Gaza Strip - Page 13

On January 12 2009 21:37 Sheitan wrote: Yeah they do that to save the face and berate Israelis for the exactions they commit on a daily basis directly or indirectly like the sabra and shatila massacre. Also, the arab coalition rejected the UN proposal but did not intend in the first place to attack Israel, Egypt/Syria/Jordan/Lebanon/Iraq invaded Israel when the Israelian government declared its independence, which was actually an unilateral decision.

If these things happen on a daily basis why'd you have to go back to 1982 for an example?

Israel declared independence the day before they were scheduled to receive it anyway. The five Arab states attacked them the very next day. So your idea is that the Arabs were so upset about one extra day of a Jewish state in the Middle East that they were able to mobilize their combined militaries and initiate conflict in a span of 24 hours?

On January 12 2009 21:27 VanDerMeyde wrote: Im suprised you didnt know this, but I guess when you live in USA the jewish lobby will not let this kind of important information get into your news channels...

Of course I knew about the settlers and the wall, can we quit with the "Jewish lobby" crap? Unless of course someone has done a comprehensive content analysis of US news vs Norwegian or whatever other news, which I doubt. One thing nobody mentioned is that as Prime Minister Sharon actually removed settlers from Gaza and worked toward the establishment of a Palestinian state. Israel has definitely done some wrong and stupid things but if you think this latest violence is about settlers or a UN resolution you are just totally misguided. Hamas does not want peace or a two-state compromise, it is their stated goal to drive the Jews into the sea. So when you raise these issues in a discussion of violence between the Israeli government and Hamas it's really just pointless.

On January 13 2009 01:28 Baal wrote: The solution is not foundin a state of jews in the middle of the arab world, same reason why you dont found a huge ass black community in the middle or rural alabama.

I'm sure the people who were in favor of "separate but equal" would agree wholeheartedly with this sentiment.

On January 13 2009 04:14 Liquid`Drone wrote: of course moderate islam can exist, a huge majority of muslims are moderate what you need is a secular state.. the country with the by far most muslims in the world isnt even in the middle east, and its a country with no mention of islam in the constitution.. there's also a very small degree of religious strife there.

Yes maybe it can exist but how?

Does some of the quran not count for them?

Do they just ignore the violent verses of the quran?

Do they ignore the fact that the quran itself say they are not true muslims if they dont follow the quran and hadiths?

I would like to know

On January 13 2009 04:52 Zorglub wrote: Show nested quote + On January 13 2009 04:14 Liquid`Drone wrote: of course moderate islam can exist, a huge majority of muslims are moderate what you need is a secular state.. the country with the by far most muslims in the world isnt even in the middle east, and its a country with no mention of islam in the constitution.. there's also a very small degree of religious strife there. Yes maybe it can exist but how? Does some of the quran not count for them? Do they just ignore the violent verses of the quran? Do they ignore the fact that the quran itself say they are not true muslims if they dont follow the quran and hadiths? I would like to know

Are you fucking blind or something? i just posted verses from the bible commanding the death of non-believers....

zomg how do Christians do it? do they ignore the bible???



and for your answer yes they do, they ignore parts of the Quran, same as christians ignore parts of the bible and so on, someobody who lives by a book written thousands of years ago is a simpleton.

On January 13 2009 05:01 Baal wrote: Show nested quote + On January 13 2009 04:52 Zorglub wrote:   On January 13 2009 04:14 Liquid`Drone wrote: of course moderate islam can exist, a huge majority of muslims are moderate what you need is a secular state.. the country with the by far most muslims in the world isnt even in the middle east, and its a country with no mention of islam in the constitution.. there's also a very small degree of religious strife there. Yes maybe it can exist but how? Does some of the quran not count for them? Do they just ignore the violent verses of the quran? Do they ignore the fact that the quran itself say they are not true muslims if they dont follow the quran and hadiths? I would like to know Are you fucking blind or something? i just posted verses from the bible commanding the death of non-believers.... zomg how do Christians do it? do they ignore the bible??? and for your answer yes they do, they ignore parts of the Quran, same as christians ignore parts of the bible and so on, someobody who lives by a book written thousands of years ago is a simpleton.

