TableNinja Moneygrab!

So i got this email today.





LOL at the subscription model.

Im pretty sure that it said TableNinja came with lifetime support when i bought it.

Good thing PS has almost all the functions i use integrated into their software already, so a simple AHK will do when TN dies.

Oh well, fuck them, going to swich from HM too when they decide to implement the monthly subscription too.

oh well, its fair and not really expensive

On May 16 2013 14:47 player999 wrote: oh well, its fair and not really expensive

Im not saying its expensive, im saying that i bought a product that was supposed to have lifetime support for upgrades and it apparantly isnt going to be so, so fuck them on principle.

its obv not working and even missing tn1 functions, fml

^^ prob smart to wait as long as possible before switching

On May 16 2013 14:52 HaiVan wrote: Show nested quote + On May 16 2013 14:47 player999 wrote: oh well, its fair and not really expensive Im not saying its expensive, im saying that i bought a product that was supposed to have lifetime support for upgrades and it apparantly isnt going to be so, so fuck them on principle.

that was clearly not sustainable, its not like HM/PT that can work forever without updates, this thing needs updates after every PS update

On May 16 2013 15:09 player999 wrote: Show nested quote + On May 16 2013 14:52 HaiVan wrote:   On May 16 2013 14:47 player999 wrote: oh well, its fair and not really expensive Im not saying its expensive, im saying that i bought a product that was supposed to have lifetime support for upgrades and it apparantly isnt going to be so, so fuck them on principle. that was clearly not sustainable, its not like HM/PT that can work forever without updates, this thing needs updates after every PS update

II don't give a flying fuck what's sustainable. Haivan is right, the *first* time I bought TN, it was supposed to be good for life. THEN I had to 're-new' my tableninja roughly a year or so ago where it said it was 'for life' this time. Really wish I kept a copy of the terms and conditions the first two times I bought this program.

So ya, fuck these guys.

On May 16 2013 15:09 player999 wrote: Show nested quote + On May 16 2013 14:52 HaiVan wrote:   On May 16 2013 14:47 player999 wrote: oh well, its fair and not really expensive Im not saying its expensive, im saying that i bought a product that was supposed to have lifetime support for upgrades and it apparantly isnt going to be so, so fuck them on principle. that was clearly not sustainable, its not like HM/PT that can work forever without updates, this thing needs updates after every PS update

lol r u high?
after many updates in pokerrooms software something doesnt work with HM2 and they need to fix it every time

table ninja always tilted the fuck out of me

scam.....

On May 16 2013 16:35 MadeInPolanD wrote: Show nested quote + On May 16 2013 15:09 player999 wrote:   On May 16 2013 14:52 HaiVan wrote:   On May 16 2013 14:47 player999 wrote: oh well, its fair and not really expensive Im not saying its expensive, im saying that i bought a product that was supposed to have lifetime support for upgrades and it apparantly isnt going to be so, so fuck them on principle. that was clearly not sustainable, its not like HM/PT that can work forever without updates, this thing needs updates after every PS update lol r u high? after many updates in pokerrooms software something doesnt work with HM2 and they need to fix it every time

True but the changes are usually much easier than what needs to be done for something like TN. That said, I think this TN2 thing is a debacle that will almost certainly be back-peddled to something less outrageous

lucky i dont multitable anymore or this is a huge expense. 150$ a month x 12 = 1800$. i can live without it. 4 tabling zoom for the win.

Found my email from them when i purchased the product


_______________________________________________________________


Thank you for Purchasing TableNinja with Lifetime Free Updates!
Please save or print this email for your records

Here is your purchase code:

--------- cut/copy between these lines ---------
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
--------- cut/copy between these lines ---------

To unlock your product:
1. Highlight and copy the purchase code above. (Press ctrl-c or right-click and choose 'Copy')
2. Open TableNinja.
3. In the top menu bar, click 'Help' and choose 'Purchase/Update'.
4. Paste the purchase code into the Purchase/Update box. (Press ctrl-v or right-click and choose 'Paste')
5. Click the button labeled 'Try Purchase Code'.

If you have any problems, please visit http://tnforums.tableninja.com/forumdisplay.php?f=1

__________________________________________________________________________




Note the first sentence in the email: "Thank you for Purchasing TableNinja with Lifetime Free Updates!"


