North Korea Has Gone Completely Insane

The fucking 29 year old retard who is running the backward shit-hole of a country full of "racist midgets" has gone COMPLETELY INSANE.

They just nullified the armistice from over 60 years ago. In other words they are now ALMOST officially at war with South Korea.

As much as I dislike war and it sucks for South Korea. This is one war I support. I want USA and the entire world to get in there and destroy the most backward regime on the planet. Kill all the corrupts at the top of the pyramid of power.

in b4 capaneo more insane than nk

Hope the war is swift and manageable

I fear how Russia / China will react to this if the situation escalades

Camp 22....

Water torture: The prisoner has to stand on his toes in a tank filled with water to his nose for 24 hours.[55]
Hanging torture: The prisoner is stripped and hung upside down from the ceiling to be violently beaten.[56]
Box-room-torture: The prisoner is detained in a very small solitary cell, where he could hardly sit, but not stand or lie, for three days or a week.[55]
Kneeling-torture: The prisoner has to kneel down with a wooden bar inserted near his knee hollows to stop blood circulation. After a week the prisoner cannot walk and many die some months later.[25]
Pigeon torture: The prisoner is tied to the wall with both hands at a height of 60 cm (2 ft) and must crouch for many hours.[57]

highly doubt there will be actual war

pretty sure NK knows it has no chance vs SK supported by the rest of the world

ive read it somewhere that NK doing all this to blackmail out some good peace trust, eg.: ok we back down if the UN or whoever gives us this and that in return

I was planning to play a few months in korea, but cancelled due to this kids posturing (or hes actually this crazy)

On March 11 2013 05:56 VanDerMeyde wrote: I fear how Russia / China will react to this if the situation escalates

They won't do shit, and they couldn't if they tried.

On March 11 2013 10:44 goose58 wrote: Show nested quote + On March 11 2013 05:56 VanDerMeyde wrote: I fear how Russia / China will react to this if the situation escalates They won't do shit, and they couldn't if they tried.

not sure if serious or trolling

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Stfu, Night LOOL.

On March 11 2013 11:14 2c0ntent wrote: Show nested quote + On March 11 2013 11:09 dUUd_ wrote:   On March 11 2013 10:44 goose58 wrote:   On March 11 2013 05:56 VanDerMeyde wrote: I fear how Russia / China will react to this if the situation escalates They won't do shit, and they couldn't if they tried. not sure if serious or trolling A lot of people will say this seriously because the current order of the world's economy is wholly dependent on the US Dollar retaining its position as a store of value (see: every developed country's central bank's dollar reserves) Also China's economy is enormously dependent on America's continued patronage of their output. The whole modern form of the country has been and is still built on dollars. Recall that America also has many allies (see: S.K., the entire EU, Japan) who together with America represent the vast majority of China's customer base, and who would likely cut off trade with whoever America went to war with as a further economic blow.

not saying they would just previous poster's second part was like [ "i am all mighty american and these little countries (china and russia) can't do shit against us in war because we are so awesome and have like 3 nuclear weapons and superheros fighting for us" ]

might have misread that then my bad.

He's a nut, but the UN is also at fault for strong arming him, because that's the last thing you should do to a delusional nut who has nuclear weapons.

I'm hearing the UN claims the treaty isn't nullified.

I think NK, SK, PRC, and America are all working together. The Koreas will be uniting soon, while China will have to find a way to find someone to give them jobs as America will start using their 3-D printing and other technologies to replace the inefficient jobs overseas, maybe bring back whatever is left that is efficient to America, and we'll be able to start gaining dominance in exports like plastic and energy, which the energy part is thanks to the Panama Canal expansion, fracking, and other politics.

The fear campaign is for arms production/selling. The military-industrial complex is what the dollar is based on, and if you've got that thing revving it's engines, then you're good for that part of the economy. It could also be a stage to show off some of the new toys America has made, kind of like I believe that the Hamas/Israel rocketing drama is more of a show of the Israeli (American made) missile interceptors, which had something like 85% accuracy for the missiles it targets. (There were thousands of missiles that posed no threat, so they weren't targeted.)

Just some thoughts.

There is NOWAY in hell the koreas will become united without a war. NK leaders will stay until their last drop of blood. They are not rational actors. Have you guys read the shits the north Korea government say? They think they are on GodMode. Let's not forget that Saddam was saying he will destroy the Americas as they were inside Baghdad. Dictators are delussional. I'm also not afraid of NK nuclear threat. They might be able to test nukes. But it's a long way between doing that and putting that on a aircraft/missle and deliver it to south Korea. They can't do jackshit against the military of USA. Let alone the entire world combined.

I really wanna see Kim Jung and his entire family hanged for the stuff they have done to millions of people over decades.

