Another Orbit

Perhaps my expensive habit is procrastination

Yea your right my saying "As well" doesnt make sense.

I am just in a zone where I want to sleep in and watch "Death Note" so that is what I will do. Bendered it up last night and slept until noon. It feels great. It may not feel great when I have to get up at 6 am for work but that won't be for at least a week so fuck it right? Job search has crashed to a halt. I only have ideas of venturing in to the steel mills now. Perhaps apply for an assistant shopkeeper position at my favorite ice cream place. Then it is just throwing darts at the wall and seeing what sticks. Fucking horrendous part of existence but I can't just work 12-16 hours a week at a sub par job. I have about a month to find a new job. It's at times like these where I want to pray to some god to make everything better but that is silly. I am a sum of my actions...

Oh boy, this is going to get into a determinist vs. compatiblist situation... I don't really want to go there right now. I honestly think I make more strides in my life as a compatiblist than as a determinist so I should believe in the compatiblist viewpoint. Would I be better off believing in a Christian God? I don't think that question matters because it would be a seemingly impossible task with my current psyche.

Fuck it, I'll watch some "Death Note." Maybe something will come to me. That might be my favorite phrase. Maybe something will come to me. It is better than sitting at Indeed.com with a blank search trying to figure out what I might be interested in but I can't survive on $100/wk......

Oh well, at this point this might be word pollution and I am not sure where it is getting me. Time to block everything out and watch "Death Note" and hope things end up ok......

At this point in time that is really all I want in life. To be able to sleep in and watch "Death Note."

On September 03 2017 22:24 RiKD wrote: Perhaps my expensive habit is procrastination

I think it might be more broadly complacency. One part of that is that you are all too willing to accept, day after day, surrogates over the real thing. Surrogates only give you the illusion of having something. In reality, it makes daily living more meaningless and frustrating. You never get used to them but live as if you were going to. The best gift we can offer ourselves is allowing ourselves to be alone and to hurt. That reveals the essential which surrogates constantly hide and distract us from. Then we can take appropriate action because we know ourselves better and we know what, above all, we don't want: more meaninglessness.

So, what you are saying is that I am accepting sleep, posting on LP, facebook, "Death Note," films, and the like as the real thing. What exactly is the "real thing" in your eyes? I would agree that the activities previously listed are all escapes. There might be a little more to posting on LP than just an escape.

I don't think there is a science to what brings us meaning. It is really just sort of anecdotal. I would imagine having a kid is the ultimate "meaning" bringer but I will likely never know. Adoption being right up there. I may adopt someday but I never have so I can not really comment on it but I have helped my parents with a rescue cat and dog. I derive some inkling of meaning from it when I take care of them. Helping the suffering alcoholic always brings me a feeling of meaning and many times contentment or it may be hard to describe. Maybe sometimes it is even a smugness. So, these meanings that we can get on Earth are not clockwork and maybe not reliable in how we are feeling. I am definitely self-centered and doing my best not to be. When helping others truly it is almost impossible to be self centered. This is kind of jumbled. I wanted to respond but have to be somewhere pretty soon. I would also like to hear about what you think is meaningful and the relationship between finding some meaning here on earth and quality of life and vice versa. Can we have quality of life with out meaning?

When she makes that brussels sprout and cheddar cheese pie though...

LP and Facebook are good examples of what I mean. They give you the illusion of being connected to people. For as long as you persist under the illusion that you have friends there, you are less likely to move into the real world and find real friendships there. The surrogate still fuels you, gives you a little of what you need, and it keeps you going for more, kind of like the person who mostly eats junk food. It comes with a feeling of unease, of dissatisfaction. But this is what life has become and you hardly ever question it anymore.

Writing in public blogs is not the real thing. We necessarily limit who we are when we are writing in public like this. You don't get to the bottom of things in these blogs. Whatever you derive from it could be derived in full elsewhere. Maybe complacency isn't the perfect word for what I'm thinking of. It has more to do with having low standards for oneself. Not to be contrasted with being ambitious though. It's just about having a clearer idea of who you want to be rather than the things you want to accomplish.

Where could it be derived in full elsewhere?