Silly fucks

On May 16 2013 17:17 lostaccount wrote: lucky i dont multitable anymore or this is a huge expense. 150$ a month x 12 = 1800$. i can live without it. 4 tabling zoom for the win.

bro it's $150 per year

On May 16 2013 18:51 Highcard wrote: Show nested quote + On May 16 2013 17:17 lostaccount wrote: lucky i dont multitable anymore or this is a huge expense. 150$ a month x 12 = 1800$. i can live without it. 4 tabling zoom for the win. bro it's $150 per year

Lol opps my mistake

On May 16 2013 16:35 MadeInPolanD wrote: Show nested quote + On May 16 2013 15:09 player999 wrote:   On May 16 2013 14:52 HaiVan wrote:   On May 16 2013 14:47 player999 wrote: oh well, its fair and not really expensive Im not saying its expensive, im saying that i bought a product that was supposed to have lifetime support for upgrades and it apparantly isnt going to be so, so fuck them on principle. that was clearly not sustainable, its not like HM/PT that can work forever without updates, this thing needs updates after every PS update lol r u high? after many updates in pokerrooms software something doesnt work with HM2 and they need to fix it every time

I'm sorry for you

I use PT3 and I haven't updated for >1year

On May 16 2013 17:20 HaiVan wrote: Note the first sentence in the email: "Thank you for Purchasing TableNinja with Lifetime Free Updates!" Silly fucks

You have lifetime updates for TableNinja you dumb piece of shit. This new product is called TableNinja II, as in 2, as in FUCKING TWO. It's a goddamn sequel. It offers new features and is meant to support the next generation of poker software. You will still receive free updates for TableNinja one, if and when they are released. It's like a lifetime warranty on your LG TV. Does that mean you get every fucking new TV that they design for all eternity? No, it means you get free support on the existing one that you bought at that time asshole.

On May 16 2013 21:50 NewbSaibot wrote: Show nested quote + On May 16 2013 17:20 HaiVan wrote: Note the first sentence in the email: "Thank you for Purchasing TableNinja with Lifetime Free Updates!" Silly fucks You have lifetime updates for TableNinja you dumb piece of shit. This new product is called TableNinja II, as in 2, as in FUCKING TWO. It's a goddamn sequel. It offers new features and is meant to support the next generation of poker software. You will still receive free updates for TableNinja one, if and when they are released. It's like a lifetime warranty on your LG TV. Does that mean you get every fucking new TV that they design for all eternity? No, it means you get free support on the existing one that you bought at that time asshole.

Wow you are really thick. They are ending support for TN1 on august 15th 2013. After that TN1 will no longer be functional you stupid fucking cunt.

i think he is referring to that fact that they said they wont be updating after august 15 anymore

edit - you ninja

is table ninja that useful? ive never used it or considered it, maybe i should have all these years

On May 16 2013 22:04 Daut wrote: is table ninja that useful? ive never used it or considered it, maybe i should have all these years

yes, can't play without

On May 16 2013 21:55 HaiVan wrote: Show nested quote + On May 16 2013 21:50 NewbSaibot wrote:   On May 16 2013 17:20 HaiVan wrote: Note the first sentence in the email: "Thank you for Purchasing TableNinja with Lifetime Free Updates!" Silly fucks You have lifetime updates for TableNinja you dumb piece of shit. This new product is called TableNinja II, as in 2, as in FUCKING TWO. It's a goddamn sequel. It offers new features and is meant to support the next generation of poker software. You will still receive free updates for TableNinja one, if and when they are released. It's like a lifetime warranty on your LG TV. Does that mean you get every fucking new TV that they design for all eternity? No, it means you get free support on the existing one that you bought at that time asshole. Wow you are really thick. They are ending support for TN1 on august 15th 2013. After that TN1 will no longer be functional you stupid fucking cunt.

They said they provide lifetime free updates, not free support. There is nothing that says if/when they have to update. They should not have even mentioned "ending support" since they could have just silently let it die. But anyway you're a fucking idiot if you think any software company can just endlessly keep a product updated forever from a single purchase made years ago. I bet you'd whine just as hard if TableNinja went out of business "zomg they promised me updates, it's the year 2022 and I still have table ninja installed!".