On March 11 2013 14:13 capaneo wrote: There is NOWAY in hell the koreas will become united without a war. NK leaders will stay until their last drop of blood. They are not rational actors. Have you guys read the shits the north Korea government say? They think they are on GodMode. Let's not forget that Saddam was saying he will destroy the Americas as they were inside Baghdad. Dictators are delussional. I'm also not afraid of NK nuclear threat. They might be able to test nukes. But it's a long way between doing that and putting that on a aircraft/missle and deliver it to south Korea. They can't do jackshit against the military of USA. Let alone the entire world combined. I really wanna see Kim Jung and his entire family hanged for the stuff they have done to millions of people over decades.

You don't think they could detonate a nuke in SK if they decided it was in their best interest?

If they try to fight against the world they're gonna have a bad time, but they could seriously fuck SK, and I'm afraid it might come to that before the rest of the world intervenes.

I think his father and grandfather were in on the joke, but Kim Jong Un might actually believe he is a superhero.

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NK dissolved the armistice, who gives a shit? Just words on a piece of paper. NK pulls all these shenanigans not because they think the world will care, but because they think their own population will. They're just blustering so their own people dont start calling out their BS and trying to leave the country.

"North Korea has announced that it will no longer abide by the armistice at least 6 times, in the years 1994, 1996, 2003, 2006, 2009, and 2013." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_Armistice_Agreement

http://www.liquidpoker.net/poker-forum/1071312/North_Korea.html

On January 31 2013 14:40 PuertoRican wrote: There's always articles on how North Korea is pushing the envelope, and "this seems like it could be the tipping point and shit is gonna go down soon." When in reality, North Korea does shit to piss people off, and then they stop or step back just enough to not get attacked. Not too long ago, the USA sent them food in return of them stopping their missile testing or whatever. I think the North went back on their word after they got the food. Anyway, don't worry, cuz they wont do shit. Edit, I forgot to mention that the Western media blows shit out of proportion, especially USA. Most people in the Western world probably aren't aware that North Korea opens up its doors 2-3 times a year for the people in South Korea to come visit their family in the north.

On March 11 2013 16:09 [vital]Myth wrote: "North Korea has announced that it will no longer abide by the armistice at least 6 times, in the years 1994, 1996, 2003, 2006, 2009, and 2013." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_Armistice_Agreement

Yea about once a month I see something on the internet about NK posturing and cage rattling with posters thinking shit is about to get real. NK is the country who cried wolf, I no longer care about their BS.

somebody needs to find oil below NK asap, problem fixed.

it's just more NK posturing.

there is just way too much mutual incentive for everyone possibly involved to avoid conflict

also, from a cultural stand point north koreans still consider south koreans to be 'their people', and view them more as their lost cousins who have been hijacked and brainwashed by imperialists. NK realllly doesn't want to go killing south koreans or doing anything of the sort.

if unification did happen it would economically cripple S Korea and there would be a massive infrastructure problem to deal with

China and to a lesser extent Russia don't want to lose what effectively serves as a buffer for them from the ring of hostile (in their eyes) US/SK/Japan/ROC naval/military deployments surrounding them on the pacific.

blablabla the list goes on.

I would be very surprised if anything serious happened in NK. I would be less surprised if China took some kind of proxy control of NK than any other possible change in that region.

I am very aware of the NK and the shit they have done in the past. But this is under a new ruler. You also got the USA war machine winding down. Which is bad for biz and politicians. Add to that the recent Nuke testing and the military maneuvers. hopefully there will be a war and the world can illegitimately get rid of NK regime.

On March 11 2013 17:28 Baalim wrote: somebody needs to find oil below NK asap, problem fixed.

I heard Mexico has a lot of oil...

iirc they possibly sunk a submarine and attacked a SK military base last time they announced this. Maybe they will do something like that again.

On March 11 2013 17:28 Baalim wrote: somebody needs to find oil below NK asap, problem fixed.

Im guessing Russia would bring democracy to them for diamonds too

http://english.yonhapnews.co.kr/news/...3/0200000000AEN20130313000100315.HTML

N. Korea fielding mobile ICBM: U.S. intelligence chief

NK's ICBM could only reach California, assuming it didnt self-destruct. Plus the USA has anti-missile technology that would take it out anyway, since NK only has the capacity to build+fire like 1 missile per year lol. This isnt a threat to anything. NK leaders arent stupid. Look at how they live. You think those lavish lifestyles and mansions built themselves? Again, it's all posturing to prevent the kind of shit happening in Syria. They want to look strong and stable for themselves, not the world.

yeah, i think north korea would definitely not want to attack anyone apart from the odd bombardment and submarine sinking, their government just wants to continue repressing their own populace for their own gain. Their guns pointed at south korea, ect is a defence mechanism so no one can stop them from doing this.

http://select.nytimes.com/gst/abstrac...20C15FA3E5E167B93CAAB178AD85F4D8485F9


I don't know what to make of this. Is this real?

