Ethical Question... - Page 8

On November 24 2008 14:42 lebowski wrote: ok brambolius there are some reasons why we won't be able to reach a mutual understanding -you believe humans are 'outside of nature's laws' when in fact nothing is outside of nature's laws and humans just happen to be more complex than the rest of earth's species -you create an almost metaphysical feature that defines the sense of wrong or right and you call it conscience,implying that it is the same for everyone and that people who act in an 'evil' way just misinterpret it/ try to not listen to it. Whereas in fact what a person understands as right or wrong changes greatly as he grows up,according to his age AND surroundings. Even gender plays a role in it.This is very common knowledge,try a few searches on the work of Piaget (30's),Kohlberg(70's),Gilligan (80's) to see their findings/failures concerning kids and the way they evolve their ethics and how much this is influenced by the society they grow up in. -you seem to think that morality is a very simple matter (!) too. Well that would have been great for all those guys struggling to make sense of what is moral concerning all the latest technological achievements,conflicting 'human rights' etc. Let me try to put it this way; if you don't lay back on god's wisdom to create the moral code which benefits humanity,this is the most difficult task humans have to face when/if they work collectively -you can't empathise and escape your own view on the world. 'Causing grief/pain for no reason'? Do you think the Vikings felt that way? How about the Romans with their wars? Is the search for power reason enough? You think that your western -influenced greatly by christianity- beliefs ever applied to these people? How can your moral sense ever condemn them when it was historically impossible for them to think the way you do(even if they wanted to,which I doubt) about things. What does the fact that a child hurts worms naturally tell you about our inclinations as a species? Does it say that we were meant to think it's bad to hurt what we consider as lesser beings for no reason? Newsflash: every mammal on the planet does it when they start exploring their strength. Why should your friend feel ashamed about cutting worms in half when he was young,what's next? Feeling guilty about musterbating?

ok i could write another big ass post but i'll just suffice by saying no, i don't feel guilty about masturbating, its fucking great.

woops lol i'm on my buddies comp :D

there is no such thing as a concience...

What defines right and wrong? simple.. rational thinking should lead you do perfectly define right from wrong, however its hard to be rational when ur midn its all cramped in all the fake values embedded in you by society.

You would be surprised how many of your values are just burrowed from society, even your damn sexuality, if u were greek before christ, you would be happily banging hairy guys.

TedHasting, lebowski, and Baal are right from what I could read.

brambolius, you shouldn't expect anyone to read that wall of text after writing that bullshit post that says "THERE IS RIGHT AND THERE IS WRONG BECAUSE I SAY SO"

the fact that floofy agrees says it all. you are wrong.

On November 24 2008 09:12 SpasticInk wrote: that it's wrong to kill is pretty universal that it happens doesnt disprove the universality of it

well, is it entirely universal? (i don't think so)

and even if it is, does it not come in different shades?

no its not universal many cultures had human sacrifices, and many of those were accepted as a "gift", like aztecs.

On November 24 2008 12:07 Baal wrote: Show nested quote + On November 23 2008 21:48 TedHastings wrote:   On November 23 2008 11:17 brambolius wrote: the fact that nobody gives a shit doesn't make it morally right. If i torture and kill, but nobody cares, that doesn't make it morally right. Actually this is 100% false because morality is a social construct. You only think torturing and killing is wrong because society has determined it to be so. For instance how do you know that posting messages on an internet forum is not morally wrong? There is no ultimate moral code because there is no God, and to suggest that there is is ridiculous. Everyone must decide for themselves what is right and wrong, but most just choose to accept the dictates of their society. This is 100% right, taking the values out of society is retarded, but 99% of people do : <

I dont think morals are universal either but using the morals we adopted through centuries and many are agreeing upon, is absolutely not retarded in a complicated matter like this. In fact, if every retard on earth had to completely make up their own morals, never influenced by another human, I think this world would be hell on earth for everyone.


Btw. Christians didn't invent the many basic moral codes, for example the ten commandments, many of these "rules" were in place in societies long before christianity was invented and many of them are also in use in societies not influenced by christianity.

Maybe most people adopt these morals because they make sense.

Did society rules made sense in ancient greek?, did they make sense when marrying a 13yo girl was standard? they dont make sense i can name dozens of current values that are just plain retarded.

