UFC 173: Barao vs. Dillashaw - Page 5

Andre Pederneiras: Let’s see if TJ Dillashaw is man enough to fight Renan Barao in Brazil

"We're asking for an immediate rematch. It's fair, and we're looking a way to do it," Pederneiras said in an interview to radio show No Mundo da Luta. "It can't happen in less than five or six months, but I think that's how long T.J. is going to be out. Everybody wants to see another fight between them, since it was the fight of the night."

"The ideal would be bringing this fight to Brazil," he said. "There's going to be a big event here in Brazil, apparently in October in Rio de Janeiro. Let's see if these guys are man enough to fight Barao in his house."

"After the first knockdown, Renan couldn't get into the fight anymore and he went dizzy with every blow," he said. "Even between the rounds, when we were talking to him, he wasn't even looking at us."

http://www.mmafighting.com/2014/5/26/...-renan-barao-ufc-173-rematch-mma-news

andre is somewhat right.

read an opinion piece today that i 100% agreed with. suppose that barao was finished in the first round after being knocked down by the big shot. it seems to be the opinion of most people that had that happened he would have been more deserving of an immediate rematch than he is now after being dominated for 5 full rounds while he was concussed. kinda nonsensical. give the man an immediate rematch, its not like anyone else deserves it.

On May 27 2014 01:53 Daut wrote: andre is somewhat right. read an opinion piece today that i 100% agreed with. suppose that barao was finished in the first round after being knocked down by the big shot. it seems to be the opinion of most people that had that happened he would have been more deserving of an immediate rematch than he is now after being dominated for 5 full rounds while he was concussed. kinda nonsensical. give the man an immediate rematch, its not like anyone else deserves it.

Andre is a fucking idiot.

- He says a rematch is fair. How so? Your fighter got his ass handed to him for 4.5 rounds and then finished in the 5th. The UFC could sell a rematch, however, an immediate rematch would sell less than Barao's past PPV's due to the fact that he got owned and hasn't shown that he is worthy of a rematch yet.

- He says that everyone wants to see another fight between these two since it was the FOTN. The only reason it was FOTN is because of Dillashaw, it was clear that Barao wasn't doing anything offensively to make it FOTN, he was just getting outworked 90% of the time.

- He says the ideal fight would be a rematch in Brazil. How so? Aside from there being an event in Brazil later this year, the only plus side to them fighting in Brazil is that Barao will be closer to home, which gives him multiple minor advantages. Saying, "Let's see if these guys are man enough to fight Barao in his house," is just laughable. He might as well say, "look, we can't beat you outside of our home country, so fight us in Brazil so we can get any and every advantage possible."

- He makes it sound as if the only reason Barao lost was because he was concussed in round 1 and was never able to recover. Well, how the fuck do you think that happened? Barao didn't slip on a banana peel. If you know your fighter isn't properly responding to you in between rounds, especially after he was knocked down and almost finished in round 1, you might want to rethink how you corner your fighters.


Brazilian fighters and their team are often described as being crybabies and make a ton of excuses after losses. Well, this is one of those moments.

As for the next person in line at Bantamweight, that is most likely going to be Raphael Assuncao. Assuncao won a split-decision in Brazil against Dillashaw, a fight where many people, including myself, thought Dillashaw won. Dillashaw/Assuncao #2 won't be held in Brazil, that's for sure.

andre was right about barao being rocked after the first and not the same fighter. of course hes a moron for demanding a rematch in brazil and trying to goad TJ into it.

from @mmaphilosophy on twitter

An explanation of why people are sometimes (apparently very!) confused about the significance and meaning of flash-KOs. Consider the following two scenarios: Scenario (I) It's Round 1 of an important fight. Fighter A (challenger) and Fighter B (title holder) are circling. Fighter B, the champion, is expected to win the fight. Suddenly, Fighter A steps in with a looping overhand right that connects with horrifying force on Fighter B's chin. Fighter B collapses to the ground, rolls onto his knees, weakly grabs Fighter A's ankle, and gets smashed twice in the ear. The referee steps in and stops the fight. Fighter B -- who is badly concussed -- loses his belt. Scenario (II) It's Round 1 of an important fight. Fighter A (challenger) and Fighter B (title holder) are circling. Fighter B, the champion, is expected to win the fight. Suddenly, Fighter A steps in with a looping overhand right that connects with horrifying force on Fighter B's chin. Fighter B collapses to the ground, rolls onto his knees, weakly grabs Fighter A's ankle, and gets smashed twice in the ear. (*Note that to this point, everything is absolutely identical.*) Just as Fighter B gets smashed for the second time in the ear, he manages to roll onto his back and secure an extremely loose half guard. Fighter B is badly concussed and operating on auto-pilot. He survives the round, but barely. His corner allows him to continue fighting on pure instinct for four more rounds, with badly impaired reaction times and no intelligible gameplan, due to his concussion. At no point in the fight was Fighter B a legitimate threat to Fighter A. At the end of the fight, Fighter B loses a lopsided decision. Some people would have you believe that the version of Fighter B in Scenario (I) would be *more* deserving of an immediately title rematch than the version of Fighter B in Scenario (II). They would claim that Fighter A proved his superiority in Scenario (II), but not in Scenario (I). That's fucking absurd. The crucial difference between the two scenarios is that in the first scenario Fighter B succumbs to the beating, while in the second scenario Fighter B summons the strength to carry his concussed, barely-present, totally useless husk of flesh around the ring for 20 extra minutes. It would be crazy of us to think less of Fighter B in Scenario (II) than in Scenario (I). My point in all of this isn't that Scenario (II) doesn't strongly count in favor of Fighter A's dominance. Instead, I'm making the opposite point: I'm saying that it's stupid to undervalue Fighter A's performance (or overvalue Fighter B's performance) in Scenario (I). Flash KOs are KOs, and unless they're controversial, they must be regarded as legitimate, meaningful wins. And, indeed, I think that (blatant controversy aside), they should often be judged as *more* meaningful than five-round shellackings. Of course, in real life it is never easy to tell whether a case falls neatly into one of the above categories. And I'm certainly not claiming that there are *no* cases in which a five-round pummelling proves more than a quick KO. (There are early stoppages and bad stoppages. There are five-round beatings where the losing fighter rather obviously isn't concussed to the point of proto-consciousness. And so on.) But none of that speaks against my point, since I'm not making an absolute claim.