There was prediction of some skirmishes in certain irrelevant areas to feign readiness for war. Hopefully thats all it is because the USA has some aircraft carriers and shit nearby participating in war games. Would be kind of ludicrous to start shit at the worst possible time.

I wouldn't think that Kim would attack S. Korea, but I'm not ruling out completely. However, the link isn't dated, but it's still a viable link. Could it be from the actual start of the war all those decades ago?

North korea talks a ton of shit...nothing has happened thus far.

I think if NK will do something drastic then we'll probably see it coming imo. ie NK on verge of collapse etc.

1 thing to note...NK doesn't need nukes to completely decimate major cities within south korea...they have thousands of mid range missles for that and can level seoul in a day or something.

NK has almost no leverage when dealing with super powers or just any other country on the world stage. They are highly dependent on foreign aid and when that is threatened...what else can they do?

On March 11 2013 17:28 Baalim wrote: somebody needs to find oil below NK asap, problem fixed.

I loled but too many of my country men would die and it would be unacceptable levels of carnage ;(

Really hope South Korea will be ok...

http://www.nknews.org/2013/03/breakin...s-short-range-missiles-on-east-coast/

North Korea has tested short-range missiles in the Sea of Japan (known as the East Sea in Korea), in an apparent attempt to counter-act joint U.S.-South Korean military exercises, South Korean news agency Yonhap reported.

Nolan is smart!

On March 11 2013 11:24 dUUd_ wrote: Show nested quote + On March 11 2013 11:14 2c0ntent wrote:   On March 11 2013 11:09 dUUd_ wrote:   On March 11 2013 10:44 goose58 wrote:   On March 11 2013 05:56 VanDerMeyde wrote: I fear how Russia / China will react to this if the situation escalates They won't do shit, and they couldn't if they tried. not sure if serious or trolling A lot of people will say this seriously because the current order of the world's economy is wholly dependent on the US Dollar retaining its position as a store of value (see: every developed country's central bank's dollar reserves) Also China's economy is enormously dependent on America's continued patronage of their output. The whole modern form of the country has been and is still built on dollars. Recall that America also has many allies (see: S.K., the entire EU, Japan) who together with America represent the vast majority of China's customer base, and who would likely cut off trade with whoever America went to war with as a further economic blow. not saying they would just previous poster's second part was like [ "i am all mighty american and these little countries (china and russia) can't do shit against us in war because we are so awesome and have like 3 nuclear weapons and superheros fighting for us" ] might have misread that then my bad.

Nice strawman(s).

I shouldn't even have to explain this, and it has nothing to do with machoism:

-China is our business partner, and NK is their uncontrollable little brother who has it coming. NK is a leech on China.
-China is weaker than the USA by far, this is a fact. Every country in the world is weaker than the USA in regards to military power, this is undeniable.

You called me the troll..

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-21814416

A North Korean propaganda website has warned of strikes against Southern islands and advised residents to leave.

http://www.businessweek.com/ap/2013-0...highlighting-bomber-missions-in-korea

The United States is flying nuclear-capable B-52 bombers on training missions over South Korea to highlight Washington's commitment to defend an ally amid rising tensions with North Korea, Pentagon officials said Monday.

On March 16 2013 09:02 goose58 wrote: Show nested quote + On March 11 2013 11:24 dUUd_ wrote:   On March 11 2013 11:14 2c0ntent wrote:   On March 11 2013 11:09 dUUd_ wrote:   On March 11 2013 10:44 goose58 wrote:   On March 11 2013 05:56 VanDerMeyde wrote: I fear how Russia / China will react to this if the situation escalates They won't do shit, and they couldn't if they tried. not sure if serious or trolling A lot of people will say this seriously because the current order of the world's economy is wholly dependent on the US Dollar retaining its position as a store of value (see: every developed country's central bank's dollar reserves) Also China's economy is enormously dependent on America's continued patronage of their output. The whole modern form of the country has been and is still built on dollars. Recall that America also has many allies (see: S.K., the entire EU, Japan) who together with America represent the vast majority of China's customer base, and who would likely cut off trade with whoever America went to war with as a further economic blow. not saying they would just previous poster's second part was like [ "i am all mighty american and these little countries (china and russia) can't do shit against us in war because we are so awesome and have like 3 nuclear weapons and superheros fighting for us" ] might have misread that then my bad. Nice strawman(s). I shouldn't even have to explain this, and it has nothing to do with machoism: -China is our business partner, and NK is their uncontrollable little brother who has it coming. NK is a leech on China. -China is weaker than the USA by far, this is a fact. Every country in the world is weaker than the USA in regards to military power, this is undeniable. You called me the troll..

Many armies have grown to a point where it dosnt matter who is stronger, the devastation would be so big war is simply not an option, exactly like China and USA even if USA ultimately has more firepower that war would end the world as we know it.