HEM and PT had to do the same thing. They provided a SHIT TON of free updates, basically every 3-5 days or as often as poker sites release their own updates. Eventually you have to reach a point where your updates are practically becoming a whole new product unto themselves.

newbsaibot thats pretty aggro bro

tableninja is ok

tablescanner and all those programs should be banned

I recently found out that datamining on stars is still common practice wtf

LOL at these consumer entitlement tilt monkeys

this is a snap purchase for me

entitlement? Wow. When I purchase something for LIFE and do it again a couple years later... then find out it's a big fucking lie, I guess I should smile and smoke a joint, right?

I'll buy it, but I'm not happy with the ethics of these assholes.

It's not a matter of the money, it's the principle. so ya, LOL at you people who think a contract means fuck-all.

there many antivirus/computer security/w/e companies who promised lifetime updates and went out of business or were forced to call for yearly fees

The problem is simply where you draw the line for your product. I mean it is kinda silly to advertise lifetime anything since obviously you are doing to die one day, the world will end, and the universe will collapse. It kind of a marketing gimmick to just make your product seem extra glitzy. But at the same time what should "lifetime support" for table ninja mean? That they'll just keep updating it for the next 10 years to include compatibility but no new features?

So what happens when we're all using weird tablet operating system hybrids on our holocube desktops, is a program written during the Windows XP era supposed to continue to work on OS's that it was never designed for in the first place?

What exactly do you want?

On May 17 2013 11:30 NewbSaibot wrote: What exactly do you want?

Lifetime free updates for the individual product that they purchased.

I hope you can understand that there is a problem when then they offer lifetime free updates, and then later say they don't guarantee that product will work after a certain date and actually advise against using it.

I thought it was pretty standard for "lifetime" to mean the reasonable life of the product.

If however they did entirely mean for all eternity then it's reasonable for a consumer to expect as such. It's irrelevant if it's a reasonable expectation or not, the company made a commitment. If they break that commitment then it's entirely rational to assume that some customers will feel betrayed and sales will suffer as a result.

On May 16 2013 21:50 NewbSaibot wrote: Show nested quote + On May 16 2013 17:20 HaiVan wrote: Note the first sentence in the email: "Thank you for Purchasing TableNinja with Lifetime Free Updates!" Silly fucks You have lifetime updates for TableNinja you dumb piece of shit. This new product is called TableNinja II, as in 2, as in FUCKING TWO. It's a goddamn sequel. It offers new features and is meant to support the next generation of poker software. You will still receive free updates for TableNinja one, if and when they are released. It's like a lifetime warranty on your LG TV. Does that mean you get every fucking new TV that they design for all eternity? No, it means you get free support on the existing one that you bought at that time asshole.

you seem like a terrible human being

On May 17 2013 13:50 Daut wrote: Show nested quote + On May 16 2013 21:50 NewbSaibot wrote:   On May 16 2013 17:20 HaiVan wrote: Note the first sentence in the email: "Thank you for Purchasing TableNinja with Lifetime Free Updates!" Silly fucks You have lifetime updates for TableNinja you dumb piece of shit. This new product is called TableNinja II, as in 2, as in FUCKING TWO. It's a goddamn sequel. It offers new features and is meant to support the next generation of poker software. You will still receive free updates for TableNinja one, if and when they are released. It's like a lifetime warranty on your LG TV. Does that mean you get every fucking new TV that they design for all eternity? No, it means you get free support on the existing one that you bought at that time asshole. you seem like a terrible human being

Dude that was deep, how's the wife n' kids?

Look, here's the thing



Lets say you buy a new hammer with a "lifetime warranty", but then the industry changes and instead of nails everything moves to staples. Is it fair for the hammer manufacturer to have to create a new hammer for this new kind of hardware? TableNinja works, there is no defect, no bug, nothing wrong with its design. It's the *industry* that changed. PokerStars and all the other sites changed *their* software and thus *made* TableNinja incompatible. This is not TN's fault. This is not the result of a faulty product that requires their support to fix, because it never broke.

If the poker sites out there never updated their software then you would have a valid complaint when TN started exhibiting problems. Think of it like this, TN has lifetime support for PokerStars ver. 1.036. Pokerstars recently updated to 1.037. It's a new product, thus no support.