Etiquette is retarded, age of concent is retarded, drug illegality is retarded, political correctness is retarded, nationalism is retarded, religiosity is retarded etc etc etc.

You have a strong point on the fact that if everbody had true fee will they would miss use it since most people are plain retards tho, but after all, society is the conjunction of these retards, and they collectively "chose" these rules, so you can say in some way our current rules are the sublimation of this retard's ideology.

On November 24 2008 17:05 Baal wrote: Did society rules made sense in ancient greek?, did they make sense when marrying a 13yo girl was standard? they dont make sense i can name dozens of current values that are just plain retarded. Etiquette is retarded, age of concent is retarded, drug illegality is retarded, political correctness is retarded, nationalism is retarded, religiosity is retarded etc etc etc. You have a strong point on the fact that if everbody had true fee will they would miss use it since most people are plain retards tho, but after all, society is the conjunction of these retards, and they collectively "chose" these rules, so you can say in some way our current rules are the sublimation of this retard's ideology.

Ancient greek rules made sense to ancient greeks, if you lived in that time and adopted those rules, I dont think it is retarded in any way. Their morals were evolved for their time and their society.

You are right there are many retards, I dont think they outnumber reasonable people though, and even if they did they would still be easily manipulated by smarter guys to adopt their rules, so im not sure they had a big impact in making these rules over time, even if I dont agree on every commonly accepted moral value I think most of them makes sense, the few I dont agree in is maybe the influence these retards had

On November 21 2008 12:15 [vital]Myth wrote: where's the option for taking advantage of his addiction and haggling down to $25?

Best Answer

On November 24 2008 17:05 Baal wrote: did they make sense when marrying a 13yo girl was standard? .

what whas life expectancy in ancient greece?

yes for sure do it. fuck him... unless hes your boy

On November 24 2008 17:05 Baal wrote: Did society rules made sense in ancient greek?, did they make sense when marrying a 13yo girl was standard? they dont make sense i can name dozens of current values that are just plain retarded. Etiquette is retarded, age of concent is retarded, drug illegality is retarded, political correctness is retarded, nationalism is retarded, religiosity is retarded etc etc etc. You have a strong point on the fact that if everbody had true fee will they would miss use it since most people are plain retards tho, but after all, society is the conjunction of these retards, and they collectively "chose" these rules, so you can say in some way our current rules are the sublimation of this retard's ideology.

wow a very nice post from baal

On November 24 2008 17:39 gymnast wrote: Show nested quote + On November 24 2008 17:05 Baal wrote: did they make sense when marrying a 13yo girl was standard? . what whas life expectancy in ancient greece?

an interesting point but I don't think it's entirely relevant when it's old guys who are doing the marrying

not to say it isn't relevant at all

I think it was a dialogue between plato and socrates where they discussed that the best age to have sex with a young man is when he is just starting to grow a beard lol.
That was in our school's ancient greek textbook too

if theres grass on the chin, play ball

On November 24 2008 17:48 asdf2000 wrote: an interesting point but I don't think it's entirely relevant when it's old guys who are doing the marrying not to say it isn't relevant at all

But how old were they?, I mean it was correct in that time, not retarded, religion is not retarded, drug prohibition is not retarded, extremism is what is retarded.

On November 24 2008 18:05 fakeshaver wrote: if theres grass on the chin, play ball

LOL

On November 24 2008 18:37 gymnast wrote: Show nested quote + On November 24 2008 17:48 asdf2000 wrote: an interesting point but I don't think it's entirely relevant when it's old guys who are doing the marrying not to say it isn't relevant at all But how old were they?, I mean it was correct in that time, not retarded, religion is not retarded, drug prohibition is not retarded, extremism is what is retarded.

correct? I will assume correct means something along the lines of "morally justified", otherwise I am not sure what you mean by "correct".


anyways, just because society is structured in such a way that it promotes certain behavior does not mean that behavior is "correct".

was slavery "correct" when the U.S. economy was completely dependent upon it?

i think even whitout society someone could guess that fucking a 9 year old girl and then torturing it is not right

I would say that morality is based upon understanding of the effects of your actions upon other individuals.