I don't know if you guys have been keeping up...

http://live.reuters.com/Event/North_Korea

whats everyone talking about. i thought Rodman was a good choice for basketball coach

Some serious reports coming out... No attacks yet, but jets are in the air apparently on both sides.

I wouldn`t be so sure that US Army can keep up with North Korea so easily, You never fought against such army like NK, these are not muslims on camels, hiding in the mountains, or Vietkong army using guns that last Imperor left them. Last serious war was like WWII, do not forget that Allies had like 6 biggest back then countries fighting together for years, with 1 lunatic from Austra, and some crazy midgets from Japan, who thought that whole Pacific can be taken away. In NK these guys really believe what they are doing, gun power is massive, and they are trained almost like shaolin monks... just sayin, if NK will go to war, Vietnam and 1st round in Iraq was nothing compare to this, and you never know what Iran can do, China and Russia are not threat at all, but there are some other crazy folks that can use a bit of chaos

Not payed any attention to this, but got a question. If North Korea attacks the us, or something like that. Won't the rest of the world all chip in and attack North Korea?

On March 29 2013 08:09 suited_mess wrote: I wouldn`t be so sure that US Army can keep up with North Korea so easily, You never fought against such army like NK, these are not muslims on camels, hiding in the mountains, or Vietkong army using guns that last Imperor left them. Last serious war was like WWII, do not forget that Allies had like 6 biggest back then countries fighting together for years, with 1 lunatic from Austra, and some crazy midgets from Japan, who thought that whole Pacific can be taken away. In NK these guys really believe what they are doing, gun power is massive, and they are trained almost like shaolin monks... just sayin, if NK will go to war, Vietnam and 1st round in Iraq was nothing compare to this, and you never know what Iran can do, China and Russia are not threat at all, but there are some other crazy folks that can use a bit of chaos

Although they have the 4th largest army military, they're weaponry considering the size of the country's military isn't much. Also Id be interested to see how many north Koreans would defect given the chance, ww2 we were pretty much fighting China - and it seems like if nk attacks, even they will be left to consider military action IMO.

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" ww2 we were pretty much fighting China " ?what... there is a difference between China and Japan, China was stayin at their own territory only worried about Japan, since they were doing that, they were on your side pretty much, reading does not hurt

On March 29 2013 10:26 2c0ntent wrote: Show nested quote + On March 29 2013 09:43 Mariuslol wrote: Not payed any attention to this, but got a question. If North Korea attacks the us, or something like that. Won't the rest of the world all chip in and attack North Korea? No, there isn't much of a reason to suspect that anyone except for members of the developed western trade bloc(1) would join in. (1) in spoiler + Show Spoiler + (1) "developed western trade bloc" : developed countries with financialized economies that are deeply integrated into the U.S.A.'s trade goods network(a) such as the U.K., Germany, other euros (non-russian), Japan. (a) "trade goods network" : petroleum, technology trade, money commodity (U.S. dollar), other tradeable things I say this because of my principle that the continuing viability of a country's present economy is the biggest decision driver for Nations.

If NK ATTACKS USA, i really doubt Canada won't help.

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On March 29 2013 13:14 suited_mess wrote: " ww2 we were pretty much fighting China " ?what... there is a difference between China and Japan, China was stayin at their own territory only worried about Japan, since they were doing that, they were on your side pretty much, reading does not hurt

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Which_side_did_China_take_in_World_War_2

On March 29 2013 13:16 2c0ntent wrote: I agree, Canada definitely falls into the category of deeply integrated economies

It also depends a bit on the governement, and what war it is exactly.

I think back when Jean Chretien was prime minister, they didn't join in the Bush craziness of invading Irak for no real reasons. That was mostly because canadians were opposed to it, and even UN was against it.

But now i think its a different scenario... Harper is pretty pro war, and if a war between USA/NK started i think its pretty clear it would be NK's fault now (hence why i doubt Russia/China would do anything). There's also probably a massive difference between NK declaring the war and USA declaring the war. If NK declare it i'm pretty sure tons of countries will support USA, and most likely none will defend NK.

ANyways i am not very worried about USA (really doubt NK can scatch them), i am much more worried for South Korea. Its such an amazing country with amazing people, hope they're ok, because its obvious NK is able to hurt them.

Why has the world even entertained NK for so long?
Why are we just waiting for cancer to become malignant, bigger and dangerous?

Was never a fan of war in Afghanistan and Iraq but doesn't Iraq provide an example of how much damage and suffering could be avoided if they just finished the job in Kuwait?

Vietnam?

Cuba?