On May 17 2013 15:05 NewbSaibot wrote: Show nested quote + On May 17 2013 13:50 Daut wrote:   On May 16 2013 21:50 NewbSaibot wrote:   On May 16 2013 17:20 HaiVan wrote: Note the first sentence in the email: "Thank you for Purchasing TableNinja with Lifetime Free Updates!" Silly fucks You have lifetime updates for TableNinja you dumb piece of shit. This new product is called TableNinja II, as in 2, as in FUCKING TWO. It's a goddamn sequel. It offers new features and is meant to support the next generation of poker software. You will still receive free updates for TableNinja one, if and when they are released. It's like a lifetime warranty on your LG TV. Does that mean you get every fucking new TV that they design for all eternity? No, it means you get free support on the existing one that you bought at that time asshole. you seem like a terrible human being Dude that was deep, how's the wife n' kids? Look, here's the thing Lets say you buy a new hammer with a "lifetime warranty", but then the industry changes and instead of nails everything moves to staples. Is it fair for the hammer manufacturer to have to create a new hammer for this new kind of hardware? TableNinja works, there is no defect, no bug, nothing wrong with its design. It's the *industry* that changed. PokerStars and all the other sites changed *their* software and thus *made* TableNinja incompatible. This is not TN's fault. This is not the result of a faulty product that requires their support to fix, because it never broke. If the poker sites out there never updated their software then you would have a valid complaint when TN started exhibiting problems. Think of it like this, TN has lifetime support for PokerStars ver. 1.036. Pokerstars recently updated to 1.037. It's a new product, thus no support.

im not disputing your point. dont really have an opinion one way or the other on it. just dont like how you got all belligerent unprovoked

Who cares. tableninja has become obsolete anyway it is probably usefull for people playing stars, FTP and party at the same time but that is it.

and lol at the ''standard'' and ''pro'' difference. 8 table max. why would anyone use tableninja if they are only 8-tableing.

On May 17 2013 15:20 Daut wrote: Show nested quote + On May 17 2013 15:05 NewbSaibot wrote:   On May 17 2013 13:50 Daut wrote:   On May 16 2013 21:50 NewbSaibot wrote:   On May 16 2013 17:20 HaiVan wrote: Note the first sentence in the email: "Thank you for Purchasing TableNinja with Lifetime Free Updates!" Silly fucks You have lifetime updates for TableNinja you dumb piece of shit. This new product is called TableNinja II, as in 2, as in FUCKING TWO. It's a goddamn sequel. It offers new features and is meant to support the next generation of poker software. You will still receive free updates for TableNinja one, if and when they are released. It's like a lifetime warranty on your LG TV. Does that mean you get every fucking new TV that they design for all eternity? No, it means you get free support on the existing one that you bought at that time asshole. you seem like a terrible human being Dude that was deep, how's the wife n' kids? Look, here's the thing Lets say you buy a new hammer with a "lifetime warranty", but then the industry changes and instead of nails everything moves to staples. Is it fair for the hammer manufacturer to have to create a new hammer for this new kind of hardware? TableNinja works, there is no defect, no bug, nothing wrong with its design. It's the *industry* that changed. PokerStars and all the other sites changed *their* software and thus *made* TableNinja incompatible. This is not TN's fault. This is not the result of a faulty product that requires their support to fix, because it never broke. If the poker sites out there never updated their software then you would have a valid complaint when TN started exhibiting problems. Think of it like this, TN has lifetime support for PokerStars ver. 1.036. Pokerstars recently updated to 1.037. It's a new product, thus no support. im not disputing your point. dont really have an opinion one way or the other on it. just dont like how you got all belligerent unprovoked

Yeah I dunno, just somethin about the way the OP was trying to paint TN, calling it a moneygrab and "fuck them" for not running their business into the ground. I liked TN, I remember when it first came out, and it's cool developers like that and the guy behind HEM and PT and so forth managed to create this huge successful product all by themselves initially. Then someone like OP comes along and just ruins it all.

