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ThunderGod   New Zealand. Jun 07 2018 13:38. Posts 22

Apart from a few points where his exuberance got the better of him I really enjoyed that interview with Peter Joseph - he is an articulate speaker. Loco do you have further information on the advances in complexity and system theory you mention? An interesting topic.


Loco   Canada. Jun 07 2018 14:11. Posts 20012

My main sources have been the French cyberneticians who formed the "group of ten". The main figure who has synthesized their ideas and contributed significant advances is Edgar Morin, but his main work hasn't been translated into English yet (only the first tome has been). His main and most accessible works in English are "Seven Complex Lessons in Education" and "On Complexity". There's Humberto Maturana and Francisco Varela's work, as well as Terrence Deacon's. These last two are very difficult works and shouldn't be the first works you read if you are largely unfamiliar with systems theory/cybernetics/epistemological constructivism.

This is a new video that came out today, where Peter introduces his version of cybernetics and its implications for a viable economic system. It's pretty limited in scope but quite accessible. I also enjoyed the woman speaker's talk on storytelling and her co-op sharing project is very cool.

Those who make a peaceful revolution impossible, will make a violent revolution inevitable.Last edit: 07/06/2018 14:21

RiKD    United States. Jun 07 2018 18:15. Posts 5717

Cool stuff.

I think a key is formulating a way to number 1 have the facts down about the businesses not being "profitable" if one considers their effects on the environment and mental health and then more importantly like the woman said be able to share stories about it. Her work really is the future. As well as what Peter was discussing.

I remember the first time I was in Amsterdam it blew my mind. Of course, I was smoking A LOT of really good weed but specifically in regards to recycling and public transportation the city told a really powerful story. I still carry that story with me. Now, it's a little easier to implement that stuff in Amsterdam than it is in craggy, hilly, rubbly Pittsburgh, PA but they actually are implementing a lot of that stuff to a point where they can and the community is better off for it. Imagine systems theory being taught in advanced high school classes? Or, at least university courses.

Exciting stuff.


Loco   Canada. Jun 07 2018 20:20. Posts 20012

It should be taught earlier than that, it comes naturally to 1st grade students before they get indoctrinated by the compartmentalization process that fuels capitalism. See this vid at around 38:00.

Those who make a peaceful revolution impossible, will make a violent revolution inevitable. 

RiKD    United States. Jun 07 2018 20:43. Posts 5717

That's pretty amazing. Young kids have learning superpowers. System theory is such a valuable education at that age. I mean it's super important at any age but to learn it in the first year of elementary school along with the golden rule, how to read, basic math, etc. is a game changer.


Loco   Canada. Jun 07 2018 23:43. Posts 20012

sickening

Those who make a peaceful revolution impossible, will make a violent revolution inevitable. 

RiKD    United States. Jun 08 2018 00:24. Posts 5717

That Libya situation is more complex than they are making it out to be but still her actions and her reactions are gross. The Clintons are gross. They're all gross. All the presidents and the congressman for the last 25-30 years (and more). It's like the world is ruled by psychopaths but if you murder them you're the psychopath and if another psychopath murders them then it's likely just as ugly. There is a lot that we need but part of it is definitely finding a Bernie 2.0 which may be no small feat. The Democratic Party basically used Bernie to get people registered and then fucked him in the ass. The data is not always accurate but Bernie had a larger chance of beating Trump and I think he would have. Bernie might have actually had a positive effect on the USA and the earth and its citizens.


SleepyHead   . Jun 08 2018 00:30. Posts 876

Congress would have allowed Bernie to implement zero of his ideas

Dude you some social darwinist ideas that they are giving hitlers ghost a boner - Baal 

Stroggoz   New Zealand. Jun 08 2018 02:14. Posts 4476

Even more sickening:

harvard academic line up to praise paul kagame, who is probably the biggest mass murderer alive today. https://www.paulstreet.org/kagame-goes-to-harvard/
the level's of indoctrination at ivy league universities are impressive, and these people who praise mass murderers seem like very nice people as well-just very well mannered and polite apologists for mass murder.

read the politics of genocide if you want a full study of the indoctrination which focuses on attitudes towards mass murder.

supposed to have greenstar not braceletLast edit: 08/06/2018 02:15

Baalim   Mexico. Jun 08 2018 04:53. Posts 33075

nothing will beat Obama's Nobel

Ex-PokerStars Team Pro Online 

Stroggoz   New Zealand. Jun 08 2018 05:18. Posts 4476


  On June 08 2018 03:53 Baalim wrote:
nothing will beat Obama's Nobel



kissingers nobel.

supposed to have greenstar not bracelet 

Spitfiree   Bulgaria. Jun 08 2018 11:55. Posts 8869


  On June 08 2018 03:53 Baalim wrote:
nothing will beat Obama's Nobel



the upcoming Trump's Nobel? :D
Mother Theresa's Nobel?
Hitler's nomination for Nobel peace prize?


Loco   Canada. Jun 08 2018 17:31. Posts 20012


  On June 08 2018 01:14 Stroggoz wrote:
Even more sickening:

harvard academic line up to praise paul kagame, who is probably the biggest mass murderer alive today. https://www.paulstreet.org/kagame-goes-to-harvard/
the level's of indoctrination at ivy league universities are impressive, and these people who praise mass murderers seem like very nice people as well-just very well mannered and polite apologists for mass murder.

read the politics of genocide if you want a full study of the indoctrination which focuses on attitudes towards mass murder.



