[50NL] min bet - overshoved on flop

First hand history posted so i hope this works. Villian is running 40/20 over 50 hands. Only read ive got is that he min bet's everytime its folded around to him from any position.

Submitted by : charliehk

***** Hand History for Game 7449120490 *****
$50 USD NL Texas Hold'em - Sunday, October 12, 01:01:57 ET 2008
Table Table 126668 (Real Money)
Seat 2 is the button
Total number of players : 6
Seat 1: Chrizzz23 ( $36.82 USD )
Seat 2: zockerriese ( $44.14 USD )
Seat 3: davidmossarm ( $56.96 USD )
Seat 6: Chimiichang ( $50 USD )
Seat 4: AVShall ( $51.50 USD )
Seat 5: Hero ( $68.81 USD )
davidmossarm posts small blind [$0.25 USD].
AVShall posts big blind [$0.50 USD].

Holecards
Dealt to Hero
Hero raises [$2 USD]
Chrizzz23 folds
zockerriese folds
davidmossarm calls [$1.75 USD]
AVShall folds

Flop (Pot : $4.50)

   
davidmossarm bets [$0.50 USD]
Hero raises [$4.25 USD]
davidmossarm is all-In [$54.46 USD]

***** Hand History for Game 7449136967 *****
$50 USD NL Texas Hold'em - Sunday, October 12, 01:26:23 ET 2008
Table Jackpot #1306460 (Real Money)
Seat 3 is the button
Total number of players : 6
Seat 2: pkrlvr999 ( $90.97 USD )
Seat 4: mr_junoon777 ( $0 USD )
Seat 5: Atomic_Clock ( $64.80 USD )
Seat 6: Hero ( $54.12 USD )
Seat 1: BarryCooper ( $52.75 USD )
Seat 3: mdxpower726 ( $49.25 USD )
Atomic_Clock posts small blind [$0.25 USD].
Hero posts big blind [$0.50 USD].

Holecards
Dealt to Hero
BarryCooper folds
pkrlvr999 folds
mdxpower726 raises [$1.50 USD]
Atomic_Clock folds
Hero raises [$3.50 USD]
mdxpower726 calls [$2.50 USD]

Flop (Pot : $8.25)

   
Hero bets [$5.88 USD]
mdxpower726 raises [$23.76 USD]

hand 1 is really villain dependent. his stats are basically useless as far as this decision goes. you need other information to make a good decision here. without information just click call if you like to gamble and pick fold if you don't

should definitely 3bet 4.75+ in hand 2. you've misplayed it and now your flop decision is actually difficult. and why did you bet 5.88. that's so awkward. anyway you've made it very profitable for him to setmine against you. again, you really need more information to make a good decision... against many 13/13's you might actually save money with a fold.

I basically agree with fail, but Id definitely snapcall hand 1 and show him the nuts
hand 2 suggests youre pretty clueless about preflop actions, you let him setmine all day - you might as well tell him "I have a big pair, pls take my stack with your suited connectors/pps and fold anything else" - 3bet to around 5.50!!

need to 3bet pf like 3.5-4x their original raise amounts or around there.

call hand one, hand two raise way more pre like they said.

Yea, I failed big time on the secound hand with the RR sizing. What do you guys think of the C-betting amount. I use the 3/4 pot button and add some BB's depending on how wet the flop is but at 50NL alot of people are just calling. Anyways results below!

Submitted by : charliehk

***** Hand History for Game 7449120490 *****
$50 USD NL Texas Hold'em - Sunday, October 12, 01:01:57 ET 2008
Table Table 126668 (Real Money)
Seat 2 is the button
Total number of players : 6
Seat 1: Chrizzz23 ( $36.82 USD )
Seat 2: zockerriese ( $44.14 USD )
Seat 3: davidmossarm ( $56.96 USD )
Seat 6: Chimiichang ( $50 USD )
Seat 4: AVShall ( $51.50 USD )
Seat 5: Hero ( $68.81 USD )
davidmossarm posts small blind [$0.25 USD].
AVShall posts big blind [$0.50 USD].

