year so far...

This post is depressing, I preferred PanoRaMa's post. Go read it and pretend you're him. Then get a job on the oil industry.

http://www.liquidpoker.net/poker-forum/1111846/Life_After_Poker.html

I was going for just realistic, but i'd prefer some constructive commentary. i guess I can add a bunch of fluff in my post to make my life seem alot better than it is but I'm not really into doing things like that. panorama is an impressive individual and we can't all just be like him so easily.

1. Oil industry guys make like 100-300k a year.
2. panaramas post should provide some inspiration
3. Most of the world is far worse off than you.
4. Find something you enjoy thats practical, excel at it and make money.
5. Move to asia and play online, Thailand is a great place.
6. Learn to program/do something with computers, its the future.

Basically whatever you do, just give 100% and success will come. Just make sure its not Juggling etc.

How much do you even play? what stakes? you gave very little info..

Last bit of advice, poker isn't about being the best in the world, its about being the best at the table. Find the right table and the stakes don't matter, only your bankroll does.

I've played mostly 1/2 and 1/3 with some 2/5 shots. Full-time I'd say around 40-50 hours a week. There was a point where I was working 70 hours to go along with that and burned out/put in less volume.

1/2 live is a huge waste of time. Online table selection will result in like 5-10x more profit and you can live anywhere in the world. Don't play stars.

The rake in most live games is terrible and destroys lowstakes winrates. Live isn't worth it if you're not playing 2/5 minimum. Hopefully 5/10 deep or higher. Sure you have to start somewhere, but id start online before playing 1/2 at a 30 hands an hour 10 handed casino game with rake that eliminates your winrate.

If you're still at 1/2 live after a year, you should considering doing something more fulfilling and rewarding. Panoramas post is the perfect example. Play live a bit less and find something you enjoy more that leads somewhere while not playing. Lifes hard, guess I'm not very motivational... but ya.. people do what they want, which is generally what their looking to hear as well.

chok dee khap

Idk 1/2 in vegas is like taking candy from a baby. Pretty much made free money everytime I went out there. Obviously I'm not playing as a professional.

On August 02 2014 09:33 K40Cheddar wrote: Idk 1/2 in vegas is like taking candy from a baby. Pretty much made free money everytime I went out there. Obviously I'm not playing as a professional.

in my experience playing 100bb 1/2 live NL, you can only make $20/hr due to 5 dollar rake + tips etc. i played for about 6-7 months of 1/2 before aggressively taking shots at 2/5.

dear hiems, i used to play live for 1-1.5 years as well before returning to school. i think what you are doing is fine, and for a spoiled shit like myself, i needed to experience what it was like living the busto lifestyle grinding out cheeseburgers per hour. although in terms of financial success i had better luck than you, i still had alot of problems mentally and life problems that poker couldn't address. i worked at sbux + chipotle and when those 2 jobs were more satisfying than poker, i knew i was ready to give up poker for good.

i basically binged on all of my bad habbits until i found them to be so fucking unattractive. i would play poker 80 hours a week. then i would quit poker and play dota2 for 100 hours a week. and then i would say to myself fuck dota2, quit being such a lazy fuck and go work, so i would play poker another 80 hours a week. basically this would repeat itself quite a bit into a downward spiral of self hate.

anyway like i said in the paragraph above, i found learning how to properly grill meat at chipotle, honing my knife skills, learning my way around a grill to be more rewarding than poker. same with coffee at sbux. i enjoyed learning more about espresso vs ground coffee, and why everything at sbux tastes awful (basically after mcdonalds got sued for serving hot coffee, and seemingly overnight the whole food industry now serves shitty coffee cause no one uses boiling water anymore to brew coffee). on top of this the place i happened to play poker had a lot of MMA ish gyms and this was back when LP was going through that phase of hardcore MMA gungho ness. Most MMA gyms have 1 free session so even though i was doing 1 session a week i think i still got 2 months free because there were just so many gyms in my area. i also think having co-workers was extremely helpful, because the poker grind is extremely lonely.

lastly "self-empathy" or "self-compassion" is really important to continued development/motivation. i think this paper is prob worth easily $100k for me personally and all the +ev life decisions it spawned for me
http://blogs.hbr.org/2012/09/to-succeed-forget-self-esteem/

anyway i currently have a really bad headache due to "brain fog" because of my hypothyroidism, and normally wouldn't post such a shitily organized group of text but what you wrote really resonated with me and I just wanted to show support and compassion as a fellow human being who knows all too well these feelings

"It is also difficult meeting all of these rich tourists and rich locals at the wynn and not introspect upon myself and feel some sort of anger/drive/guilt/envy etc. I really would not like to be one of those grinders turned dealers despite it being rational in many ways."