Do you even know the difference between the old and the new testament? Christians in my country at least dont follow the old testament, only jews and jehovas witness follow it, others follow the new testament

Do you realize that when the quran specificly states that if you dont follow it all you are not a muslim and wont go to heaven it makes no sense at all to follow part of it and still call yourself a muslim?

Baal if you continue your rediculous insults and teenage attitude and comments I will just ignore you, im not going to fall down on your level

On January 13 2009 05:34 Zorglub wrote: Show nested quote + On January 13 2009 05:01 Baal wrote:   On January 13 2009 04:52 Zorglub wrote:   On January 13 2009 04:14 Liquid`Drone wrote: of course moderate islam can exist, a huge majority of muslims are moderate what you need is a secular state.. the country with the by far most muslims in the world isnt even in the middle east, and its a country with no mention of islam in the constitution.. there's also a very small degree of religious strife there. Yes maybe it can exist but how? Does some of the quran not count for them? Do they just ignore the violent verses of the quran? Do they ignore the fact that the quran itself say they are not true muslims if they dont follow the quran and hadiths? I would like to know Are you fucking blind or something? i just posted verses from the bible commanding the death of non-believers.... zomg how do Christians do it? do they ignore the bible??? and for your answer yes they do, they ignore parts of the Quran, same as christians ignore parts of the bible and so on, someobody who lives by a book written thousands of years ago is a simpleton. Do you even know the difference between the old and the new testament? Christians in my country at least dont follow the old testament, only jews and jehovas witness follow it, others follow the new testament Do you realize that when the quran specificly states that if you dont follow it all you are not a muslim and wont go to heaven it makes no sense at all to follow part of it and still call yourself a muslim? Baal if you continue your rediculous insults and teenage attitude and comments I will just ignore you, im not going to fall down on your level

oh pleeeeeeeeease make me dig up verses in the new testament... PLEASE i beg you.

or just bend over and same yourself the public humillation of me proving that you dont follow all the bible

On January 13 2009 05:36 Baal wrote: Show nested quote + On January 13 2009 05:34 Zorglub wrote:   On January 13 2009 05:01 Baal wrote:   On January 13 2009 04:52 Zorglub wrote:   On January 13 2009 04:14 Liquid`Drone wrote: of course moderate islam can exist, a huge majority of muslims are moderate what you need is a secular state.. the country with the by far most muslims in the world isnt even in the middle east, and its a country with no mention of islam in the constitution.. there's also a very small degree of religious strife there. Yes maybe it can exist but how? Does some of the quran not count for them? Do they just ignore the violent verses of the quran? Do they ignore the fact that the quran itself say they are not true muslims if they dont follow the quran and hadiths? I would like to know Are you fucking blind or something? i just posted verses from the bible commanding the death of non-believers.... zomg how do Christians do it? do they ignore the bible??? and for your answer yes they do, they ignore parts of the Quran, same as christians ignore parts of the bible and so on, someobody who lives by a book written thousands of years ago is a simpleton. Do you even know the difference between the old and the new testament? Christians in my country at least dont follow the old testament, only jews and jehovas witness follow it, others follow the new testament Do you realize that when the quran specificly states that if you dont follow it all you are not a muslim and wont go to heaven it makes no sense at all to follow part of it and still call yourself a muslim? Baal if you continue your rediculous insults and teenage attitude and comments I will just ignore you, im not going to fall down on your level oh pleeeeeeeeease make me dig up verses in the new testament... PLEASE i beg you. or just bend over and same yourself the public humillation of me proving that you dont follow all the bible

Please dig, but I dont know what the fuck you have been reading in this thread, if you read just a few of my posts it should not come as a big surprise that I dont follow the bible or anything religious at all, im an atheist. And you really need to grow up, how old are you, 15?

