reads, I hope to inspire other players to do so... I may swear a lot and maybe sound mean but I'm a nice guy being honest and always giving my 2 cents. I try to polish my game a lot instead of puting people on a massive range of hands (eg 6-8 hands and then calculating how my hand matches up against each one) I try and determine straight up just WTF can these guys have exactly and I base my play on this. I play like this because I've spend THOUSANDS (literly) of dollars looking people up in $50NL I spend a ton of time at that stage polishig my skills rather than jumping up levels ASAP... That's why I didn't leave 50NL untill I had a BR of $5000 and a massive BB/100 I was by no means a marginal winner.

A push like this may be stupid for someone with 20-25 buy-ins but since I've accumilated a BR which allows me to play the way I've always wanted to and be able to withstand any varience. I agree it's MUCH safer to just flat call and push on any flop that has no AK or Q but I decide to not give any free cards when I feel I'm ahead... it's just the style of poker I play. On another note the next 4-5 times I push preflop will be with premium hands eg. AA-QQ and a play like this + many other stunts I pull gives other players the confidence to go deep against me with much lesser holdings.

your momma

you da bomb diggity, yo.

this hand is hilarious... reminds me of the first time i ever got pocket 10's.

this is awful play and i don't care what anybody says. two minraises pre-flop?? if you think he has air then just put him all-in pre-flop after the first re-raise. there's no fucking way you "read" that he had AK after a pre-flop 3-bet.

i assume you use pokertracker talentedtom?

feel free to bring up the session and paste all the previous hands here that the other kid played which hinted you to this "killer read" on him.

until you do that, its only reasonable to assume this is a case of, as tomson said, "results-oriented dumbass got lucky and thinks he made an awesome play"

Tom, there's a difference between tilting and running bad...

TalentedTom I'm all about trusting reads and going with it. I won't doubt that you put him on AK here... but think about your play. If you knew he had AK, and he's a bad player, and you have a greater edge over him, why in the world do you nullify your own edge over this boy by putting it all-in on a coinflip against him? Your like 55% / 45% to win TT vs AK before the flop when after the flop (assuming he doesn't pair which he won't 2/3 of the time) you'll be %75 / %25 over him, and if he calls your all-in on the flop then he's making a much bigger mistake than if he does it before the flop.

I can only wonder if you would have posted this hand if the board came:

On March 18 2006 12:25 Ket wrote: i assume you use pokertracker talentedtom? feel free to bring up the session and paste all the previous hands here that the other kid played which hinted you to this "killer read" on him. until you do that, its only reasonable to assume this is a case of, as tomson said, "results-oriented dumbass got lucky and thinks he made an awesome play"

ive been playing against this guy since 25NL

so please go ahead and explain at what point exactly in the preflop betting you rule out higher pp and work out it has to be AK, and what he'd have done differently at that point with JJ/QQ or KK/AA. is there something else involved like how long he takes to think as well? until you reasonably clear this up (without making up answers) it remains pretty hard to believe this "feeling" of yours that narrows his range down to exactly one hand is good instead of lucky guess

Ok so if he has AKo your slightly ahead by like 2% and racing vs a guy who is basically giving his $ away. So if his hands are AA KK QQ JJ AK..... that means you have to be right like 85% of the time for this to be a winning play and even when you are theres a 50% chance to lose your $ in a very rare situation that does not happen often at all. Now if you have some folding value by moving all in I could understand this play, but you had none after he put half his chips in. Also I fail to see how making this play vs anyone willing to go all in with AKo is good. The only way you can push here is if you know 95% of the time the guy does not play PP's this aggressivly and would have just called your reraise on the flop to slow play a little.

But hey toms a cool guy so who gives a shit.