Holecards(Odds)
Dealt to Hero
Hero raises [$2 USD]
Chrizzz23 folds
zockerriese folds
davidmossarm calls [$1.75 USD]
AVShall folds

Flop(Odds) (Pot : $4.50)

   
davidmossarm bets [$0.50 USD]
Hero raises [$4.25 USD]
davidmossarm is all-In [$54.46 USD]
Hero calls [$50.71 USD]

Turn(Odds) (Pot : $114.42)

   

River (Pot : $114.42)

   
Hero shows a pair of Aces .
davidmossarm shows two pairs, Queens and Nines .
davidmossarm wins $112.42 USD from the main pot with two pairs, Queens and Nines .

***** Hand History for Game 7449136967 *****
$50 USD NL Texas Hold'em - Sunday, October 12, 01:26:23 ET 2008
Table Jackpot #1306460 (Real Money)
Seat 3 is the button
Total number of players : 6
Seat 2: pkrlvr999 ( $90.97 USD )
Seat 4: mr_junoon777 ( $0 USD )
Seat 5: Atomic_Clock ( $64.80 USD )
Seat 6: Hero ( $54.12 USD )
Seat 1: BarryCooper ( $52.75 USD )
Seat 3: mdxpower726 ( $49.25 USD )
Atomic_Clock posts small blind [$0.25 USD].
Hero posts big blind [$0.50 USD].

Holecards(Odds)
Dealt to Hero
BarryCooper folds
pkrlvr999 folds
mdxpower726 raises [$1.50 USD]
Atomic_Clock folds
Hero raises [$3.50 USD]
mdxpower726 calls [$2.50 USD]

Flop(Odds) (Pot : $8.25)

   
Hero bets [$5.88 USD]
mdxpower726 raises [$23.76 USD]
Hero is all-In [$44.24 USD]
mdxpower726 is all-In [$21.49 USD]

Turn(Odds) (Pot : $98.75)

   

River (Pot : $98.75)

   
mdxpower726 shows a flush, Ace high .
Hero shows a pair of Kings .
The time at which hand ended:Oct 12 2008 01:27 ET
Hero wins $4.87 USD from the side pot 1 with a pair of Kings .
mdxpower726 wins $96.25 USD from the main pot with a flush, Ace high .

hand 1 snapcall

hand 2 raise more pre then felt it

mdxpower726 raises [$1.50 USD]
Atomic_Clock folds
Hero raises [$3.50 USD]


...plz dont minraise

don't care for results. i snap both of them and i think it's very profitable. they are just so SUPER SUPER SUPER DRAWY both i dont think you can fold OP's here.

Hand 1: I think you need to have a lot more info to make this kind of a decision. The impression I have about players like this is that they see lots of flops so that they can do this when they hit big hands. The only thing about that is that their opinion of what a "big hand" is can sometimes be pretty scewed (like TPTK or less, A7hh, etc) and they overplay them as well. Basically you need to assign a range to him and play accordingly. By inspection I don't think I'd call but I really don't feel like doing any math right now.

Hand 2: Basically everyone was correct about your raise sizing. You need to raise more if you have a tight 3betting range because you are letting him play perfectly postflop by raising so small. You can really only get away with smaller 3bets by widening your range a lot. I'd probably just end up calling the flop anyway hoping he has a wider range than I expected him to have.

Well, theres two types of players that make these moves: Fish and maniacs. When a genuine newbie fish makes this overbet shove, it usually = weird monster. Like flopped two pair, bottom set that he thinks hit you (like AK3 flop), rivered quads etc. A "plz call me" raise. When a maniac does this you should practically be calling with a high card as they will do this on total bluff's to just 1 pair/any draw.

Regardless, unless it's coming from someone you have history on and believe to be skilled, these players deserve no respect given the strength of your hand and should probably be gleefully called. Just write off the losses as coolers, know you will probably get it back if he stays long enough, and that everyone else saw part of your range at the table and will think twice about attacking you.

Hmm hand 1 is pretty gross. Pretty much what hawking said about it. I expect him to have some retarded 2 pair shit here. Your decision here is very villain dependent.

Hand 2 I snapcall faster than mach 9001.

Thanks for the info, In retrospec i probable should have folded the first hand, there was no way this guy was good enough to do that with a FD.