On January 13 2009 05:45 Zorglub wrote: Show nested quote + On January 13 2009 05:36 Baal wrote:   On January 13 2009 05:34 Zorglub wrote:   On January 13 2009 05:01 Baal wrote:   On January 13 2009 04:52 Zorglub wrote:   On January 13 2009 04:14 Liquid`Drone wrote: of course moderate islam can exist, a huge majority of muslims are moderate what you need is a secular state.. the country with the by far most muslims in the world isnt even in the middle east, and its a country with no mention of islam in the constitution.. there's also a very small degree of religious strife there. Yes maybe it can exist but how? Does some of the quran not count for them? Do they just ignore the violent verses of the quran? Do they ignore the fact that the quran itself say they are not true muslims if they dont follow the quran and hadiths? I would like to know Are you fucking blind or something? i just posted verses from the bible commanding the death of non-believers.... zomg how do Christians do it? do they ignore the bible??? and for your answer yes they do, they ignore parts of the Quran, same as christians ignore parts of the bible and so on, someobody who lives by a book written thousands of years ago is a simpleton. Do you even know the difference between the old and the new testament? Christians in my country at least dont follow the old testament, only jews and jehovas witness follow it, others follow the new testament Do you realize that when the quran specificly states that if you dont follow it all you are not a muslim and wont go to heaven it makes no sense at all to follow part of it and still call yourself a muslim? Baal if you continue your rediculous insults and teenage attitude and comments I will just ignore you, im not going to fall down on your level oh pleeeeeeeeease make me dig up verses in the new testament... PLEASE i beg you. or just bend over and same yourself the public humillation of me proving that you dont follow all the bible Please dig, but I dont know what the fuck you have been reading in this thread, if you read just a few of my posts it should not come as a big surprise that I dont follow the bible or anything religious at all, im an atheist. And you really need to grow up, how old are you, 15?

you are making dumb asumptions talking about how evil the Quran is... and indeed its evil, but so is the bible (old and new testament) the Torah and all the holy books, its not hard to figure out, they were written by religious zealots in ancient times, its obviously irrational violence is going to be in those books.

On January 13 2009 05:52 Baal wrote: Show nested quote + On January 13 2009 05:45 Zorglub wrote:   On January 13 2009 05:36 Baal wrote:   On January 13 2009 05:34 Zorglub wrote:   On January 13 2009 05:01 Baal wrote:   On January 13 2009 04:52 Zorglub wrote:   On January 13 2009 04:14 Liquid`Drone wrote: of course moderate islam can exist, a huge majority of muslims are moderate what you need is a secular state.. the country with the by far most muslims in the world isnt even in the middle east, and its a country with no mention of islam in the constitution.. there's also a very small degree of religious strife there. Yes maybe it can exist but how? Does some of the quran not count for them? Do they just ignore the violent verses of the quran? Do they ignore the fact that the quran itself say they are not true muslims if they dont follow the quran and hadiths? I would like to know Are you fucking blind or something? i just posted verses from the bible commanding the death of non-believers.... zomg how do Christians do it? do they ignore the bible??? and for your answer yes they do, they ignore parts of the Quran, same as christians ignore parts of the bible and so on, someobody who lives by a book written thousands of years ago is a simpleton. Do you even know the difference between the old and the new testament? Christians in my country at least dont follow the old testament, only jews and jehovas witness follow it, others follow the new testament Do you realize that when the quran specificly states that if you dont follow it all you are not a muslim and wont go to heaven it makes no sense at all to follow part of it and still call yourself a muslim? Baal if you continue your rediculous insults and teenage attitude and comments I will just ignore you, im not going to fall down on your level oh pleeeeeeeeease make me dig up verses in the new testament... PLEASE i beg you. or just bend over and same yourself the public humillation of me proving that you dont follow all the bible Please dig, but I dont know what the fuck you have been reading in this thread, if you read just a few of my posts it should not come as a big surprise that I dont follow the bible or anything religious at all, im an atheist. And you really need to grow up, how old are you, 15? you are making dumb asumptions talking about how evil the Quran is... and indeed its evil

Way to contradict yourself...

I never said anything about other religions not beeing evil, in fact I said all religions suck, but I stated the things about the quran because Islam was the topic of the discussion, sometimes you are hopeless....

