nl50 FR JJ ip

PokerStars Game #23719873443: Hold'em No Limit ($0.25/$0.50) - 2009/01/09 6:40:07 ET
Table 'Benkoela III' 9-max Seat #7 is the button
Seat 1: RuBenPoCoPrO ($52.80 in chips)
Seat 2: marcbb ($22.55 in chips)
Seat 4: camuloz ($50 in chips)
Seat 5: Juanito28 ($30.20 in chips)
Seat 6: coronadivina ($50 in chips)
Seat 7: Witz1708 ($9.25 in chips)
Seat 8: seadragon68 ($10 in chips)
Seat 9: CAT HEAD 81 ($17.70 in chips)
seadragon68: posts small blind $0.25
CAT HEAD 81: posts big blind $0.50
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to coronadivina [Jc Jd]
RuBenPoCoPrO: folds
marcbb: calls $0.50
camuloz: raises $2 to $2.50
Juanito28: folds
coronadivina: calls $2.50
Tavarok leaves the table
Witz1708: folds
seadragon68: folds
CAT HEAD 81: folds
marcbb: calls $2
*** FLOP *** [Tc 5s 7h]
marcbb: checks
camuloz: bets $6.50
MKCondor joins the table at seat #3
coronadivina: raises $8.50 to $15
marcbb: folds
camuloz: raises $32.50 to $47.50 and is all-in
coronadivina: folds
Uncalled bet ($32.50) returned to camuloz
camuloz collected $36.40 from pot
camuloz: doesn't show hand
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $38.25 | Rake $1.85
Board [Tc 5s 7h]
Seat 1: RuBenPoCoPrO folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 2: marcbb folded on the Flop
Seat 4: camuloz collected ($36.40)
Seat 5: Juanito28 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: coronadivina folded on the Flop
Seat 7: Witz1708 (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: seadragon68 (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 9: CAT HEAD 81 (big blind) folded before Flop

well i am glad with my fold here iam almost sure that i am beat here most of the time at nl50. However I would like to here from nl100 nl200 regs how you would play this one. I guess at higher limits people can level me and think i reraise cos i put him on air...

so basically if i 3-bet pf then iam building a pot which i prefer not to do with JJ. I have position so i dont want this.

However if i dont 3-bet pf then i could get in this kind of situations. I think this spot is kind of common and would be nice to discuss about this.

villain is unknown and has goldstar. No reads at all.

So what would you do pf / on flop / other streets?

oooh shit how do i confert the hand?

thnx

Submitted by : 4Kingell

PokerStars Game #23719873443: Holdem No Limit ($0.25/$0.50) - 2009/01/09 6:40:07 ET
Table Benkoela III 9-max Seat #7 is the button
Seat 1: RuBenPoCoPrO ($52.80 in chips)
Seat 2: marcbb ($22.55 in chips)
Seat 4: camuloz ($50 in chips)
Seat 5: Juanito28 ($30.20 in chips)
Seat 6: coronadivina ($50 in chips)
Seat 7: Witz1708 ($9.25 in chips)
Seat 8: seadragon68 ($10 in chips)
Seat 9: CAT HEAD 81 ($17.70 in chips)
seadragon68: posts small blind $0.25
CAT HEAD 81: posts big blind $0.50

Holecards
Dealt to coronadivina
RuBenPoCoPrO: folds
marcbb: calls $0.50
camuloz: raises $2 to $2.50
Juanito28: folds
coronadivina: calls $2.50
Tavarok leaves the table
Witz1708: folds
seadragon68: folds
CAT HEAD 81: folds
marcbb: calls $2

Flop (Pot : $8.25)

   
marcbb: checks
camuloz: bets $6.50
MKCondor joins the table at seat #3
coronadivina: raises $8.50 to $15
marcbb: folds
camuloz: raises $32.50 to $47.50 and is all-in
coronadivina: folds
Uncalled bet ($32.50) returned to camuloz
camuloz collected $36.40 from pot
camuloz: doesnt show hand

Summary
Total pot $38.25 | Rake $1.85
Board  
Seat 1: RuBenPoCoPrO folded before Flop (didnt bet)
Seat 2: marcbb folded on the Flop
Seat 4: camuloz collected ($36.40)
Seat 5: Juanito28 folded before Flop (didnt bet)
Seat 6: coronadivina folded on the Flop
Seat 7: Witz1708 (button) folded before Flop (didnt bet)
Seat 8: seadragon68 (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 9: CAT HEAD 81 (big blind) folded before Flop

Just cut and paste the history in to Hands on the right and submit. It will give you a hand number. Paste [XHAND=604227X], without the X's in to your post.

