Thoughts (again) - Page 2

On November 01 2016 04:35 RiKD wrote: Show nested quote + On November 01 2016 00:54 Big_Rob_isback wrote: Ya for bipolar I just wanted to kind of resubmit my point about staying away from vipassana meditation. Even training monks will completely stop meditation and rest in nature if they have a psychological break. There is a lot of foo foo on meditation, it is serious shit if you are not in the right place for it. Anyone meditating should also have a teacher at least at the beginning. Wish you well What are your experiences involving the topic of acquiring and having and practicing with a meditation teacher? What are your suggestions on this topic?

Hey Rik, I would say let your psychologist be your teacher. Let your time focusing on listening to other people when they talk be your teacher. Make real authentic contact with yourself and somebody, you may have to look in places you would never think you would be in.

But in a concise way, I have been dealing with depression, but a few years ago it was extremely severe. I was meditating an hour a day for 2 years leading up to the worst times. The best advice I got was to stay away from meditation until I had a full and stable life. That is the answer I got when looking for a teacher, and the same answer I would give you.

If you still want to explore spirituality without religion, read some eckhart tolle and spend some time in nature every day. Whatever floats your boat. I go to the lake and sit under a tree, it is sometimes boring, but if I dont force myself to be in nature I feel much worse.

just get addicted to MDMA and kill yourself if that's what you want to do. it's heroic, as heroic as any other solution.

humans suffer 99% more than the universe which doesn't suffer at all. we have to inflict suffering to reach each other and we have to inflict suffering to alleviate our own suffering, and nothing else in the world has to do this.

if you want to get addicted to MDMA and then just kill yourself because that's your optimal individual path don't let anyone stop you. no one is the boss of you are you deserve to die when you want to and how you want to without worrying about a bunch of do'gooders trying to help you. your limited perspective will always encourage you to prioritize some nonsense ahead of obvious and evident truths of buddhism.

you aren't fucking jesus christ you can sin all you want and there's no reason to be a martyr for ball or any other lp who doesn't truth you with your net worth.

MDMA is a great drug. I have achieved spiritual experiences with that drug. Wanting to kill myself was never a thought that arose while on MDMA. It was mostly love, connection, compassion, understanding, transcendence, euphoria, et al. The day after the stage could be set for some angst and depression but MDMA never affected me in that way for the most part. Typically when drugs and I mix it will eventually lead me to a mind overcrowded with suicidal thoughts. The drugs are supposed to drown out the suicidal thoughts and fill the void but when they don't that is the bad place. I do not want to get addicted to MDMA and kill myself. I do agree that it is as heroic as any other solution. I am responsible to create my own meaning in a mostly empty and meaningless universe. That is what Sartre says anyways. I have lived parts of my life as a hedonist with bouts of nihilism. I don't really want to go back there. Sartre also said we are a sum of our actions. The sum of my hedonist and nihilist actions did not end up to well. Then I found Immanuel Kant and ethics. I have a certain level of unwavering self-esteem thanks to Kant. I disagree with Kant on suicide though (he is against it under any circumstance). I believe in many circumstances there are outs. There are ways to find rehabilitation, and values, and meaning. Obviously, if someone is set on killing themselves and sees no outs that is the way they are going to go. Most times those stories are a bit tragic and sad but I do not believe in sin. There is no such thing as divine law.

I do have a limited perspective. I still think it is ridiculous to label someone the "happiest man in the world." Ricard thought the label was ridiculous too.

Do you have any suggestions of some "obvious and evident truths of buddhism" or where one could start?

Man, I am too apathetic to be a martyr for anything. That is not entirely true at all but I am certainly not going to be a martyr over any LP discussion that's for sure.

Thinking now I should have quoted parts from above but oh well someone just called me and I have to go.

There is an obvious problem trying to find for meaning in meaninglessness, it will always be artificial and you cant fool yourself, that is the abyss.

What you should do is embrace the meaninglessness

I do not think there is THE meaning to life. I do think there can be meaning(s) to life. A meaning that will hit me likely soon is a meaning to get some food. I do not want to feel lonely so I spend time with friends.

I was reading a book last night on the gita that stated our meaning was to reach our fullest potential. Is it artificial? I suppose. I think it is still a meaning. What is the harm in someone attempting to reach their fullest potential? It sounds like a pretty good way to spend the days.

Is any human made meaning "artificial"?

Surviving and hanging in there with the knowledge that the universe is nothingness. It is not completely nothingness because we exist with consciousness.

One meaning that sticks with me is to help alcoholics who still suffer. Like, I know we are just specks of consciousness in the grand scheme of things but in MY consciousness it does not feel this way. My brain typically does not compute it that way. I am just going along in my tunnel of consciousness.

I do not have a problem with embracing the meaninglessness but I would still like to have a place to stay, some food to eat, some friends to spend time with, commiserate with, and laugh with. I would like a job that provides enough and is not too harsh on my particular spirit. I would like to spend time with some women on a romantic and also sometimes sexual basis. Those are some basic wants. They do not feel meaningless. The fact that there are 200+ billion galaxies and that there is no god does not mean everyone does not have items that are meaningful to them. It is true that many times meanings (especially religious meanings) are an illusion but not all meanings are an illusion.

