$10/$20 Top Set vs Worst Turn Eva

Villan #1 ($11,000) is one of the big spots in the game. Older gentlmen in his late 40's, seems retarded, and does a lot of goofy small raises, plays pretty fishy and spewy but still makes an attempt to hand read and try and put people in difficult spots. Villan #2 ($4,000) is a younger thinking reg, plays tight/solid aggro.

$10/20 in a pretty action-packed game, Hero has everyone covered, raises to $80 UTG with , Villan #1 calls in MP, someone else calls in the CO, Villan #2 calls on button. BB calls. 5 way to flop.

Flop: (Pot: $410)
BB checks. Hero bets $300. Villan #1 raises to $600. CO folds. Villan #2 tanks for a bit, then raises to $1400. Hero raises to $3500. Villan #1 flat calls the $3500, and Villan #2 folds kind of quickly.

Turn: (Pot: $8810)
O hai worst possible turn card. Villan has $7500 behind on turn. Thoughts?

You can very easily rule out smaller sets vs this guy on flop since he didnt jam over the raise. He's not the type to slowplay what he thinks is the nuts.

so he likes to put people in tough spots but he's going to jam over the raise with a set and not a straight flush draw?

Ok he could possibly have a set maybe :-p

Call flop or raise the flop like a man. Don't see why you should give villain #2 three options when his options should only be call or fold. die howard

On February 15 2012 19:20 AndrewSong wrote: die howard

Can we get some thoughts on the turn spot?

tricky spot but the only 3 options here are:

1. c/f
2. shove
3. bet/call 2800-3200

looks like raise to 4300 on flop would have made the hand a trivial turn shove

Start by checking. Is he bad enough to flat flop like that w/ bottom two or worse and call off on that turn? If you have him beat the turn is just as terrible for him as it is for you so there isn't much value. Maybe he'll get cute with his flush and give you a free card or at least a good price to call. Or you could get a read.

Check and turn on ur live pro read. Duh!

edit - die howard

User was temp-banned for this post.

I'm not Hero in this hand, Hero is really good pro thou. Most of the time I post hands and I already have a pretty good idea of what is probably the right answer / way to play the hand before i post it, and in those threads I get like 2-3 pages worth of comments. I finally post a hand where I actually have a gross conflict of decisions and everyone goes into hiding. WTF

Personally I check here, but I don't like it vs a lot of opponent types. Seems super gross. I can just as easily see myself bet/calling it off or shoving. Asking my friends around here and I'm getting a pretty even split between checking and shoving with good arguments for both.

wtf why was andrew temp banned for that post^^^

AndrewSong should have immunity

There's alot of bad turns, not just spades but a bunch of straight cards as well :o

I'd like some more insight in this spot as well, but as exalted pointed out I think raising bigger on the flop, the hand plays itself much easier

bet small call it off u got less than pot left vs a fish

I'd have raised more on flop but I prob just shove turn anyway

results? I feel he shoves all his strong hands on flop but then again folding feels too nasty to do.

He shoved turn and villan folded pretty quick

there is no logic at all to shoving this turn

his range on the flop is...all draws + overpairs + sets. wtf are u shoving turn for? you can bet small but i dont really like that either. the most intuitive thing for me to do here is to check and either c/r ai a large bet or c/c a smaller bet, or if he shoves i call.

by shoving u fold out all his straightdraws and overpairs, i mean wtf...