I suppose it could be said that I have low standards for myself. It is not so easy working the 2nd shift. My only friends here right now are my parents and a 50 year old and a 75 year old I met in a "Freethinkers" AA meeting. Maybe my problem is also follow up or follow through. I lived a pretty full life friends wise in Pittsburgh and want some semblance of that here so I don't necessarily think it is low standards. Perhaps it is because I am typically ok with sleeping in, posting on LP, watching "Death Note," taking my dog for a walk, reading some poetry or literature, watching House Hunters International, watching a film. My schedule is always changing and that is a bit frustrating but I could do a better job on following through on some of the avenues to making real friends.

What we accomplish will mold us and define us. It seems really difficult to piece out who we want to be from things like wanting an apartment or wanting to go to Tokyo or wanting quality friends.

I guess it is all semantics but I don't think meeting with friends for a good time really adds meaning to our lives. It improves our quality of life. If I became a nurse or a therapist, adopted a child, took in some rescue pets, and tirelessly sought out alcoholics I could help that would be a life full of terrestrial meaning but I don't think it guarantees quality of life.

Where could it be derived in full elsewhere?

Well, for instance, when you feel like pouring your heart out, doing so with a friend in real life, or a therapist, or through making a piece of music, it gives you the full experience that you need. Doing so on a website, especially one where people are very self-centered, offers you next to nothing.

I think you definitely do have low standards. I mean, you're routinely posting these long blogs about yourself on a dead site. A site that was created with the purpose of making money by helping people make money through gambling. Just that seems like pretty hard evidence to me. All of us who no longer gamble and who remain participants here need to admit that we're not using our time very wisely. I don't mean to be insensitive by saying this, obviously having moved to a new city and abandoned most of your old life and friends is a serious thing to get over and by no means should it be easy for you to do so.

Wishing for things to be like they were before, how is that evidence of not having low standards? Everyone who is not doing very well will have such thoughts. It says nothing about their standards. Standards aren't about wants, they're about what you actually do with yourself to invite change and development into your life -- how often you decide to cultivate yourself for those changes to be possible versus how often you distract yourself. As for social media like Facebook, studies are pretty clear that the more people spend using them, the more unhappy and depressed they are.

It's not really about quality of life vs meaning in life. They both complement and add to each other. Adding meaning to our lives directly improves our quality of life because human beings can't stand having a meaningless life for very long. And having a higher quality of life allows us to pursue more meaningful endeavors.

I took a walk today on the beach where I would be mostly alone. The beach was mostly empty. I guess it did not hurt enough. The shimmering of the waves, the cool breeze, my dog happily by my side. Although there were moments of hurt I could just think that I want to have integrity, be kind, courteous, compassionate. I already have these qualities. There were thoughts of being braver and more courageous. Perhaps there is something there. I still think it is really hard to disassociate who I want to be and accomplishments. I want to be someone that does not drink, I want to be someone that gets his own apartment, I want to be someone that travels to tokyo and kyoto. I want to be someone that has quality friends. I suppose all of these things are achievements. There is some ambition involved but there is ambition involved with becoming more brave, or adventurous, or less complacent. Most change takes some level of determination.

I suppose with these blogs it was just something I latched onto. Like the rat pushes the button for more cocaine. It is easier to take a seat and go into a reverie of my thoughts than it is to actually go out and meet people. I may have learned some things along the way. It doesn't have quite the magic of meeting people for real. Mostly none of the magic.

Working in food and bev I am going to always be dragged into working the 2nd shift if I want any hours. I just got home and ate some dinner and it is 10:40pm in a sleepy town full of retirees. Now, I am in the process of getting a different job but with what I have applied to that will likely have potential for 2nd shift work too. I am really thinking about getting into an office somewhere like someone suggested. I don't know how that is done. Getting into an office with cool people working an 8-4 or a 9-5 with weekends consistently off might be where it's at. See, it is not so bad posting on here. It allows me to work through some thoughts. I have maybe another hour or so of being awake. I don't really know what else to do at this point. It is all going to be distraction. TV, film, novel. I suppose novel is the "best" option but I don't think it really matters.