The reason the world (mostly China/Russia/etc) isn't just going to say "sure lets get rid of NK" is the same reason USA won't go "sure lets get rid of Israel". Those small countries kinda help balance the powers between the major powers in the world. If countries like Iran and NK were taken out, the power of USA/Nato/etc would be so much bigger that countries like Russia/China would get scared. Peace is maintained mostly because both sides really do not wish a war right now, since damage would be so major we would all die, but if usa takes out all small ennemies, and really get a good anti nuclear defense, then it will be scary for Russia/China. Not saying USA would declare war on them, but imagine the opposite happened (China took out all our small allies, and started getting a big anti nuclear defense), that would be scary.

On March 29 2013 20:04 mnj wrote: Why has the world even entertained NK for so long? Why are we just waiting for cancer to become malignant, bigger and dangerous? Was never a fan of war in Afghanistan and Iraq but doesn't Iraq provide an example of how much damage and suffering could be avoided if they just finished the job in Kuwait? Vietnam? Cuba?

North Korea isn't a cancer. Cancer's spread. All countries hope to be cancers but only the most powerful ones achieve cancer.
Maybe it's becoming more dangerous, but the danger of invading NK far outweighs the danger of doing nothing. Like all countries, it will eventually collapse.

Believe it or not, some people really do have a moral compass, and all this war mongering sensationalism that people see in America is kinda proven false, since we arent going around taking over countries at our whim. Hitler would have done away with NK a long time ago. The USA? We actually dont want that.

/in b4 baseless accusations about 9/11 retaliation or taking all of Iraq's oil while I pay $4.20/gallon at the pump.

mbn paying 4.20/ galon
T.T

On March 29 2013 22:43 NewbSaibot wrote: Believe it or not, some people really do have a moral compass, and all this war mongering sensationalism that people see in America is kinda proven false, since we arent going around taking over countries at our whim. Hitler would have done away with NK a long time ago. The USA? We actually dont want that. /in b4 baseless accusations about 9/11 retaliation or taking all of Iraq's oil while I pay $4.20/gallon at the pump.

i think that a lot of Americans see America as a country governed by people with no moral compass. Just look at the congress approval ratings, and also the fact that 30% of americans think 9/11 was an inside job (it wasn't obviously, but that shows that 30% of americans think that the government is capable of it) The true horror of our civilization is that people feel helpless to change the system when they know that it's fucked. Hitler could only dream of having the level of obedience and indoctrination that democratic countries have today.

first time i ever really liked things floofy had to say.

NK position in a geopolitical sense is 100% a balance in the pacific theatre. if you can put yourself in China's shoes and imagine how it looks from the inside looking out they are effectively surrounded by hostile US and US allied military bases and naval troops. NK serves China by balancing that.

However, at the same time, China also prefers the status quo in NK because were it to undergo a dramatic regime change or occupation there would be a large economic crisis. Were SK to 'absorb' NK it would bankrupt SK as the infrastructure is not up to par and the vast majority of NK citizens would likely want to migrate to either SK or China in order to 'seek a better life' as people do. In short, an abrupt end to the NK situation would probably be a giant economic clusterfuck. The same reasons China prefer the status quo apply to Russia as well to a lesser extent.

All that being said, I have no idea why NK is going so bonkers and why the media appears to be somewhat sensationalizing it. A friend in S. Korea recently told me that he feels that the average Korean's concern with NK or possible military conflict on a 1-10 scale right now is a solid 1. I know that's pretty anecdotal but interesting nonetheless. Either S. Korea media isn't pandering to this situation as much as the western media is or S. Korean's just for whatever reason take N. Korea far less seriously as a threat than the rest of us.

Either way, I'm personally nervous about how this would play out. Even if in a best case scenario S. Korea absorbs NK with minimal violence.... then what?

On March 29 2013 23:59 Stroggoz wrote: [QUOTE]On March 29 2013 22:43 NewbSaibot wrote: i think that a lot of Americans see America as a country governed by people with no moral compass. Just look at the congress approval ratings, and also the fact that 30% of americans think 9/11 was an inside job (it wasn't obviously, but that shows that 30% of americans think that the government is capable of it) The true horror of our civilization is that people feel helpless to change the system when they know that it's fucked. Hitler could only dream of having the level of obedience and indoctrination that democratic countries have today.

Sorry about the double post.

As an American, I don't think the American population is so much obedient or indoctrinated for the most part so much as pacified by a very easy lifestyle. Things just aren't even close to bad enough to get people striking/protesting/marching with regularity let alone outright fighting the powers that be in an organized fashion, and this will probably never happen so long as it's as easy at it is to get by.

I think most Americans actually do feel a sense of being trapped as a mini-cog in a gigantic machine and don't know a good way out. The vast majority of people my age don't even vote, the small percent (20%?) that do are probably the 20% that are brainwash indoctrinated into thinking that the candidates they choose whether local/state/national will actually have any real impact on the status quo.