On January 13 2009 06:04 Zorglub wrote: Show nested quote + On January 13 2009 05:52 Baal wrote:   On January 13 2009 05:45 Zorglub wrote:   On January 13 2009 05:36 Baal wrote:   On January 13 2009 05:34 Zorglub wrote:   On January 13 2009 05:01 Baal wrote:   On January 13 2009 04:52 Zorglub wrote:   On January 13 2009 04:14 Liquid`Drone wrote: of course moderate islam can exist, a huge majority of muslims are moderate what you need is a secular state.. the country with the by far most muslims in the world isnt even in the middle east, and its a country with no mention of islam in the constitution.. there's also a very small degree of religious strife there. Yes maybe it can exist but how? Does some of the quran not count for them? Do they just ignore the violent verses of the quran? Do they ignore the fact that the quran itself say they are not true muslims if they dont follow the quran and hadiths? I would like to know Are you fucking blind or something? i just posted verses from the bible commanding the death of non-believers.... zomg how do Christians do it? do they ignore the bible??? and for your answer yes they do, they ignore parts of the Quran, same as christians ignore parts of the bible and so on, someobody who lives by a book written thousands of years ago is a simpleton. Do you even know the difference between the old and the new testament? Christians in my country at least dont follow the old testament, only jews and jehovas witness follow it, others follow the new testament Do you realize that when the quran specificly states that if you dont follow it all you are not a muslim and wont go to heaven it makes no sense at all to follow part of it and still call yourself a muslim? Baal if you continue your rediculous insults and teenage attitude and comments I will just ignore you, im not going to fall down on your level oh pleeeeeeeeease make me dig up verses in the new testament... PLEASE i beg you. or just bend over and same yourself the public humillation of me proving that you dont follow all the bible Please dig, but I dont know what the fuck you have been reading in this thread, if you read just a few of my posts it should not come as a big surprise that I dont follow the bible or anything religious at all, im an atheist. And you really need to grow up, how old are you, 15? you are making dumb asumptions talking about how evil the Quran is... and indeed its evil Way to contradict yourself... I never said anything about other religions not beeing evil, in fact I said all religions suck, but I stated the things about the quran because Islam was the topic of the discussion, sometimes you are hopeless....

the topic is not only islam is also judaism and its retarded to mention the Quran's "flaws" withouth doing the same for the Torahn.

otherwise what is the fucking point in doing so?

http://www.newgrounds.com/portal/view/476393

I AM THE MESIAH, KEEP LAUNCHING EM.

On January 13 2009 06:23 Baal wrote: Show nested quote + On January 13 2009 06:04 Zorglub wrote:   On January 13 2009 05:52 Baal wrote:   On January 13 2009 05:45 Zorglub wrote:   On January 13 2009 05:36 Baal wrote:   On January 13 2009 05:34 Zorglub wrote:   On January 13 2009 05:01 Baal wrote:   On January 13 2009 04:52 Zorglub wrote:   On January 13 2009 04:14 Liquid`Drone wrote: of course moderate islam can exist, a huge majority of muslims are moderate what you need is a secular state.. the country with the by far most muslims in the world isnt even in the middle east, and its a country with no mention of islam in the constitution.. there's also a very small degree of religious strife there. Yes maybe it can exist but how? Does some of the quran not count for them? Do they just ignore the violent verses of the quran? Do they ignore the fact that the quran itself say they are not true muslims if they dont follow the quran and hadiths? I would like to know Are you fucking blind or something? i just posted verses from the bible commanding the death of non-believers.... zomg how do Christians do it? do they ignore the bible??? and for your answer yes they do, they ignore parts of the Quran, same as christians ignore parts of the bible and so on, someobody who lives by a book written thousands of years ago is a simpleton. Do you even know the difference between the old and the new testament? Christians in my country at least dont follow the old testament, only jews and jehovas witness follow it, others follow the new testament Do you realize that when the quran specificly states that if you dont follow it all you are not a muslim and wont go to heaven it makes no sense at all to follow part of it and still call yourself a muslim? Baal if you continue your rediculous insults and teenage attitude and comments I will just ignore you, im not going to fall down on your level oh pleeeeeeeeease make me dig up verses in the new testament... PLEASE i beg you. or just bend over and same yourself the public humillation of me proving that you dont follow all the bible Please dig, but I dont know what the fuck you have been reading in this thread, if you read just a few of my posts it should not come as a big surprise that I dont follow the bible or anything religious at all, im an atheist. And you really need to grow up, how old are you, 15? you are making dumb asumptions talking about how evil the Quran is... and indeed its evil Way to contradict yourself... I never said anything about other religions not beeing evil, in fact I said all religions suck, but I stated the things about the quran because Islam was the topic of the discussion, sometimes you are hopeless.... the topic is not only islam is also judaism and its retarded to mention the Quran's "flaws" withouth doing the same for the Torahn. otherwise what is the fucking point in doing so?