On May 17 2013 17:39 NewbSaibot wrote: Show nested quote + On May 17 2013 15:20 Daut wrote:   On May 17 2013 15:05 NewbSaibot wrote:   On May 17 2013 13:50 Daut wrote:   On May 16 2013 21:50 NewbSaibot wrote:   On May 16 2013 17:20 HaiVan wrote: Note the first sentence in the email: "Thank you for Purchasing TableNinja with Lifetime Free Updates!" Silly fucks You have lifetime updates for TableNinja you dumb piece of shit. This new product is called TableNinja II, as in 2, as in FUCKING TWO. It's a goddamn sequel. It offers new features and is meant to support the next generation of poker software. You will still receive free updates for TableNinja one, if and when they are released. It's like a lifetime warranty on your LG TV. Does that mean you get every fucking new TV that they design for all eternity? No, it means you get free support on the existing one that you bought at that time asshole. you seem like a terrible human being Dude that was deep, how's the wife n' kids? Look, here's the thing Lets say you buy a new hammer with a "lifetime warranty", but then the industry changes and instead of nails everything moves to staples. Is it fair for the hammer manufacturer to have to create a new hammer for this new kind of hardware? TableNinja works, there is no defect, no bug, nothing wrong with its design. It's the *industry* that changed. PokerStars and all the other sites changed *their* software and thus *made* TableNinja incompatible. This is not TN's fault. This is not the result of a faulty product that requires their support to fix, because it never broke. If the poker sites out there never updated their software then you would have a valid complaint when TN started exhibiting problems. Think of it like this, TN has lifetime support for PokerStars ver. 1.036. Pokerstars recently updated to 1.037. It's a new product, thus no support. im not disputing your point. dont really have an opinion one way or the other on it. just dont like how you got all belligerent unprovoked Yeah I dunno, just somethin about the way the OP was trying to paint TN, calling it a moneygrab and "fuck them" for not running their business into the ground. I liked TN, I remember when it first came out, and it's cool developers like that and the guy behind HEM and PT and so forth managed to create this huge successful product all by themselves initially. Then someone like OP comes along and just ruins it all.

So essentially - you don't give a flying shit what was promised.. not once, but twice? Via a contractual obligation? Simply because you like the product?

That sounds legit.

Negatron, i dont consider them in breach since the product never failed to support the version of those poker sites at that time. But those poker sites are no longer the same, they have added new features, new UI's, and new game modes. In my opinion it is the poker sites who are at fault, not TN. So the developers of TN designed a new product for the next generation of poker sites. If those poker sites continued to run their older version of their networks then I would expect TN to work on them.

tn so uselessand and now they charge more money haha

So you actually thought you were going to get updates till the day you die?

On May 18 2013 02:49 gymnast wrote: So you actually thought you were going to get updates till the day you die?

Comments like this are the reason why threads die. Grats holmes.

As I've stated before - I WILL pay for this new thing. However. The producers LIED. Repeatedly. Anyone who can fucking understand English can understand that. I guess I'm just part of a dying breed - one who expects to get what I pay for. Anyways - Everything has been stated, re-stated, and triply so. So whatever.

Fuckers lied. They literally broke their own legality rules. Sustainability? Or accountability? If I had a law degree (in the contractual field) and tons of time on my hand, I would smash the fuck out of these guys. Sadly - I only have one of the two.

Cheers guys.

hi guys! wassup with this new tableninja?

On May 18 2013 08:40 devon06atX wrote: Show nested quote + On May 18 2013 02:49 gymnast wrote: So you actually thought you were going to get updates till the day you die? Comments like this are the reason why threads die. Grats holmes. As I've stated before - I WILL pay for this new thing. However. The producers LIED. Repeatedly. Anyone who can fucking understand English can understand that. I guess I'm just part of a dying breed - one who expects to get what I pay for. Anyways - Everything has been stated, re-stated, and triply so. So whatever. Fuckers lied. They literally broke their own legality rules. Sustainability? Or accountability? If I had a law degree (in the contractual field) and tons of time on my hand, I would smash the fuck out of these guys. Sadly - I only have one of the two. Cheers guys.

How did they lie? What support did they offer and for what product did they offer it for?

On May 18 2013 12:21 NewbSaibot wrote: Show nested quote + On May 18 2013 08:40 devon06atX wrote:   On May 18 2013 02:49 gymnast wrote: So you actually thought you were going to get updates till the day you die? Comments like this are the reason why threads die. Grats holmes. As I've stated before - I WILL pay for this new thing. However. The producers LIED. Repeatedly. Anyone who can fucking understand English can understand that. I guess I'm just part of a dying breed - one who expects to get what I pay for. Anyways - Everything has been stated, re-stated, and triply so. So whatever. Fuckers lied. They literally broke their own legality rules. Sustainability? Or accountability? If I had a law degree (in the contractual field) and tons of time on my hand, I would smash the fuck out of these guys. Sadly - I only have one of the two. Cheers guys. How did they lie? What support did they offer and for what product did they offer it for?