He is in my province at the moment for the G7.

I remember briefly reading about that book, it is very controversial.: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rwandan_genocide_denial. I remember the Monbiot piece which they responded to but I haven't read that yet. Dunno if I'll ever get to reading it, it looks like it would be very demanding to be properly informed about it all.

Those who make a peaceful revolution impossible, will make a violent revolution inevitable. 

Stroggoz   New Zealand. Jun 10 2018 07:19. Posts 4476

http://www.monbiot.com/2012/05/21/2181/ comical email exchange between monbiot and chomsky.

supposed to have greenstar not bracelet 

Baalim   Mexico. Jun 11 2018 22:00. Posts 33075


  On June 08 2018 04:18 Stroggoz wrote:
Show nested quote +



kissingers nobel.


reading up a bit and it seems that he tried to give it back when the ceasefire failed so the Obama nobel is still worse.

Frankly it shocks me that they accept the prize... psychopaths.


  On June 08 2018 10:55 Spitfiree wrote:
Show nested quote +



the upcoming Trump's Nobel? :D
Mother Theresa's Nobel?
Hitler's nomination for Nobel peace prize?


There is no way in hell Trump would get a Nobel
Mother Theresa was cruel, hipocritial and cruel but she doesnt compare to head of states who lead wars
just a nomination so it doesnt count

Ex-PokerStars Team Pro Online 

tutz   Brasil. Jun 16 2018 09:52. Posts 2080

What is up my peeps

Long time no see

This thread reminded me of this blog post https://www.liquidpoker.net/blog/viewblog.php?id=1043968

LOL

I'm laughing so hard reading those comments

Loco, look at your comments at this blog post https://www.liquidpoker.net/poker-forum/1044920/This_is_the_matrix.html

hahahahahahaha... fuck 6 years ago. a lot has changed... You were right about most things you said back then to me Loco.
It's so interesting to read my old comments and compare them to my thought nowadays. I still feel pretty much 'awaken', but I dont take those conspiracy theories so literally as I did back then. I realize now illuminati is just the same as 'old white money', and the alien theories are fun and all but in the end they all lack sufficient evidence, although some are actually 'possible'.

Good to see some of the old names are still around here!

 Last edit: 16/06/2018 10:33

tutz   Brasil. Jun 16 2018 11:09. Posts 2080

hahahaha one of your comments Loco:

"If there is one thing you conspiracy theorists are good at it is being distracted.

You're not "finding your own truth" when you are part of a mass movement like Zeitgeist - you are a sheep who thinks he is apart of the sheep. What is the best description of the Zeitgeist movement? A mass movement of new-age Utopianists. Followers, fanatics. "Truthists" are nothing more."

So, after 6 years, did your views on the Zeitgeist movement change?
There is no shame in admiting a change of perspective, much to the contrary.
Are we a bunch of utopianists, fanatics, followers?

 Last edit: 16/06/2018 11:31

tutz   Brasil. Jun 16 2018 11:28. Posts 2080

It's interesting that my 'conspiratorial phase', around 6 years ago, evolved as the Zeitgest movement was gaining so much strength. It's like the Zeitgeist movement inspired me to "seek more information", and since my imature 21/22 years old was not very experienced at dicerning BS from pontentially valuable information, I ended up going too deep into the rabbit hole, and I recognize that. I ended up falling to ideas that had a basis of truth, but went far beyond anything humans can prove.

My core is still the same though. I still see this world as crazy, run by crazy people. More people need to awake to the truth of humanity, that we are all the same, and that we will eventually have to work together to build a world that is fair for all. The simple idea that it is impossible to maintain eternal economic growth in the current economic system is for me sufficient evidence that the only solution is outside of the system, and that's where the Zetgeist movement offers a perspective.


Loco   Canada. Jun 16 2018 14:19. Posts 20012


  On June 16 2018 10:09 tutz wrote:
hahahaha one of your comments Loco:

"If there is one thing you conspiracy theorists are good at it is being distracted.

You're not "finding your own truth" when you are part of a mass movement like Zeitgeist - you are a sheep who thinks he is apart of the sheep. What is the best description of the Zeitgeist movement? A mass movement of new-age Utopianists. Followers, fanatics. "Truthists" are nothing more."

So, after 6 years, did your views on the Zeitgeist movement change?
There is no shame in admiting a change of perspective, much to the contrary.
Are we a bunch of utopianists, fanatics, followers?




Do I regret anything I said? No. In fact, I have a friend who left the movement partly for that reason a few years ago despite being a "high profile" organizer who also gave talks.



This movement was at its worst 6-8 years ago, my opinion of it has changed because it has changed. Or at least, Peter Joseph has obviously matured significantly, like I said. I adapt to new information, like everyone who is interested in reality (unlike some who are active here). I haven't revisited the first two movies because I'm pretty sure they are garbage, but the third one has some good stuff (when it involves the talk with experts) that many people would benefit to look into. It is ultimately naive though, but I'd rather have them as my comrads than not, as long as they are self-critical and adaptive.

Those who make a peaceful revolution impossible, will make a violent revolution inevitable.Last edit: 16/06/2018 17:04

VanDerMeyde   Norway. Feb 06 2019 22:14. Posts 4951


  On June 08 2018 03:53 Baalim wrote:
nothing will beat Obama's Nobel



hehe

Torbjørn Jagland (norwegian x-politician and x-prime minister) just wanted some attention... (he was head of committee)

:DLast edit: 06/02/2019 22:14

 
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