On August 02 2014 06:12 DaEm0niCuS wrote: Don't play stars.

why? it has so much traffic

dont go on lifetilt, it happens to the best of us bro

nice post MNJ. Feel you on the Starbucks thing I worked there for a couple months when I was younger. Get a token job at a clothing store and meet some girls. I worked like sub 10 hours a week as a greeter for Abercrombie and while I made zero money I met some hot girls. That kind of store you gotta be a kid basically though if you are 22+ I'd work at a nicer place

On August 02 2014 17:44 traxamillion wrote: nice post MNJ. Feel you on the Starbucks thing I worked there for a couple months when I was younger. Get a token job at a clothing store and meet some girls. I worked like sub 10 hours a week as a greeter for Abercrombie and while I made zero money I met some hot girls. That kind of store you gotta be a kid basically though if you are 22+ I'd work at a nicer place

are you guys (mnj/trax) suggesting literally its time to start working starbucks/as a retail associate?

On August 02 2014 14:11 flounder44 wrote: dont go on lifetilt, it happens to the best of us bro

i guess

On August 02 2014 03:58 DaEm0niCuS wrote: 1. Oil industry guys make like 100-300k a year. 2. panaramas post should provide some inspiration 3. Most of the world is far worse off than you. 4. Find something you enjoy thats practical, excel at it and make money. 5. Move to asia and play online, Thailand is a great place. 6. Learn to program/do something with computers, its the future. Basically whatever you do, just give 100% and success will come. Just make sure its not Juggling etc.

juggling might not be that bad

http://www.thewire.com/entertainment/...times-wedding-story-lives-hype/66513/

I would try putting some money on WSOP.com and playing a few tables on there to supplement your live earnings. You want to get out of 1/3 as soon as possible so I would just grind a lot. 30k is plenty to be playing 2/5 so I would do that even if the money is spread pretty thin.

Also you should play a few of those $100-300ish tourneys with decent guarantees around town. I think the wynn has one on Saturdays or something. A bink in one of those and you are well on your way. Tourneys also break up the monotony of the live grind imo.

On August 02 2014 21:40 hiems wrote: Show nested quote + On August 02 2014 17:44 traxamillion wrote: nice post MNJ. Feel you on the Starbucks thing I worked there for a couple months when I was younger. Get a token job at a clothing store and meet some girls. I worked like sub 10 hours a week as a greeter for Abercrombie and while I made zero money I met some hot girls. That kind of store you gotta be a kid basically though if you are 22+ I'd work at a nicer place are you guys (mnj/trax) suggesting literally its time to start working starbucks/as a retail associate?

hey hiems,

it depends on where you are mentally. my advice to you is to "binge" on whatever you desire for that day. i would work or play poker 60+ hours a week and everytime i did so, it became slowly clearer that this wasn't a lifestyle that i'd be able to pursue in the long run. that it didn't fit me or my personality and that poker was no longer a vehicle for any amount of sustained happiness. i would bounce between playing 60+ hours of poker and then back to dota and then back to poker.

one of the most memorable quotes i've ever come across was "Even if your life is one inch from pure hell man can endure." Myself being asian, there was pride in "grinding" and honor and respect from making a "hard" living.

at my lowest point, after losing maybe 10k in a single month i eventually got a minimum paying job. i did it to "punish" myself for having bad tilt control, or lack of discipline. for not following stop loss for a lot of reasons that weren't actually true or really my fault. i was simply being results oriented. but regardless, i "binged" at my minimum wage job. and once again it became increasingly clear that i couldn't do this for a living either. and while there some meaningful benefits to having a minimum wage job, they are things you may not value or care to value as of this moment. but i can't put into words satisfaction or having work be appreciated. to build or create something. to produce something that customers are willing to pay money for. i realize saying things like make me sound like some old man or even worse one of those live old fishy regulars, but living a meaningful life is >>> money and bitches.

anyway this is just my 2c. my experiences may or may not be like your own. but these were the circumstances that led me back to school. i just want to say one last thing about school.

school is fucking expensive monetarily and opportunity cost wise as well. you need to binge on your previous 2 options to the point where playing poker and minimum wage jobs are no longer an exit opportunity or back up plan. you need to be in a spot where you completely eliminate your plan B and plan C and can just 100% commit to your plan A whether it be school or not. doing anything less than this is preparing to fail.

i'm far from baller status and closer to squallor, but when i look at the progress i've made from the days in which i used to play poker, i feel like one of those 400 lbs pounders who is now 160 lean and ripped. there's def a sense of inner happiness or at the very least sense of accomplishment. i used to be a total nerd with few social skills who experienced prob way too much anxiety for daily living and felt very little control over my life. when you start feeling control over your life and you're at the point where you wake up and get to CHOOSE what you do today, and what you want to "plant" today and reap somewhere in the future, i think you'll be closer to a life of "happiness".

best of luck.

good post mnj

Image is everything

haha really random casino. anyway thanks guys i'll try to do some cool stuff and hopefully follow up in a few months.

On August 02 2014 12:22 mnj wrote: i basically binged on all of my bad habbits until i found them to be so fucking unattractive. i would play poker 80 hours a week. then i would quit poker and play dota2 for 100 hours a week. and then i would say to myself fuck dota2, quit being such a lazy fuck and go work

haha I do this too whenever I feel like I'm being unproductive by playing too much video games, I go hard until I become sick of it. Your posts remind me this quote "the fool who persists in his folly will become wise."