On May 16 2013 17:20 HaiVan wrote: Found my email from them when i purchased the product _______________________________________________________________ Thank you for Purchasing TableNinja with Lifetime Free Updates! Please save or print this email for your records Here is your purchase code: --------- cut/copy between these lines --------- XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX --------- cut/copy between these lines --------- To unlock your product: 1. Highlight and copy the purchase code above. (Press ctrl-c or right-click and choose 'Copy') 2. Open TableNinja. 3. In the top menu bar, click 'Help' and choose 'Purchase/Update'. 4. Paste the purchase code into the Purchase/Update box. (Press ctrl-v or right-click and choose 'Paste') 5. Click the button labeled 'Try Purchase Code'. If you have any problems, please visit http://tnforums.tableninja.com/forumdisplay.php?f=1 __________________________________________________________________________ Note the first sentence in the email: "Thank you for Purchasing TableNinja with Lifetime Free Updates!" Silly fucks

Anyways - I'm all ranted out. It just bugs me that more people don't realise how unethical this is. Clearly, people will pay for it - that's why the producers know they can get away with it. I said my piece (probably more than three times lol), and now I'm going to the beer store. Cheers to you all, you included Saibot.

So if PokerStars shifts their business from desktop poker clients and starts developing exclusively for Android/iOS does that mean TN is still obligated to support it?

On May 18 2013 13:03 devon06atX wrote: Show nested quote + On May 18 2013 12:21 NewbSaibot wrote:   On May 18 2013 08:40 devon06atX wrote:   On May 18 2013 02:49 gymnast wrote: So you actually thought you were going to get updates till the day you die? Comments like this are the reason why threads die. Grats holmes. As I've stated before - I WILL pay for this new thing. However. The producers LIED. Repeatedly. Anyone who can fucking understand English can understand that. I guess I'm just part of a dying breed - one who expects to get what I pay for. Anyways - Everything has been stated, re-stated, and triply so. So whatever. Fuckers lied. They literally broke their own legality rules. Sustainability? Or accountability? If I had a law degree (in the contractual field) and tons of time on my hand, I would smash the fuck out of these guys. Sadly - I only have one of the two. Cheers guys. How did they lie? What support did they offer and for what product did they offer it for?   On May 16 2013 17:20 HaiVan wrote: Found my email from them when i purchased the product _______________________________________________________________ Thank you for Purchasing TableNinja with Lifetime Free Updates! Please save or print this email for your records Here is your purchase code: --------- cut/copy between these lines --------- XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX --------- cut/copy between these lines --------- To unlock your product: 1. Highlight and copy the purchase code above. (Press ctrl-c or right-click and choose 'Copy') 2. Open TableNinja. 3. In the top menu bar, click 'Help' and choose 'Purchase/Update'. 4. Paste the purchase code into the Purchase/Update box. (Press ctrl-v or right-click and choose 'Paste') 5. Click the button labeled 'Try Purchase Code'. If you have any problems, please visit http://tnforums.tableninja.com/forumdisplay.php?f=1 __________________________________________________________________________ Note the first sentence in the email: "Thank you for Purchasing TableNinja with Lifetime Free Updates!" Silly fucks Anyways - I'm all ranted out. It just bugs me that more people don't realise how unethical this is. Clearly, people will pay for it - that's why the producers know they can get away with it. I said my piece (probably more than three times lol), and now I'm going to the beer store. Cheers to you all, you included Saibot.

hey man, i realize how unethical this is. I know that feel bro. i know that feel

On May 18 2013 02:49 gymnast wrote: So you actually thought you were going to get updates till the day you die?

Not sure about devon06atX , but personally i didn't.

I've had the realization since i was about 8 years old that advertisements can be very cunning, when i went to mcdonalds one day and found that the burger was not at all what it looked like on the television, stacked up really closed to the television screen and a high angle shot looking upwards at that fresh and juicy lettuce.