That is apparently what you dont understand about discussing things in a civilized manner, I know some stuff about Islam so that is what I am writing about, I dont know much about judaism so I dont write anything about it, that is how a discussion is supposed to work, you talk about stuff you know and you learn new things from other people about stuff they know

You are beginning to piss me off, my topic was Islam, you were the one involving other religions. I was discussing Islam with VanDerMeyde and asking Drone about how moderate Islam works before you interfered with all your teenage crap comments

On January 13 2009 04:52 Zorglub wrote: Show nested quote + On January 13 2009 04:14 Liquid`Drone wrote: of course moderate islam can exist, a huge majority of muslims are moderate what you need is a secular state.. the country with the by far most muslims in the world isnt even in the middle east, and its a country with no mention of islam in the constitution.. there's also a very small degree of religious strife there. Yes maybe it can exist but how? Does some of the quran not count for them? Do they just ignore the violent verses of the quran? Do they ignore the fact that the quran itself say they are not true muslims if they dont follow the quran and hadiths? I would like to know

yes they ignore parts of the quran.. all these holy books contradict eachother many times.. all sane christians also ignore the part of the bible where it claims the earth is 6-7k years old and that the world was created in 7 days.. in fact good, moderate christians usually try to ignore many of the churchal interpretations of the bible - they rather try to be inspired by jesus' words and teachings..

likewise, you have many muslims who use the quran as a general guideline for how they should ideally try to behave and be a good person, but ignore stuff like "you shall not drink alcohol". (the quran has many violent verses, but it also has many nonviolent verses. to stay on the theme with the riots in oslo earlier, there was actually a pretty interesting scenario there.. there are some gangs in oslo and some notable gangmembers, whom frequently use violence and well, generally don't behave like what we westerns consider "good, productive members of society" were taking part of the riots. but at one point, there was some 73 year old guy carrying an israeli flag who was about to / in the process of getting beat up, and then two of the most notable gangmembers defended the 73 year old and used the quran as a reference point as to why the man should not be attacked.. )

im not a religious man either, but you must realize that religion, while it has the potential to bring out the worst in people, also genuinely inspires many to behave in an as unselfish, charitable, altruistic and "good" way as possible.

On January 13 2009 07:12 Liquid`Drone wrote: Show nested quote + On January 13 2009 04:52 Zorglub wrote:   On January 13 2009 04:14 Liquid`Drone wrote: of course moderate islam can exist, a huge majority of muslims are moderate what you need is a secular state.. the country with the by far most muslims in the world isnt even in the middle east, and its a country with no mention of islam in the constitution.. there's also a very small degree of religious strife there. Yes maybe it can exist but how? Does some of the quran not count for them? Do they just ignore the violent verses of the quran? Do they ignore the fact that the quran itself say they are not true muslims if they dont follow the quran and hadiths? I would like to know yes they ignore parts of the quran.. all these holy books contradict eachother many times.. all sane christians also ignore the part of the bible where it claims the earth is 6-7k years old and that the world was created in 7 days.. in fact good, moderate christians usually try to ignore many of the churchal interpretations of the bible - they rather try to be inspired by jesus' words and teachings.. likewise, you have many muslims who use the quran as a general guideline for how they should ideally try to behave and be a good person, but ignore stuff like "you shall not drink alcohol". (the quran has many violent verses, but it also has many nonviolent verses. to stay on the theme with the riots in oslo earlier, there was actually a pretty interesting scenario there.. there are some gangs in oslo and some notable gangmembers, whom frequently use violence and well, generally don't behave like what we westerns consider "good, productive members of society" were taking part of the riots. but at one point, there was some 73 year old guy carrying an israeli flag who was about to / in the process of getting beat up, and then two of the most notable gangmembers defended the 73 year old and used the quran as a reference point as to why the man should not be attacked.. ) im not a religious man either, but you must realize that religion, while it has the potential to bring out the worst in people, also genuinely inspires many to behave in an as unselfish, charitable, altruistic and "good" way as possible.

