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Handnr: 1077908
Submitted by : Stroggoz

PokerStars Hand #174988242482: Holdem No Limit ($25/$50 USD) - 2017/08/30 13:52:58 ET
Table Dirikis 6-max Seat #4 is the button
Seat 1: OBORRA ($5662.52 in chips)
Seat 4: LLinusLLove ($5000 in chips)
Seat 6: Stambolov ($5281.90 in chips)
Stambolov: posts small blind $25
OBORRA: posts big blind $50
OBORRA: posts the ante $10
LLinusLLove: posts the ante $10
Stambolov: posts the ante $10

Holecards(Odds)
LLinusLLove: raises $101 to $151
Stambolov: folds
OBORRA: calls $101

Flop(Odds) (Pot : $327.00)

   9c5s5h
OBORRA: checks
LLinusLLove: checks

Turn(Odds) (Pot : $327.00)

   9c5s5hQs
OBORRA: checks
LLinusLLove: bets $237.85
OBORRA: raises $437.15 to $675
LLinusLLove: calls $437.15

River (Pot : $1,677.00)

   9c5s5hQs8d
OBORRA: bets $4826.52 and is all-in
LLinusLLove: calls $4164 and is all-in
Uncalled bet ($662.52) returned to OBORRA

Showdown
OBORRA: shows Kc5d (three of a kind, Fives)
LLinusLLove: shows JdTh (a straight, Eight to Queen)
LLinusLLove collected $10033 from pot

Summary
Total pot $10035 | Rake $2
Board  9c5s5hQs8d
Seat 1: OBORRA (big blind) showed Kc5d and lost with three of a kind, Fives
Seat 4: LLinusLLove (button) showed JdTh and won ($10033) with a straight, Eight to Queen
Seat 6: Stambolov (small blind) folded before Flop

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Comments

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wobbly_au   Australia. Oct 23 2017 06:57. Posts 6540

100% not GTO

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The Last Laugh. 

wobbly_au   Australia. Oct 23 2017 06:57. Posts 6540

And 100% bad too, but there is probably some dynamic that is unknown to us that makes this better or even good.

The Last Laugh. 

Stroggoz   New Zealand. Oct 23 2017 07:34. Posts 5289

let me hard counter that by saying, 100% gto, 100% good, oborra has the dynamic of people joking/accusing him of being a gto bot.

One of 3 non decent human beings on a site of 5 people with between 2-3 decent human beings 

wobbly_au   Australia. Oct 23 2017 08:03. Posts 6540

prove it.

The Last Laugh. 

hiems   United States. Oct 23 2017 14:43. Posts 2979

I beat Loco!!! [img]https://i.imgur.com/wkwWj2d.png[/img]Last edit: 23/10/2017 14:44

traxamillion   United States. Oct 23 2017 20:21. Posts 10468

Oborra is the best player in the world wobbly


wobbly_au   Australia. Oct 24 2017 01:39. Posts 6540

Doesn’t mean this hand is GTO or good, notice I’m not commenting on every hand. Just hands I find out of place or interesting.

Don’t suck professional player dick always try to find leaks that is how you get good at poker

The Last Laugh.Last edit: 24/10/2017 01:53

traxamillion   United States. Oct 24 2017 05:04. Posts 10468

I'm not sucking dick but I've heard players in the game literally say they have NEVER seen Oborra play a hand incorrectly. He's probably a GTO bot and i believe currently banned from stars


wobbly_au   Australia. Oct 24 2017 05:11. Posts 6540

From the very limited hands that goto show down that get posted by stroggoz I dont think he is a GTO bot. I dont think NL is solved just yet.

This hand and several others are evident not every hand is GTO. Even the currently solvers are only a very simplified version of what GTO is, it is still taking alot of assumptions into play and you have to plug in bet size and there is no way we can be sure he only uses 1-2-3-4-5-6-7-8 bet sizes.

The Last Laugh. 

wobbly_au   Australia. Oct 24 2017 05:13. Posts 6540


  On October 24 2017 04:04 traxamillion wrote:
I'm not sucking dick but I've heard players in the game literally say they have NEVER seen Oborra play a hand incorrectly. He's probably a GTO bot and i believe currently banned from stars



You say you are not sucking dick but here again you are taking the word of "players in the game". They maybe wrong, or intentionally misleading you. Just like my advice could be intentionally misleading or wrong. But you shouldnt assume this hand is GTO or good without proof from yourself.

I am open to discussing why you or stroggoz or anyone thinks this is GTO though. show the proof.

The Last Laugh. 

Baalim   Mexico. Oct 24 2017 05:53. Posts 34246

Oborra is suspected by many of being a dream machine assisted player for fucks sake, did you rum a simulation to see if this is GTO or is this your "I know GTO since 2007"? thing

Ex-PokerStars Team Pro Online 

wobbly_au   Australia. Oct 24 2017 05:54. Posts 6540

GTO2007 is same as GTO2017 you arrogant ass.

The Last Laugh. 

Stroggoz   New Zealand. Oct 24 2017 06:32. Posts 5289

that escalated quickly. i already simmed this before i posted it, given reasonable parameters it will shove K5 sometimes. also wanted to to check range explorer to see how much of IP river range was JTo and it showed 8.3% of his range was a straight. I don't think Linus deviates much in this particular spot. I basically don't have to prove any of this because the burden of proof is on you, actually. your asking us all to prove it without even bothering to use a solver to check whether it is gto or not, yet you assert that it isn't.

wobbly no one's saying solvers are exactly gto and no one believes that. the word gto gets thrown around liberally, usually people mean 'close to gto according to X, Y, Z assumptions' when they use the word. I was kind of trolling you because you arn't putting any reason/ evidence into your posts.

i'm not sure what to make of the oborra allegations anymore as i havn't checked myself. but the arguments that say he is a gto bot arn't exactly weak arguments, they are empirically verifiable/falsifiable, and made by top players.

One of 3 non decent human beings on a site of 5 people with between 2-3 decent human beings 

wobbly_au   Australia. Oct 24 2017 06:44. Posts 6540

Actually the burden of proof is on you for claiming this is GTO just as much as it is on me for claiming it isnt.

You can use your solver screenshot as evidence that it is GTO for certain assumptions. i.e.

1. shove K5 some % of time
2. 2.5x overbet and what ever other bet sizes
3. assuming other guy is aiming to play GTO
4. assume certain preflop ranges.

All of these are variables and ultimately you have a simulated simplified "gto" strategy.

You can actually use this argument to tack it onto any hand that isn't HEAVILY butchered. go dig through some of my hands and you'll find they are almost always GTO by these standards. (Even though hands I post publicly are likely to be weird experimental lines by me or by villain that wouldn't damage my hidden strategy)

I can always say, I was doing that only at a certain frequency, I am balanced for that particular bet size, make up ranges for my opponents.

The game is the game, people have gotten better but we are not playing GTO nor is this GTO. Solvers are only a tool which good players are making a fuck tonne of money off but bad players are using it to lie to themselves and mislead. Same thing as Pokerstove was a few years back.

The Last Laugh.Last edit: 24/10/2017 07:19

 

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