It doesn't mean it's not unethical though, you simply have to ask if it is ok to bullshit people, does it improve society as a whole? Does it harm the individual that is getting bullshitted? Questions like that are good ones to begin with. I would argue that it's wrong to bullshit people, because it gives them false expectations, and people make irrational decisions because of that. It is better to give people the truth so they can make rational decisions.

On May 19 2013 02:37 Stroggoz wrote: Show nested quote + On May 18 2013 02:49 gymnast wrote: So you actually thought you were going to get updates till the day you die? Not sure about devon06atX , but personally i didn't. I've had the realization since i was about 8 years old that advertisements can be very cunning, when i went to mcdonalds one day and found that the burger was not at all what it looked like on the television, stacked up really closed to the television screen and a high angle shot looking upwards at that fresh and juicy lettuce. It doesn't mean it's not unethical though, you simply have to ask if it is ok to bullshit people, does it improve society as a whole? Does it harm the individual that is getting bullshitted? Questions like that are good ones to begin with. I would argue that it's wrong to bullshit people, because it gives them false expectations, and people make irrational decisions because of that. It is better to give people the truth so they can make rational decisions.

Sorry to derail, but vast majority of decisions are not made rationally but emotionally.
I know from sales you never sell the raw features but rather the benefits and the way they impulse the emotion of the prospect. Ethical or not, people are "dumb" and not really rational, that's why adverts have to create an emotional rather than rational response from the prospects and there is a fine line between impulsing people by highlighting benefits and pretty much outward lying.


Besides, I guess the TN developers believed they can sustain constant updates and new people will keep buying but it just isn't viable

On May 19 2013 05:43 LemOn[5thF] wrote: Show nested quote + On May 19 2013 02:37 Stroggoz wrote:   On May 18 2013 02:49 gymnast wrote: So you actually thought you were going to get updates till the day you die? Not sure about devon06atX , but personally i didn't. I've had the realization since i was about 8 years old that advertisements can be very cunning, when i went to mcdonalds one day and found that the burger was not at all what it looked like on the television, stacked up really closed to the television screen and a high angle shot looking upwards at that fresh and juicy lettuce. It doesn't mean it's not unethical though, you simply have to ask if it is ok to bullshit people, does it improve society as a whole? Does it harm the individual that is getting bullshitted? Questions like that are good ones to begin with. I would argue that it's wrong to bullshit people, because it gives them false expectations, and people make irrational decisions because of that. It is better to give people the truth so they can make rational decisions. Sorry to derail, but vast majority of decisions are not made rationally but emotionally. I know from sales you never sell the raw features but rather the benefits and the way they impulse the emotion of the prospect. Ethical or not, people are "dumb" and not really rational, that's why adverts have to create an emotional rather than rational response from the prospects and there is a fine line between impulsing people by highlighting benefits and pretty much outward lying. Besides, I guess the TN developers believed they can sustain constant updates and new people will keep buying but it just isn't viable

weather it's an outright lie or a play on my emotions. They are both intending to make me stupid enough to make an irrational decision to buy the burger.

Anybody want a burger now? Like seriously

Anyway claiming they owe support on a new version of pokerstars is like saying some tool for Counter Strike owes you support when Counter Strike 2 comes out. It's a new game. Pokerstars updated their system, it's not the same software anymore. They dont owe shit for support on a product that has been upgraded to the point that it can be considered a sequel to earlier versions.

On May 17 2013 15:20 Daut wrote: Show nested quote + On May 17 2013 15:05 NewbSaibot wrote:   On May 17 2013 13:50 Daut wrote:   On May 16 2013 21:50 NewbSaibot wrote:   On May 16 2013 17:20 HaiVan wrote: Note the first sentence in the email: "Thank you for Purchasing TableNinja with Lifetime Free Updates!" Silly fucks You have lifetime updates for TableNinja you dumb piece of shit. This new product is called TableNinja II, as in 2, as in FUCKING TWO. It's a goddamn sequel. It offers new features and is meant to support the next generation of poker software. You will still receive free updates for TableNinja one, if and when they are released. It's like a lifetime warranty on your LG TV. Does that mean you get every fucking new TV that they design for all eternity? No, it means you get free support on the existing one that you bought at that time asshole. Poker Bonuses FullTiltPoker: free $10 no deposit Pokerstars: free $20 on deposit Pokerstars: $600 bonus Pokerstars: Sell tourney dollars you seem like a terrible human being Dude that was deep, how's the wife n' kids? Look, here's the thing Lets say you buy a new hammer with a "lifetime warranty", but then the industry changes and instead of nails everything moves to staples. Is it fair for the hammer manufacturer to have to create a new hammer for this new kind of hardware? TableNinja works, there is no defect, no bug, nothing wrong with its design. It's the *industry* that changed. PokerStars and all the other sites changed *their* software and thus *made* TableNinja incompatible. This is not TN's fault. This is not the result of a faulty product that requires their support to fix, because it never broke. If the poker sites out there never updated their software then you would have a valid complaint when TN started exhibiting problems. Think of it like this, TN has lifetime support for PokerStars ver. 1.036. Pokerstars recently updated to 1.037. It's a new product, thus no support. im not disputing your point. dont really have an opinion one way or the other on it. just dont like how you got all belligerent unprovoked