You're still associating writing and 'working through some thoughts' with LP, which is completely nonsensical. You can write in a personal diary and do much of the same, except better. You can write on a forum dedicated to working through issues similar to your own, rather than a gambling forum, where you'd get feedback from interested users who don't look at you like a freak show attraction. The environment you choose to write in is disconfirming. You're just doing it out of habit and rationalizing that it serves a mighty fine purpose while ignoring all the other better possibilities. You still have an attachment to this site, as if things could go back to the way they used to be.

What you do in your free time is all that really matters since it's the only thing that you have control over as soon as you acknowledge you're stuck in a job you don't like because you need the money. You can delude yourself into thinking that it doesn't, but that's not going to serve you very well. You're already a food cutter throughout the day, don't be a cookie cutter at night. Determine that you want to have a mind worth having, a self worth wanting, and cultivate some virtues that you are lacking. They might serve you well down the road for a job, or they might not. The point is, they're worth having for their own sake, and there are no excuses for not cultivating them. Part of the problem is that your job can be mostly done on autopilot, and you're so used to it that you're conditioned to remain on autopilot for the rest of your day, and even on your days off. I think if you're rationalizing your need for distractions, it's partly because you don't want to do things that challenge your default autopilot setting because you believe it will make work more difficult. But even if that is the case, I would argue that it's better to suffer more in a meaningless job 20 to 30 hours a week than it is to suffer moderately from an overall poorly lived, meaning-starved existence.

How are you defining meaning?

What are some meaningful activities in your eyes?

Help the sick, educate the youth, create art are 3 pretty solid ones. I was talking to a friend the other day and he just rescued an 11 month old pitbull. I am sure he derives a lot of meaning from taking care of it and trying to get it on track but it is a bear of a project. The neighbors want it out. It is driving him nuts and he said this pitbull is now his life. He doesn't have time to go out with friends or go to meetings or anything like that. It is the same with my siblings with children. They basically take care of the child, go to work, take care of the child and maybe watch some netflix or hulu before bed. Now, is that meaning that powerful that they are fulfilled in their lives? I have never really had conversations with these people on whether they feel trapped but from the outside looking in it appears that their quality of life is suffering compared to earlier times.

The art avenue is a more interesting one. I have written songs before but I don't have a great voice and am not gifted in melodies. I am more of a poet than anything. I have all these painting supplies but no where to paint. I could get more creative with that. It is a fair point though. Last week I went out on a nature hike with a friend and took a bunch of photos and it was one of the best days I have had in a while. It is like that beautiful picture I took of that monarch butterfly has more magic than just me but I took the photo. I don't know if it is real or a trick but it does seem to add something to my life. I don't know if it is a narcissism thing. In our minds we think the work will live on for forever. Outlive us and never age. Continue to be beautiful for the ages. If an expression of ourselves can be beautiful and "immortal" we must be beautiful and "immortal." So, I am not sure if it is real but it works.

I didn't know I was a freak show attraction. I mean I thought I could be but I guess I did not care. I have thought before of switching forums but just feel a certain loyalty to this site. A personal diary is probably best. I will miss out on the occasional good suggestion or dialogue like we are having now. I am curious why you think a personal diary is better than LP?

I have never understood how to just pick a virtue to cultivate. When I did the steps of AA looking at myself, looking at all my resentments and fears, talking about all of that with another person, and then taking a look at all of my character defects, and then making amends to people I have harmed and so on I would say that is the only way I know to cultivate virtues but it didn't really cultivate specific ones. I stopped lying, I became honest with people, stopped exaggerating, among a host of other things but it is not like I could pray and say "Dear God, please remove my complacency so I can better serve your will" and the complacency vanishes. I can't just go to a chalkboard and write "I will have higher standards" 100 times and have higher standards for my time. Through this dialogue I see I should have higher standards for my time. My natural state is to just attach to what is easy and somewhat pleasing. I don't think it is going to be a real easy thing to untangle. Even my job it is easier to just go in there for 16 or so hours a week how it is now and get closer to going broke before I really put in a strong push for new jobs. It is easier to stay at my parents' place. Sometimes I wonder if I even really want to move out.

