NL1: 3bet light, double gutter - Page 3

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On July 03 2009 14:08 exalted wrote: phexac, pretty sure i completely crush you in knowledge of 3bet pots this is a hand where there are different avenues of play; what is optimal is obviously dependent on opponent's potential ranges in this spot it is a good hand for discussion, not one where i am going "OMG flop, what do i do" i already PMed you to stop posting in my threads, yet you persist to litter with your useless advice Show nested quote + To: phexac Posts: Subject: hey.. Date: 5/29 22:05 please stop posting in my threads thanks you really have no idea how to play poker and it tilts me so hard to read your responses did you get the memo?

Don't really check my messages very often, but that's pretty funny especially considering this thread

On July 03 2009 14:08 exalted wrote: phexac, pretty sure i completely crush you in knowledge of 3bet pots

LOOOL

Internet pokerz dick waving contest

wtf is going on here -____-

I check behind here because he could shove all sorts of overpairs here and i'm behind all those hands.

I dont know wtf is going on in this thread but personally Id bet this flop and get it in if I have to, if he calls the flop and turn bricks off Id take a free card as he will never fold then. Id rather check back A high here that has some showdown value.

On July 01 2009 05:27 Baal wrote: lol why would we want to get CR when we have 8 high? we think he CR air and folds to shove? what in the fuck are you people talking about this thread has terrible terrible advice. This is a board where a big ace can get trigger happy having what he thinks are at least 7 outs and he would fucking rape us with ace high here, way to outplay yourselves if you "induce" raise. check behind and you will be able to bluff air on the river or stack off monsters instead of making him play his hand perfectly.

100bb deep checking is goot (I still like betting, but I'm an idiot), esp since we have 0 fold equity against a check raise range, your hand plays good w/ free cards + you can bluff a bunch of turns if you want / use your position of he continus to check

On July 03 2009 14:08 exalted wrote: phexac, pretty sure i completely crush you in knowledge of 3bet pots this is a hand where there are different avenues of play; what is optimal is obviously dependent on opponent's potential ranges in this spot it is a good hand for discussion, not one where i am going "OMG flop, what do i do" i already PMed you to stop posting in my threads, yet you persist to litter with your useless advice Show nested quote + To: phexac Posts: Subject: hey.. Date: 5/29 22:05 please stop posting in my threads thanks you really have no idea how to play poker and it tilts me so hard to read your responses did you get the memo?

Tone down the ego when you post an extremely easy hand IMO. He's tryin to help.

multi-way flame war~

i think exalted has a point :X

and ty baal for goot advices

All I know is that I find it really funny that phexac thinks villain is ever folding TT+ on this board :D

With current dynamic where we are 3betting with 68o I wouldn't be unhappy getting it in here with 77.

As played unless he folds in a lot of 3bet pots postflop I would just check and take the free card and see what happens on the turn.

Why would we want to get lead into us with his entire range when the turn bricks off when we can bet the flop and if he folds Ax good if he doesnt who cares we are flipping vs that range.

Because he 'should' shove over our cbet with any Ax and I doubt he'll fold a pocketpair.

Yea so what we are still at like what 42, 43% equity ? And the other way we get shat on on most turns, like even if an 8 comes and he bets out are we really happy calling there?

On July 06 2009 07:51 Twisted wrote: All I know is that I find it really funny that phexac thinks villain is ever folding TT+ on this board :D With current dynamic where we are 3betting with 68o I wouldn't be unhappy getting it in here with 77. As played unless he folds in a lot of 3bet pots postflop I would just check and take the free card and see what happens on the turn.

As I mentioned in my post, all that is very dependent on how the villain views the hero. While he 3bet 86o in this hand, it does not indicate anything about the way he played before. This could be the fist time he is getting out of line. Obviously, those plays don't have near the same fold equity if the villain knows you 3bet a fair bit against EP raisers and like to make plays. If you don't do it a lot, you can get away with a lot more the times you do chose to 3bet light. And can definitely fold out TT, often JJ and very rarely QQ. Think about it. You raise in EP and a guy who does not 3bet much in those situations all the sudden goes apeshit. You really going to think your TT or JJ is any good?

If there is a different dynamic, obviously check and try to hit is better.

Also note that my line also calls for a check behind. If we think opponent calls light or views us reasonably tight, we can shove over his bets on later streets. If not then we don't make the bluff shove, and my line is exactly the same as the check behind that other people have suggested.

So not really sure what you are disagreeing with in my post. Are you saying that you can't fathom a situation where you fold TT or JJ in EP OOP in 3bet pot post-flop?

My main gripe with the original post is that it gives a very situation-dependent spot and no information what so ever about it. Hence I tried to address several different scenarios. Don't get what you don't get.