Personally, I blame the two party system and lobby network for encouraging candidates to have similar goals with regards to getting elected and maintaining office, but that view is controversial. Either way, as it stands now in the U.S. people from both parties have to make the same types of people happy in order to do their jobs effectively while appealing to trivial hot topics that rely on emotions rather than logic to secure votes of the unintelligent (abortion, gay rights, blablabla). I'm not saying gay rights and abortion aren't a big fucking deal, but what I am saying is all the politicians on either side know damn well there is little they can do to change those things on a macro level, and the things they will actually do in office fall in line with where the money needs to go.

Mega off topic semi-uneducated hugely opinionated rant above, please forgive me.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-21979127

"it has begun"

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On March 30 2013 05:59 idonotremember wrote: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-21979127 "it has begun"

no it hasnt, only words are flying

when they actually start firing, then rebump this thread, till then its all just clueless assumptions

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they live in alternate reality, and you dont get it, its a show AND YOU HAVE TO be part of it

Kim John Un probably believes a lot of the show himself. He is the third generation ruler of a country that heavily indoctrinates it's upper/middle class. so i wouldn't be surprised if he bought everything their state media and his advisers tell him. I mean, they would all want to believe it so they can keep on living the good life. The power structure in north korea allows for the most loyal/unquestioning to become the most influential, and the most questioning/unloyal to be sent to the gulag. Anyway, just my speculation

I might post some stuff on america later nolan but not in this thread.

Would like to read what you have to say Stroggoz. Glad nolan provides input into LP as well.

I'm not quite sure if I buy that the absorbtion of NK by SK would bankrupt the country although I'm sure you have more knowledge on this topic. I guess I just think of East and West Berlin/Germany and IIRC the adoption of Pro-Business capitalism provided a way for the former communist sector a way to rapidly catch up economically.

Also, Nk could be absorbed in a phase/tiered way, where they are just left alone or minimally supported to plant the seeds of free-trade, education, industrialization etc

Cheap labor. Natural resource abundance and all that land area for almost unlimited industrialization - yes SK would absolutely be decimated if NK collapses and assimilates with them to form 1 unified korea

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2...ng-china-mobilizing-troops-jets-near/

On April 01 2013 16:31 Gnarly wrote: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2...ng-china-mobilizing-troops-jets-near/

could be a lot of reasons for this tho. I doubt china is actually planning to war USA.

capaneo is one racist midget

On April 01 2013 17:31 Floofy wrote: Show nested quote + On April 01 2013 16:31 Gnarly wrote: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2...ng-china-mobilizing-troops-jets-near/ could be a lot of reasons for this tho. I doubt china is actually planning to war USA.

It doesn't matter if they are planning to, they must react to show that they will honor their treaties. If we attack, they must respond. If they attack, we must respond. I highly doubt the US or China will strike first, nor SK, but NK.... The only wild card I can see. Russia might be a dick here and there, and Japan will defend themselves, but everyone must show they will honor their words.

China isnt about to go to war with their biggest debtor. China puts the brakes on NK long before NK actually does anything since they know we wont give a fuck and will smash the shit out of them if necessary and China really resents the idea of even more western military presence in their neighborhood. NK is just trying to avoid a civil war on their hands as soon as their population starts questioning the credibility of their government.

On April 01 2013 18:22 NewbSaibot wrote: China isnt about to go to war with their biggest debtor. China puts the brakes on NK long before NK actually does anything since they know we wont give a fuck and will smash the shit out of them if necessary and China really resents the idea of even more western military presence in their neighborhood. NK is just trying to avoid a civil war on their hands as soon as their population starts questioning the credibility of their government.

It's not that China does want to. If we attack, they MUST attack. You may think you know what NK will do, but you can only assume. If NK attacks, we must attack. This is how treaties work.

Oh of course we will attack, but China will not intervene because they cant afford to have us just say "lol fuck you" and stop paying. We've already been to war with NK once, and it did not end up being a war with China despite China's assistance.

On April 01 2013 21:27 NewbSaibot wrote: Oh of course we will attack, but China will not intervene because they cant afford to have us just say "lol fuck you" and stop paying. We've already been to war with NK once, and it did not end up being a war with China despite China's assistance.

Do you not understand how treaties work? If we attack NK, if they attacked first or not, China MUST respond. If they don't, then every other treaty they currently have will be worthless, and they won't be able to get into any new treaties because they will have shown the entire world that their word is worthless. Whenever the first Korean war happened, they were not in a treaty. They only entered AFTER we left, and quite a few years after. They are CURRENTLY in a treaty with NK. In 2021, they either renew or they don't. Maybe things can be held off until then, but until then, China must honor it's word.

bro that's gnarly

On April 01 2013 21:53 Gnarly wrote: Show nested quote + On April 01 2013 21:27 NewbSaibot wrote: Oh of course we will attack, but China will not intervene because they cant afford to have us just say "lol fuck you" and stop paying. We've already been to war with NK once, and it did not end up being a war with China despite China's assistance. Do you not understand how treaties work? If we attack NK, if they attacked first or not, China MUST respond. If they don't, then every other treaty they currently have will be worthless, and they won't be able to get into any new treaties because they will have shown the entire world that their word is worthless. Whenever the first Korean war happened, they were not in a treaty. They only entered AFTER we left, and quite a few years after. They are CURRENTLY in a treaty with NK. In 2021, they either renew or they don't. Maybe things can be held off until then, but until then, China must honor it's word.