So, I am a meaning-starved, freak show that is living my life poorly. I would say that is pretty accurate. I still think we disagree on what exactly meaning is and where to find it. Having children is checking the boxes on so much meaning yet people are generally unhappier afterwards. I don't think meaning always improves quality of life and quality of life can still leave someone feeling empty. What if the only thing I had to do with my time was help suffering alcoholics and that instantly adds meaning to my life and certainly feels better than just watching TV.

I'm defining meaning like something that makes you feel connected to something that matters (to you). It doesn't have to be some grand altruistic thing.

I will miss out on the occasional good suggestion or dialogue like we are having now.

I had a feeling you'd say that, but obviously, you can just announce wherever it is that you are writing now and people who are interested can follow you there. As it is, most people who read your blogs are uninterested and do so just out of a kind of morbid curiosity. It's a peep show. People like to see others struggling, it makes their own plight less severe. As for the personal diary, I think this is pretty self-evident. I just think everyone has their secrets and everyone behaves a certain way, or wears a certain mask, in public situations. But once you remove the public, it's a different experience. Like I said, you will unconsciously limit the things you say, or the amount of things you want to say, by writing it in public. The audience is always in the back of your mind. It's best to dispense of that if you are really intent on working through some things. That's all I have to say on that.

The people whose life is centered around their children: I think you already know the answer to that. It makes their lives meaningful, for certain, but the obvious downside is that it also makes their lives more frustrating and stressful. Meaning does not equate happiness. I've never implied that it does. It's just a pre-requisite for happiness. If you understand the traps that biological evolution has set for you, you can go on to find meaning that's more optimized towards personal satisfaction than the opposite. We were "designed" by natural selection to pursue things that would optimize gene survival and perpetuation, not personal satisfaction. The game of all games is to "beat the genes", in some sense. That's what I've discussed often in the past. You do that by cultivating yourself, otherwise you're owned by the default setting.

Unfortunately, this is mostly a dead site. Does anyone have some suggestions for other sites?

I have always been a forum person. Maybe it is a surrogate or a less valuable endeavor but there are discussions that arise and people that contribute that you don't necessarily find outside of the forums. Everything is nice and neatly written (not always the case).

Would my life be better off if I just cut out forums altogether? It is a possibility. Cutting out forums, TV, films may have a dramatically positive effect on my life but it would certainly "hurt" at the start. Sometimes I just want the beauty of a film. Sometimes I am just a bit too tired or not in the mood for the laborious nature of moving my eyes from left to right to comprehend a literary work of art. Oh well, I am striving for better and that is a good start.

I'm not suggesting you entirely quit forums. Just to try to find something that's a bit more confirming of where you are at and the things you would like to improve in your life. And to ideally balance it with private writing if writing is a particularly important outlet for you (which it seems to be).

TV and film have their places. Just make sure it's damn good TV and good films. The new Narcos season is out and I plan to watch it, I've learned a bunch about the whole Escobar story and drug trade in general by watching this show.

It was an astute observation that I go into autopilot at work. I caught myself completely zoned out a number of times. It is like I have to to deal with the mundanity of the work. I think I bring that home. Take off shoes, get a drink, figure out dinner, do whatever first comes to mind to drown out the mundanity of now being at home at 10pm with nothing to do. It is a vicious cycle. I just found out I am getting put back on the 2nd shift and I feel I really have to plan so this does not become my life. Part of that plan has to be to get my ass in gear on a job search and really figure this out.

I am out of SC for a while due to the hurricane. I am already dreading going back to food prep next week. I definitely need to find something else but something else that is not such dreadful autopilot. Working at Trader Joe's might be ok because you switch around the jobs each day. Stocking produce at Whole Foods actually sounds pretty horrible. Scooping ice cream for people all day is another autopilot job. Maybe most jobs are autopilot but I have to move past the really dreadful ones. I am weaning off posting on this site but I am still going to post on this site.

I don't know about the freak show stuff. Neilly was treated like a freak show; I think most people respond to Rik's blogs with sincere intentions. There's a certain amount of the "suicide/depression is for pussies" crowd once in a while, but it doesn't seem especially common.

That said I agree with Loco's general point about needing to find a healthier outlet than these forums.