NL30 - is KK good on river?

Submitted by : carlosdiaz

***** Hand History for Game 1111111111 ***** On Game
$30.00 USD NL Texas Hold'em - Thursday, April 19, 02:32:13 ET 2012
Table Oakland Real Money
Seat 5 is the button
Seat 1: Player1 $41.93 USD - VPIP: 34, PFR: 26, 3B: 9, AF: 2.2, Hands: 225
Seat 2: Player2 $33.34 USD - VPIP: 20, PFR: 17, 3B: 6, AF: 2.9, Hands: 375
Seat 3: Player3 $30.00 USD - VPIP: 18, PFR: 14, 3B: 6, AF: 2.4, Hands: 185
Seat 5: Player5 $31.80 USD - VPIP: 17, PFR: 14, 3B: 7, AF: 3.4, Hands: 280
Seat 8: Hero $55.75 USD - VPIP: 27, PFR: 20, 3B: 7, AF: 2.8, Hands: 84245
Seat 10: Player10 $31.96 USD - VPIP: 34, PFR: 26, 3B: 9, AF: 2.2, Hands: 225
Hero posts small blind [$0.15 USD].
Player10 posts big blind [$0.30 USD].

Holecards
Dealt to Hero [ ]
Player1 raises [$0.90 USD]
Player2 folds
Player3 folds
Player5 folds
Hero raises [$2.85 USD]
Player10 folds
Player1 calls [$2.10 USD]

Flop (Pot : $6.15)

   
Hero bets [$4.65 USD]
Player1 calls [$4.65 USD]

Turn (Pot : $15.45)

   
Hero bets [$9.50 USD]
Player1 calls [$9.50 USD]

River (Pot : $34.45)

   
Hero

***** Hand History for Game 1111111111 ***** On Game
$30.00 USD NL Texas Hold'em - Thursday, April 19, 02:22:08 ET 2012
Table Oakland Real Money
Seat 8 is the button
Seat 1: Player1 $52.84 USD - VPIP: 34, PFR: 26, 3B: 9, AF: 2.2, Hands: 225
Seat 2: Player2 $31.09 USD - VPIP: 20, PFR: 17, 3B: 6, AF: 2.9, Hands: 375
Seat 4: Player4 $28.95 USD - VPIP: 17, PFR: 14, 3B: 5, AF: 1.6, Hands: 328
Seat 8: Hero $47.44 USD - VPIP: 27, PFR: 20, 3B: 7, AF: 2.8, Hands: 84268
Player1 posts small blind [$0.15 USD].
Player2 posts big blind [$0.30 USD].

Holecards
Dealt to Hero [ ]
Player4 folds
Hero raises [$0.90 USD]
Player1 calls [$0.75 USD]
Player2 folds

Flop (Pot : $2.10)

   
Player1 checks
Hero bets [$1.65 USD]
Player1 calls [$1.65 USD]

Turn (Pot : $5.40)

   
Player1 checks
Hero bets [$3.00 USD]
Player1 raises [$8.70 USD]
Hero calls [$5.70 USD]

River (Pot : $22.80)

   
Player1 checks
Hero checks
Hero wins $21.66 USD from main pot
Player1 shows
Hero shows

hand 1-> am not sure hummm... maybe pot because our line dont make much sense? Anything then checking river seens fine i guess...
hand 2 -> turn ur hand into a bluff and ship river, he is never EVER calling without a King and nobody checks a K back after c/r turn

On April 19 2012 23:34 Rapoza wrote: hand 1-> I check turn back, as played i am not sure hummm... maybe pot because our line dont make much sense? Anything then checking river seens fine i guess... hand 2 -> turn ur hand into a bluff and ship river, he is never EVER calling without a King and nobody checks a K back after c/r turn

what the fk - why would u bluff in hand #2... wtf??? its played 100% fine...

hand #1 - why the hell would we check the turn, its one of the best turns in the deck for us.. river is preety close between jam and smallish bet - I'd prob jam vs this player type (high vpip high 3-bet, these guys love to level themselves) villians hand is defined as almost exactly 99-JJ

ohh both hands are vs the exact same villian hand #2 is extremley relevant as Im preety sure he would call a small river bet for value

based off hand #2 i like a shove in hand #1 (assuming its the same villian)

y sry, hand 1 check turn was dumb, i just came back exactly to edit my post but you was faster hehe, dunno what i was thinking.
hand 2 imo still a ship unless you give a good reason for not to, any bluff hands like Jx+ are beating us and its VERY unlikely anyone is checking a full house in this spot

Rapoza you must have misread something in hand # 2... We don't lose to Jx wtf? If we bet river in hand 2 it's for value.

I shove in hand # 1.

hand 1, I probably jam river, dificult to call a second barrel with Ax hoping cathc on the river, it seems like underpairs that you obviusly beat, cc probably be fine to.

el_tilon I think cc is the worst possible option in hand # 1...

On April 20 2012 04:53 Almebeast wrote: el_tilon I think cc is the worst possible option in hand # 1...

I know that sux vs certain kind of players but it depends, some players are to passive on flop and turn, but some fishes have an enormus agression on river IP, they bet all his missed draws, and worst pairs as bluff. In my experience in nl30 on ongame.

I like shoving hand 1 and betting $17 in hand 2. If you think he can find a fold with 77, 99-jj in hand 1 then I like betting $17 on river in both cases. He shows up with 44- QQ so often in hand 2, and I think that is pretty much his whole range when he checks the river. Maybe 34s, 23s if he calls behind with those.

On April 20 2012 10:29 rememp wrote: I like shoving hand 1 and betting $17 in hand 2. If you think he can find a fold with 77, 99-jj in hand 1 then I like betting $17 on river in both cases. He shows up with 44- QQ so often in hand 2, and I think that is pretty much his whole range when he checks the river. Maybe 34s, 23s if he calls behind with those.

i doubt a 34/26 with a 9% 3-bet ever flats a pair better then tens ina BTN vs CO matchup- our TT is NEVER running into JJ+ here EVER, its bascially the exact same as AA - the quesiton here is how to play AA check or bet - I think both options are fine
A lot of you guys need to anylize the information provided before thinking of a play, your 100% dillusional if you think he ever folds QQ on the river - but more importantley (and this is very relevant) he NEVER has QQ ebcause of his playstyle and preflop actions

do you like villains line in hand 2? would youbet river in his shoes?

Hand 1, there are almost no Ax hands that make it to the river against us (unless he's super bad), and since the only hands that are beating us are trips and boats, you can pretty much bet the river for value.

no I don't really like it much because he is basically repping a kq float (and Kx doesn't even necessarily raise) or monster just small # of combos (ak 3b pre etc) but he checks river because when the king pairs its much harder to rep what he is trying to rep.

bluffshoving river in hand 2 is pointless; he can't even have the few better hands you would be trying to fold out (qq etc). You are probably ahead and if not he has trips+ and isn't folding.

hand 2 though instead of bluffing a vbet looks good