Just some stuff I wrote. I would be interested to hear more from you Baal. I would be interested to hear more from anyone. This is pretty cool fodder for discussion.

Further:

What makes me/you get up in the morning?

What makes me/you do stuff?

Honestly, I have been sleeping like 12 hours a day b/c I have no job and the prospects are kind of depressing and I have not had any drive to do anything except for drink coffee, dick around on the internet until I run errands or go to AA meetings and hang out with friends. My parents are rich and I am going more and more in debt to them but it covers my current lifestyle. Looking at that it looks pretty pathetic especially compared to where I was but it is what is happening. I am afraid of going back to many types of jobs. I am afraid of dating so maybe that is why I just drift. Drifting is really the only option there is. The current is going to move us regardless of what we think we can do. I can embrace this. It would still be nice to be able to conjure up inspiration. All I know is that I am left with the inspiration that comes when it comes.

Rik, you are barking up the wrong tree, most people on this site are atheists. Even further, some are waaay negative and probably would make a nihilist even a bit weirded out.

Failsafe: you should get banned for telling someone to commit suicide. Mods please do your job. Also, failsafe, fuck off or go get some help yourself. You are a complete asshole with that post.

atheist

a person who disbelieves or lacks belief in the existence of God or gods

By this definition I am an atheist. It depends how "God" is defined but "existence OF God (capital letter hinting at "divine" or gods" I do not jive with. I do not believe in any religious God or gods and think the propagation of these beliefs is damaging to society.

I don't have time to start a thread right now but I will be thinking about it.

I want the most atheist, nihilist mother fuckers that are out there. I want people that have found some meaning. If the negative nihilists can't tear the meaning down there is something there.

I want to know how the people with 0 meaning get up and do stuff. I suppose I have been there before so I can help answer that question.

That video Loco posted on meaning was pretty good.

I gotta go.

Ok well atheist was just a matter of semantics I guess. I meant believing in something on a spiritual level existing. Even that way of saying it can be misinterpreted. But whatever, I dont believe in some vig dude in the sky or a single entity god, but i do believe in god if you ask me.

And who cares how people who believe in nothing get out of bed? Doesn't mean anything to me. Anybody from priests to meth addicts or both combined get out of bed lol, doesnt matter

On November 04 2016 19:07 Big_Rob_isback wrote: Rik, you are barking up the wrong tree, most people on this site are atheists. Even further, some are waaay negative and probably would make a nihilist even a bit weirded out. Failsafe: you should get banned for telling someone to commit suicide. Mods please do your job. Also, failsafe, fuck off or go get some help yourself. You are a complete asshole with that post.

i mean if the truth of the matter is there is no god and there is no satan and the world is essentially a democracy of propositions (say yes here say no here)

smoke weed to notice you can say yes or no here

take lsd to notice you can say yes or no here

meditate to notice you can say yes or no here

it's offensive to me that what counts for learning between the ages of 15-30 is this thinly veiled attempt to get society to learn basic metaphysics that we could explain in like one paragraph.

personally i'm at the point where i really don't care, and I sympathize with people who feel the same way I do. 2k people in the world have 8 trillion dollars and the only thing it's evidence of is that having lived and worked 200k, 300k, 500k hours it's too much of an investment to walk up and shoot them in the head.

it's precisely because these people are so excellent at exploiting this simple fact that they are where they are.

actually it's tragic that the world compromises ethics (even if we take ethics to be game theoretic) in tandem with this rudimentary notion of metaphysical education so that everything we learn is both bad math and bad science and basically nonsense

Kant and Plato should be mandatory.

That was pretty brutal when you told me to kill myself.

Not a bad suggestion though. Just go HARD on MDMA for 2 weeks straight or something and see what happens in the comedown. Camp out by the beach. Get some sun. I think the raving would be old by that point. I would think to just be a wino camped out under a bridge but I have more or less already done that and it is TERRIFYING when the booze stops working. Oh shit, I am getting the shakes but the booze doesn't make me feel good. The magic is gone. I am fucked. I typically thought of jumping out my 3rd story window, driving my car off of a mountain, and hari kari with a santoku knife. Now, that I live in Pittsburgh there are all these bridges but jumping off a bridge just does not seem to resonate with me. Not sure if I like the gun route either. This could just be because I am not currently suicidal and no suicidal ideations for a while.

I wouldn't worry so much about the 2k with $8 trillion. It is changing at a slow rate but it is changing. That is my belief. Plus, there is very little any individual can do about it anyways. Plus, it does not negate the fact that many people have a shot at carving out a decent life. It is pretty sad to think about so many that it is very difficult to live a decent life. How lucky some are and how unlucky others are.

Know thyself. Really know thyself. Face fears. Live in truth. Be right sized. God is dead. Despair, fear, loneliness, self-pity, uselessness. These are all a bad place to be (not the God is dead but the last sentence).

Oh man, I think hope is a good topic for a bunch of atheists, nihilists.

Peace, serenity, joy, confidence, self-esteem.

Know thyself. Those Greeks were way ahead of their time.