Yes I bet it does, but you hardly ever hear any "good" stuff comming from Islam, what you hear is mostly about radical muslims, jihad and violence. The moderate muslims are also very quiet when it comes to protesting against the acts of radical muslims unfortunatly, so if you dont know any moderate muslims personally it is easy to believe that they dont exist or are few and far between

well moderate christians are also very quiet in protesting the acts of radical christians..

I remember an article by this guy named timothy garton ash, a brilliant figure whom it seems specializes on the relationship between the islamic and the western world

one of the things that truly appalled him was how somehow, much of the western world has decided to interpret islam based on the preachings of the most radical and insane islamists, whom make up a small percentage and even only have the support of a small percentage of muslims, rather than listening to the moderate islamic scholars..

granted, extremist islam does have stronger foothold in the middle east than extremist christianity has in europe, but first of all, the middle eastern muslims are a minority (although the ones who get by far most media coverage in the west.), secondly, the extremists are a minority even in the middle east.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2007/mar/15/religion.comment for one of his most important articles, you should google him and read more of his stuff if you want to learn more about this. frankly, that article should probably be read by everyone in this entire thread, I had read it before but rereading it now is useful for me.

On January 13 2009 01:28 Baal wrote: Show nested quote + On January 13 2009 00:54 Zorglub wrote:   On January 13 2009 00:15 VanDerMeyde wrote:   On January 12 2009 21:56 Zorglub wrote:   On January 12 2009 21:44 VanDerMeyde wrote: Zorglub, UN has numerous amount of times stated that Israel must withdraw (?) (damn my english sucks) to their original borders from 1967. One of the resolutions typically pointed to is 242 This is what UN is working for exactly what you describe. Trading the borders for peace is what is needed to be done if this conflict is to EVER END. What is the alternative ? Yea but one of the conditions in resolution 242 is that the palestinians must accept Israel as a sovereign nation and Hamas refuses to do that, they want Israel off the map so as long as they have power, peace is never going to happen (ii) Termination of all claims or states of belligerency and respect for and acknowledgement of the sovereignty, territorial integrity and political independence of every State in the area and their right to live in peace within secure and recognized boundaries free from threats or acts of force So what can we do to get peace then If I knew that I would be a nobel prize winner The solution is not foundin a state of jews in the middle of the arab world, same reason why you dont found a huge ass black community in the middle or rural alabama.

wow kill yourself, people need to learn how to coexist, ur solution is segregation? not to mention how many black communities exist in alabama but are pretty much segregated from the white ones. Intergration is happening now albeit very slowly. There was and still is a lot of racial violence way 'even' in America, but it never got better until the African American community started having non violent protests for equal rights, there is no solution to the crisis that is violent.

On January 13 2009 07:47 Liquid`Drone wrote: well moderate christians are also very quiet in protesting the acts of radical christians.. I remember an article by this guy named timothy garton ash, a brilliant figure whom it seems specializes on the relationship between the islamic and the western world one of the things that truly appalled him was how somehow, much of the western world has decided to interpret islam based on the preachings of the most radical and insane islamists, whom make up a small percentage and even only have the support of a small percentage of muslims, rather than listening to the moderate islamic scholars.. granted, extremist islam does have stronger foothold in the middle east than extremist christianity has in europe, but first of all, the middle eastern muslims are a minority (although the ones who get by far most media coverage in the west.), secondly, the extremists are a minority even in the middle east. http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2007/mar/15/religion.comment for one of his most important articles, you should google him and read more of his stuff if you want to learn more about this. frankly, that article should probably be read by everyone in this entire thread, I had read it before but rereading it now is useful for me.

Well two wrongs doesn't make a right, also it is not often radical christians make terrorist attacks that kill thousands of civilians, I really really miss hearing moderate muslims distancing themselves from these acts, it might also prevent others from doing the same acts