given that there is nobody else that deserving of a title shot and barao is coming off 33 straight wins, i think he has earned it. getting rocked and almost finished in the first but surviving and then dominated for 4.5 rounds is NOT worse than getting dropped and finished in the first. assuncao getting the nod over dillashaw was BS. not to mention assuncao is boring as fuck.

On May 27 2014 02:47 Daut wrote: andre was right about barao being rocked after the first and not the same fighter. of course hes a moron for demanding a rematch in brazil and trying to goad TJ into it. + Show Spoiler + from @mmaphilosophy on twitter Show nested quote + An explanation of why people are sometimes (apparently very!) confused about the significance and meaning of flash-KOs. Consider the following two scenarios: Scenario (I) It's Round 1 of an important fight. Fighter A (challenger) and Fighter B (title holder) are circling. Fighter B, the champion, is expected to win the fight. Suddenly, Fighter A steps in with a looping overhand right that connects with horrifying force on Fighter B's chin. Fighter B collapses to the ground, rolls onto his knees, weakly grabs Fighter A's ankle, and gets smashed twice in the ear. The referee steps in and stops the fight. Fighter B -- who is badly concussed -- loses his belt. Scenario (II) It's Round 1 of an important fight. Fighter A (challenger) and Fighter B (title holder) are circling. Fighter B, the champion, is expected to win the fight. Suddenly, Fighter A steps in with a looping overhand right that connects with horrifying force on Fighter B's chin. Fighter B collapses to the ground, rolls onto his knees, weakly grabs Fighter A's ankle, and gets smashed twice in the ear. (*Note that to this point, everything is absolutely identical.*) Just as Fighter B gets smashed for the second time in the ear, he manages to roll onto his back and secure an extremely loose half guard. Fighter B is badly concussed and operating on auto-pilot. He survives the round, but barely. His corner allows him to continue fighting on pure instinct for four more rounds, with badly impaired reaction times and no intelligible gameplan, due to his concussion. At no point in the fight was Fighter B a legitimate threat to Fighter A. At the end of the fight, Fighter B loses a lopsided decision. Some people would have you believe that the version of Fighter B in Scenario (I) would be *more* deserving of an immediately title rematch than the version of Fighter B in Scenario (II). They would claim that Fighter A proved his superiority in Scenario (II), but not in Scenario (I). That's fucking absurd. The crucial difference between the two scenarios is that in the first scenario Fighter B succumbs to the beating, while in the second scenario Fighter B summons the strength to carry his concussed, barely-present, totally useless husk of flesh around the ring for 20 extra minutes. It would be crazy of us to think less of Fighter B in Scenario (II) than in Scenario (I). My point in all of this isn't that Scenario (II) doesn't strongly count in favor of Fighter A's dominance. Instead, I'm making the opposite point: I'm saying that it's stupid to undervalue Fighter A's performance (or overvalue Fighter B's performance) in Scenario (I). Flash KOs are KOs, and unless they're controversial, they must be regarded as legitimate, meaningful wins. And, indeed, I think that (blatant controversy aside), they should often be judged as *more* meaningful than five-round shellackings. Of course, in real life it is never easy to tell whether a case falls neatly into one of the above categories. And I'm certainly not claiming that there are *no* cases in which a five-round pummelling proves more than a quick KO. (There are early stoppages and bad stoppages. There are five-round beatings where the losing fighter rather obviously isn't concussed to the point of proto-consciousness. And so on.) But none of that speaks against my point, since I'm not making an absolute claim. given that there is nobody else that deserving of a title shot and barao is coming off 33 straight wins, i think he has earned it. getting rocked and almost finished in the first but surviving and then dominated for 4.5 rounds is NOT worse than getting dropped and finished in the first. assuncao getting the nod over dillashaw was BS. not to mention assuncao is boring as fuck.

Regarding an immediate rematch: There's 3 types of people.

- Those who say Barao shouldn't get a rematch because he was clearly dominated, and that Cain Velasquez had to fight once before getting a rematch versus JDS.

- The people who compare Barao to Anderson Silva and say that if Anderson got two immediate rematches, Barao should too.

- Then there's the people who say that Barao is nothing like Anderson, in that Barao's win-record consists of a bunch of random Brazilian fighters that he beat to pad his record, similar to what professional boxers do.

In my opinion, Raphael Assuncao should be next in line for Dillashaw. Dillashaw said he's okay fighting either Assuncao or Barao next. Also, Barao only defended his title 3 times in the UFC, so it's not like he was the longtime reigning champ that had stopped everybody in the UFC for many years. If Barao entered the UFC with a 10-0 record and then beat the same guys that he did, his record wouldn't be used as a tool for him getting an immediate rematch.

Hopefully Chad Mendes can beat Aldo; I'd expect to see an immediate rematch for that fight if Mendes won.

If Gus didn't get an immediate rematch after that controversial decision there is no way Barao should get one imo

barao vs cruz
dillashaw vs assuncao

FTW