Do you seriously think China will start an apocalyptic nuclear 3rd world war to "honor their word"?.


China has grown apart lately from NorthKorean ideologies and its drifting towards modernity, NK is nothing but their old rabid dog that was useful in the past, but now that its their time to climb to the top of the world they wont hesitate in putting it down if it comes to it.

On April 01 2013 23:42 Baalim wrote: Show nested quote + On April 01 2013 21:53 Gnarly wrote:   On April 01 2013 21:27 NewbSaibot wrote: Oh of course we will attack, but China will not intervene because they cant afford to have us just say "lol fuck you" and stop paying. We've already been to war with NK once, and it did not end up being a war with China despite China's assistance. Do you not understand how treaties work? If we attack NK, if they attacked first or not, China MUST respond. If they don't, then every other treaty they currently have will be worthless, and they won't be able to get into any new treaties because they will have shown the entire world that their word is worthless. Whenever the first Korean war happened, they were not in a treaty. They only entered AFTER we left, and quite a few years after. They are CURRENTLY in a treaty with NK. In 2021, they either renew or they don't. Maybe things can be held off until then, but until then, China must honor it's word. Do you seriously think China will start an apocalyptic nuclear 3rd world war to "honor their word"?. China has grown apart lately from NorthKorean ideologies and its drifting towards modernity, NK is nothing but their old rabid dog that was useful in the past, but now that its their time to climb to the top of the world they wont hesitate in putting it down if it comes to it.

If China dishonors one treaty, would they dishonor any of it's other treaties? Do you think Russia, Taiwan, Australia, and other countries would not care at all? They would shit fucking bricks. Do you know about BRICS? Do you think Brazil, India, Russia and South Africa would keep doing business with China? I'm not saying China will immediately start nuking everyone. I'm saying that China will engage in military combat if NK is attacked.

It's like playing poker with some people, and one of the people goes all-in, loses, and refuses to actually pay up. Would you ever play with that person ever again? Word would spread and other people would avoid that player.

Do you think China would willingly lose it's trading partners?

I can guarantee China cutting ties to North Korea would have precisely zero negative impact on Australian-Chinese relations. International Relations is a hell of a lot more complex than the schoolyard system you're presenting here.

But hey, I don't know shit about it.

On March 30 2013 13:16 Stroggoz wrote: Kim John Un probably believes a lot of the show himself. He is the third generation ruler of a country that heavily indoctrinates it's upper/middle class. so i wouldn't be surprised if he bought everything their state media and his advisers tell him. I mean, they would all want to believe it so they can keep on living the good life. The power structure in north korea allows for the most loyal/unquestioning to become the most influential, and the most questioning/unloyal to be sent to the gulag. Anyway, just my speculation I might post some stuff on america later nolan but not in this thread.

I thought he went to school in the west? I kind of doubt he believes anything he says...

On April 02 2013 01:39 TianYuan wrote: Show nested quote + On March 30 2013 13:16 Stroggoz wrote: Kim John Un probably believes a lot of the show himself. He is the third generation ruler of a country that heavily indoctrinates it's upper/middle class. so i wouldn't be surprised if he bought everything their state media and his advisers tell him. I mean, they would all want to believe it so they can keep on living the good life. The power structure in north korea allows for the most loyal/unquestioning to become the most influential, and the most questioning/unloyal to be sent to the gulag. Anyway, just my speculation I might post some stuff on america later nolan but not in this thread. I thought he went to school in the west? I kind of doubt he believes anything he says...

yeah he did go to school in Switzerland i think.

There was a recent AMA on reddit from a defector who had some interesting things to say about public opinion / propaganda in NK.
http://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments..._defector_from_north_korea_joined_by/

On April 02 2013 01:28 TheLink wrote: I can guarantee China cutting ties to North Korea would have precisely zero negative impact on Australian-Chinese relations. International Relations is a hell of a lot more complex than the schoolyard system you're presenting here. But hey, I don't know shit about it.

It depends on how they cut ties. If they did it now, they would be saying that all of their treaties are now susceptible to the same fate. Unless, of course, that's just not how things work and countries who go back on their words are actually trusted even more. It would force every country to re-evaluate their current treaties with China.

"Oh, a major trading partner just negated a treaty without proper procedure? Let's extend our treaties with them!"

ER sorry but china doesn't give a shit about anything except making money and the nk is broke as fuck - its not rocket science to analyze how this will eventually play out between china and nk.