On January 13 2009 08:06 Roman wrote: Show nested quote + On January 13 2009 01:28 Baal wrote:   On January 13 2009 00:54 Zorglub wrote:   On January 13 2009 00:15 VanDerMeyde wrote:   On January 12 2009 21:56 Zorglub wrote:   On January 12 2009 21:44 VanDerMeyde wrote: Zorglub, UN has numerous amount of times stated that Israel must withdraw (?) (damn my english sucks) to their original borders from 1967. One of the resolutions typically pointed to is 242 This is what UN is working for exactly what you describe. Trading the borders for peace is what is needed to be done if this conflict is to EVER END. What is the alternative ? Yea but one of the conditions in resolution 242 is that the palestinians must accept Israel as a sovereign nation and Hamas refuses to do that, they want Israel off the map so as long as they have power, peace is never going to happen (ii) Termination of all claims or states of belligerency and respect for and acknowledgement of the sovereignty, territorial integrity and political independence of every State in the area and their right to live in peace within secure and recognized boundaries free from threats or acts of force So what can we do to get peace then If I knew that I would be a nobel prize winner The solution is not foundin a state of jews in the middle of the arab world, same reason why you dont found a huge ass black community in the middle or rural alabama. wow kill yourself, people need to learn how to coexist, ur solution is segregation? not to mention how many black communities exist in alabama but are pretty much segregated from the white ones. Intergration is happening now albeit very slowly. There was and still is a lot of racial violence way 'even' in America, but it never got better until the African American community started having non violent protests for equal rights, there is no solution to the crisis that is violent.

dumbass, when did i say segregation is the solution, im saying that stablishing Israel in the middle of the arab world is obviously going to generate endless war.

On January 13 2009 08:21 Zorglub wrote: Show nested quote + On January 13 2009 07:47 Liquid`Drone wrote: well moderate christians are also very quiet in protesting the acts of radical christians.. I remember an article by this guy named timothy garton ash, a brilliant figure whom it seems specializes on the relationship between the islamic and the western world one of the things that truly appalled him was how somehow, much of the western world has decided to interpret islam based on the preachings of the most radical and insane islamists, whom make up a small percentage and even only have the support of a small percentage of muslims, rather than listening to the moderate islamic scholars.. granted, extremist islam does have stronger foothold in the middle east than extremist christianity has in europe, but first of all, the middle eastern muslims are a minority (although the ones who get by far most media coverage in the west.), secondly, the extremists are a minority even in the middle east. http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2007/mar/15/religion.comment for one of his most important articles, you should google him and read more of his stuff if you want to learn more about this. frankly, that article should probably be read by everyone in this entire thread, I had read it before but rereading it now is useful for me. Well two wrongs doesn't make a right, also it is not often radical christians make terrorist attacks that kill thousands of civilians, I really really miss hearing moderate muslims distancing themselves from these acts, it might also prevent others from doing the same acts

radical christians dont blow themselves up however they elect one of their own and in the name of their god they go slay other civiliations killing 100 times more than any arab terrorist act.

I dont know how this got to religion, in this particular situation religion is only a tiny part of it.

On January 13 2009 08:31 Baal wrote: Show nested quote + On January 13 2009 08:06 Roman wrote:   On January 13 2009 01:28 Baal wrote:   On January 13 2009 00:54 Zorglub wrote:   On January 13 2009 00:15 VanDerMeyde wrote:   On January 12 2009 21:56 Zorglub wrote:   On January 12 2009 21:44 VanDerMeyde wrote: Zorglub, UN has numerous amount of times stated that Israel must withdraw (?) (damn my english sucks) to their original borders from 1967. One of the resolutions typically pointed to is 242 This is what UN is working for exactly what you describe. Trading the borders for peace is what is needed to be done if this conflict is to EVER END. What is the alternative ? Yea but one of the conditions in resolution 242 is that the palestinians must accept Israel as a sovereign nation and Hamas refuses to do that, they want Israel off the map so as long as they have power, peace is never going to happen (ii) Termination of all claims or states of belligerency and respect for and acknowledgement of the sovereignty, territorial integrity and political independence of every State in the area and their right to live in peace within secure and recognized boundaries free from threats or acts of force So what can we do to get peace then If I knew that I would be a nobel prize winner The solution is not foundin a state of jews in the middle of the arab world, same reason why you dont found a huge ass black community in the middle or rural alabama. wow kill yourself, people need to learn how to coexist, ur solution is segregation? not to mention how many black communities exist in alabama but are pretty much segregated from the white ones. Intergration is happening now albeit very slowly. There was and still is a lot of racial violence way 'even' in America, but it never got better until the African American community started having non violent protests for equal rights, there is no solution to the crisis that is violent. dumbass, when did i say segregation is the solution, im saying that stablishing Israel in the middle of the arab world is obviously going to generate endless war.

how and why is that so obvious?