I don't play FR but if you don't give any history here on the villain or any of your thoughts you probably won't get any sensible answers.

ok cool thnx! do you have suggestions for this hand as well?

Standard fold to 3bet on flop vs unknown.

3 bet pre???

On January 09 2009 06:32 vlseph wrote: 3 bet pre???

well i dont know at higher limits... JJ is valuable hand and many flops contain scare cards. Its more like if you dont 3-bet pre and get a flop like the one above... people can easily let you muck JJ. On nl50 they dont do that cos they play standard abc poker and are chicken as hell

On January 09 2009 06:41 nouck wrote: Show nested quote + On January 09 2009 06:32 vlseph wrote: 3 bet pre??? well i dont know at higher limits... JJ is valuable hand and many flops contain scare cards. Its more like if you dont 3-bet pre and get a flop like the one above... people can easily let you muck JJ. On nl50 they dont do that cos they play standard abc poker and are chicken as hell

But you have a limper and you are inviting the limper to play. JJ may be a nice hand heads up and PF but the more players the less value. Once you play as above I would be pretty cautious post flop having not hit the set. Your raise is not big enough to scare him, a decent sized raise pretty much commits you - 3betting JJ PF would have been better imo. As I said I don't play FR but I think this would be even more appropriate given relative hand strength in FR Vs 6 max.

well in 6 max would always 3-bet JJ no matter what my pos is (ecl. hard nits). However in FR this one is more difficult.

Also TT fits very well in this situation. Its the kind of hand with intrinsic value pf and its hard to play this hand post flop with facecards on the board. imo the point is that if you are good poker player you can instantly switch in making some kind of fancy bluff with TT or JJ. Sometimes you are forced to do so cos people know you have JJ or TT and can put you of it with even a worse hand...

I wouldn't raise this flop unless I was planning to call a shove....so just call the flop and go from there, or call this shove. I'd probably 3 bet pre also, especially against an unknown and a limper.



Also: "so basically if i 3-bet pf then iam building a pot which i prefer not to do with JJ. I have position so i dont want this." This logic is inconsistent with what you did on the flop....if you don't want to build a pot why are you raising the flop? Have a plan for what you're going to do during a hand. I'd definitely want to kick this up pre though.

hey donkeyluvin

pretty good advice with the fact that iam not consistent with pf and flop actions...

However my logic for raising flop is to protect my hand vs AQ/AK/KQ or just flopped tp etc.

But thinking about it. you are right. I have position! so what am i afraid of

thnx!

Call flop and go from there, but without history you need to give up on a lot of turns if he fires again.

On January 09 2009 08:00 Fox wrote: Call flop and go from there, but without history you need to give up on a lot of turns if he fires again.

thats exactly what i mean. if he is more then competent any he would fire on any facecard again...

camuloz is a nit, I fold to his flop bet, maybe call and fold to any action on turn..

On January 09 2009 08:08 k4ir0s wrote: camuloz is a nit, I fold to his flop bet

good info!

haha cool you are the one that bluffcatched me with your rivered set of deuces

On January 09 2009 08:13 nouck wrote: Show nested quote + On January 09 2009 08:08 k4ir0s wrote: camuloz is a nit, I fold to his flop bet good info! haha cool you are the one that bluffcatched me with your rivered set of deuces

haha xD sorry for the hit and run, the table got bad

oooh well wasnt that quit of a big hit and run

will get it back next time... :D

On January 09 2009 08:03 nouck wrote: Show nested quote + On January 09 2009 08:00 Fox wrote: Call flop and go from there, but without history you need to give up on a lot of turns if he fires again. thats exactly what i mean. if he is more then competent any he would fire on any facecard again...

and if you had a set you could play it the same way. lots of people will check turns. you cannot fold this now.