lol are you new on the forum Daut? he has been consistently one of the worst personalities on this forum for years

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On May 22 2013 07:11 Rapoza wrote: pretty sure by "lifetime" they meant the product's lifetime, not yours lol

You should get a job at an advertisement company

$20/month and $150/year is a LOT of money, like a LOT for us to be paying them...

I understand that they cannot support all the things they do with just one payment. Yet, their pricing seems very expensive for me. The initial pricing for TN1 was $40 for life, let's say its $40/year and that makes a $3.33 payment per month. That is 6 times less than what TN2 will cost. I don't think TN2 is 6 times better than TN1 to be honest.

I would be ok to pay $5/month but definitely won't be happy about it. Sure they have new features but the way they are handling their prices and even restrictions for TN Pro and Standard (8 tables for table ninja lol) are ridiculous. I won't be getting TN for the current prices. Hell no.

On May 21 2013 19:09 Baalim wrote: Show nested quote + On May 17 2013 15:20 Daut wrote:   On May 17 2013 15:05 NewbSaibot wrote:   On May 17 2013 13:50 Daut wrote:   On May 16 2013 21:50 NewbSaibot wrote:   On May 16 2013 17:20 HaiVan wrote: Note the first sentence in the email: "Thank you for Purchasing TableNinja with Lifetime Free Updates!" Silly fucks You have lifetime updates for TableNinja you dumb piece of shit. This new product is called TableNinja II, as in 2, as in FUCKING TWO. It's a goddamn sequel. It offers new features and is meant to support the next generation of poker software. You will still receive free updates for TableNinja one, if and when they are released. It's like a lifetime warranty on your LG TV. Does that mean you get every fucking new TV that they design for all eternity? No, it means you get free support on the existing one that you bought at that time asshole. Poker Bonuses FullTiltPoker: free $10 no deposit Pokerstars: free $20 on deposit Pokerstars: $600 bonus Pokerstars: Sell tourney dollars you seem like a terrible human being Dude that was deep, how's the wife n' kids? Look, here's the thing Lets say you buy a new hammer with a "lifetime warranty", but then the industry changes and instead of nails everything moves to staples. Is it fair for the hammer manufacturer to have to create a new hammer for this new kind of hardware? TableNinja works, there is no defect, no bug, nothing wrong with its design. It's the *industry* that changed. PokerStars and all the other sites changed *their* software and thus *made* TableNinja incompatible. This is not TN's fault. This is not the result of a faulty product that requires their support to fix, because it never broke. If the poker sites out there never updated their software then you would have a valid complaint when TN started exhibiting problems. Think of it like this, TN has lifetime support for PokerStars ver. 1.036. Pokerstars recently updated to 1.037. It's a new product, thus no support. im not disputing your point. dont really have an opinion one way or the other on it. just dont like how you got all belligerent unprovoked lol are you new on the forum Daut? he has been consistently one of the worst personalities on this forum for years

9/11 was not an inside job

I pirate table ninja anyway. Did buy it once but lost code and its so easy to pirate....

Oh and their making it monthy? Awsome should be good for 180 sng games that everyone 30-40 tables

Just play 4 tables you noobs lol

On May 16 2013 22:33 player999 wrote: Show nested quote + On May 16 2013 22:04 Daut wrote: is table ninja that useful? ive never used it or considered it, maybe i should have all these years yes, can't play without

Could you explain, if you don't mind?

Otherwise I'll have to get acquainted with what tableninja actually does