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$2/5 Live annoying river spot,

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HungarianGOD   . Nov 22 2013 13:10. Posts 404

I don't think this is misplayed, but I'd like to think I could get away from it somehow.

Game was $2/$5 7-ring at the time. Villain is fishy, but I dono how fishy. Only played a few hands against him, typical live too loose preflop too passive.

Hero AdJd $700
Villain 450$

UTG, UTG +1, fold, UTG + 2 call, Villain calls, I raise on button to to $30, only Villain calls.

Flop $70:

TcTs8s

Villain checks, I check (so many people play dumb weak drawing hands out of position I didn't want to c-bet and build the pot when I had no idea what villain's range was)

Turn $70:

TcTs8sKd

Villain checks, I check

River $70:

TcTs8sKdQh

Villain leads out, for 65, I think for 15 seconds and raise to $165, Villain says "I've been running pretty bad today, I guess I'm allin" and shoves for an additional $260 more."

There's no possible way I can fold this right? When someone gives a speech like that do they always have the full-house?

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HungarianGOD   . Nov 22 2013 13:36. Posts 404

How can someone be so bad to check a board that wet out of position with a ten twice grrrrrr


traxamillion   United States. Nov 22 2013 15:08. Posts 10217

Might just flat river (not just being results oriented


traxamillion   United States. Nov 22 2013 15:13. Posts 10217

All he can really call a raise with is Maybe KQ. Non boat 10s raise sooner. He could easily slow play. He goes full pot pretty polarized right there already.

If he shows q10 he can be a little wider with this line and in that case raising Is probably best but when he 3bets ai u should prob muck cause you are basically repping queens full and he still jams


casinocasino   Canada. Nov 22 2013 15:46. Posts 3249

your intention was to rr the fish and hope he calls because he is very unlikely to be b3b the river with a bluff.. so its a pretty easy fold and if your not confident with that read you should just call his river lead


goose58   United States. Nov 22 2013 15:56. Posts 868

River is a clear raise, now fold with your current reads. You say he's passive, which means he's unlikely to go full retard on this river with a bluff, J9/AJ or a naked T.

With that said, I think you could Cbet this flop or bet this turn(get value from draws, maybe fold an 8 or weaker PP).

Also, in my experience, when weaker players start chatting they typically have a good hand(although my live experience is small).


carlosdiaz   Mexico. Nov 23 2013 02:21. Posts 139

I bet that turn almost always, as played I fold the river.


mnj   United States. Nov 23 2013 02:33. Posts 3848


  On November 22 2013 12:10 HungarianGOD wrote:
There's no possible way I can fold this right? When someone gives a speech like that do they always have the full-house?



yes


gawdawaful   Canada. Nov 23 2013 14:16. Posts 8796

I see live fish time and time again overplay what they perceive to be nuts, which can be anything from a naked T to J9 here. We're not always beat even with the line he took (as well as the line we took)
Also people play really transparent and poorly live that you can cbet anywhere from 25-35 and either choose to check back turn or barrel a good turn (ie. anything higher than a jack or an 8)

Im only good at poker when I run good 

DustySwedeDude   Sweden. Nov 23 2013 19:18. Posts 8623

I like betting turn a fair bit. Otherwise I'm with gawdawaful.


JohnnyBologna   United States. Nov 24 2013 01:53. Posts 1384

should ask him to take his bet back and chop.

By doing a little bit at a time, a lot can be done 

collegesucks   United States. Nov 24 2013 15:59. Posts 5779


  On November 23 2013 13:16 gawdawaful wrote:
I see live fish time and time again overplay what they perceive to be nuts, which can be anything from a naked T to J9 here. We're not always beat even with the line he took (as well as the line we took)
Also people play really transparent and poorly live that you can cbet anywhere from 25-35 and either choose to check back turn or barrel a good turn (ie. anything higher than a jack or an 8)



This. While villain is 100% not bluffing, he could easily be overvaluing his non-boat hands.

Here's an extremely pessimistic range which basically removes all Tx combos. 2:1 to make a call and you're priced at almost 3:1

Board: Tc Ts 8s Kd Qh
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 33.673% 24.49% 09.18% 12 4.50 { AdJd }
Hand 1: 66.327% 57.14% 09.18% 28 4.50 { KK-QQ, TT, 88, AJs, KTs, QTs, J9s, T8s, AJo, KTo, QTo, J9o, T8o }

Without a concrete read, which you DONT have, I don't see you being right to fold here.

OoV 

collegesucks   United States. Nov 24 2013 16:00. Posts 5779

also, +1 on betting turn to continue on a lot of rivers, if you haven't cbet this flop.

OoV 

JohnnyBologna   United States. Nov 25 2013 17:42. Posts 1384

results?

By doing a little bit at a time, a lot can be done 

scriber   . Nov 29 2013 10:35. Posts 298

bet turn , fold river. With the speach he has a fullhouse here almost always , so fold


Rapoza   Brasil. Nov 29 2013 19:37. Posts 1611

raise/fold river makes 0 sense, just jam instead.

Pouncer Style 4 the win 

LikeASet   United States. Nov 30 2013 23:31. Posts 2088

if villain is fishy and passive just c bet flop, you want to fold out all his air type hands which he will have super often and just fold, no need to check and let him catch up.

based on my experience, honestly I'm raising river also and calling that shove, especially with the way you guys got to the river, you really don't look like you can have KK, QQ, 88, 10x at all the way you played this hand to even the most leisure player.


GoTuNk   Chile. Dec 02 2013 01:12. Posts 2749

I think this an easy fold, but a hard one to do at the moment

I think you guys are overcomplicating this? I think we need evidence to assume he is capable of doing this kind of spazz shove above the simple explanation he has a nutted hand (i.e. we need extra evidence to bluff catch him, not extra evidence to fold our hand)


Endo   United States. Dec 02 2013 23:41. Posts 883


  On December 02 2013 00:12 GoTuNk wrote:
I think this an easy fold, but a hard one to do at the moment

I think you guys are overcomplicating this? I think we need evidence to assume he is capable of doing this kind of spazz shove above the simple explanation he has a nutted hand (i.e. we need extra evidence to bluff catch him, not extra evidence to fold our hand)



Nuts 75% of the time


el_tilon   Canada. Dec 04 2013 11:46. Posts 296

Bet turn because you can easily fire a bunch of rivers.

As played call down and take notes.

THE TILTMONKEY MASTER 

 
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