NK is an exception to the rule. Nobody would give a rat fuck if China dropped them in a hot minute, and in fact it would probably be expected. China's relationship with NK is nothing like their relationship with other nations. China only backs NK as part of some historical communist drama before China became the industry it is today. China benefits absolutely nothing from NK and their financial support of them practically amounts to a rounding error on the yearly budget sheets. "Oh NK? Shit we're still sending them goods? Well, whatever. It's more hassle to stop than it is to just continue, fuck it". But if NK loses their shit and some retarded commander orders a missile launch while a B-2 is flying by? Yeah shit is on now and no way China risks their economy to "uphold their word" to a nation nobody expects them to give a fuck about. It'd be like if the USA stopped sending aid to fuckin, zimbabwe or some dumb shit. You think anybody would give a fuck about a broken treaty like that?

for those of you who play civ5
http://www.reddit.com/r/explainlikeIA..._possible_north_korea_vs_usa_conflict

Really nobody has any fucking clue how China will react if NK and SK go to war. It's a very delicate situation.

On April 02 2013 03:24 Gnarly wrote: Show nested quote + On April 02 2013 01:28 TheLink wrote: I can guarantee China cutting ties to North Korea would have precisely zero negative impact on Australian-Chinese relations. International Relations is a hell of a lot more complex than the schoolyard system you're presenting here. But hey, I don't know shit about it. It depends on how they cut ties. If they did it now, they would be saying that all of their treaties are now susceptible to the same fate. Unless, of course, that's just not how things work and countries who go back on their words are actually trusted even more. It would force every country to re-evaluate their current treaties with China. "Oh, a major trading partner just negated a treaty without proper procedure? Let's extend our treaties with them!"

You have a very black and white view of the situation. Diplomacy is flexible and treaties are not all born equal. Especially treaties made with dictators... these only hold while it is beneficial to the stronger side.

If no one expected China to back up NK, then why is there such a delicate situation? If it was just NK by itself, we would've destroyed them by now. But alas! They are a buffer for China, and are protected by China! Then again, NK is also a trading partner of Russia, so we'd have to deal with that backlash in such a scenario. NK is also thought to have around 6 trillion dollars worth of raw materials. Certainly enough for it to be of significance for the country.

America and Zimbabwe don't have any treaties by themselves, but America has one with a group of African countries that does include Zimbabwe. If America says, "Fuck you, Z," then the other countries in the treaty would need to evaluate that situation.

Burundi Comoros Congo Dem Rep. Djibouti Egypt Eritrea Ethiopia Kenya Libya Madagascar Malawi Mauritius Rwanda Seychelles Sudan Swaziland Uganda Zambia Zimbabwe

All of these countries are under America's influence to prevent other major powers like Russia or China from getting to them. And that's not the only TIFA that America is involved with, as they are involved world wide. So, if America stopped part of it's bargain just for one part of a group, it would send a message to all other TIFA participants. If you don't think so, you really need a dose of reality.

I think NewbSaibot hit the nail on the head

On April 02 2013 08:01 NewbSaibot wrote: NK is an exception to the rule. Nobody would give a rat fuck if China dropped them in a hot minute, and in fact it would probably be expected. China's relationship with NK is nothing like their relationship with other nations. China only backs NK as part of some historical communist drama before China became the industry it is today. China benefits absolutely nothing from NK and their financial support of them practically amounts to a rounding error on the yearly budget sheets. "Oh NK? Shit we're still sending them goods? Well, whatever. It's more hassle to stop than it is to just continue, fuck it". But if NK loses their shit and some retarded commander orders a missile launch while a B-2 is flying by? Yeah shit is on now and no way China risks their economy to "uphold their word" to a nation nobody expects them to give a fuck about. It'd be like if the USA stopped sending aid to fuckin, zimbabwe or some dumb shit. You think anybody would give a fuck about a broken treaty like that?

+ Show Spoiler +

On April 02 2013 00:09 Gnarly wrote: Show nested quote + On April 01 2013 23:42 Baalim wrote:   On April 01 2013 21:53 Gnarly wrote:   On April 01 2013 21:27 NewbSaibot wrote: Oh of course we will attack, but China will not intervene because they cant afford to have us just say "lol fuck you" and stop paying. We've already been to war with NK once, and it did not end up being a war with China despite China's assistance. Do you not understand how treaties work? If we attack NK, if they attacked first or not, China MUST respond. If they don't, then every other treaty they currently have will be worthless, and they won't be able to get into any new treaties because they will have shown the entire world that their word is worthless. Whenever the first Korean war happened, they were not in a treaty. They only entered AFTER we left, and quite a few years after. They are CURRENTLY in a treaty with NK. In 2021, they either renew or they don't. Maybe things can be held off until then, but until then, China must honor it's word. Do you seriously think China will start an apocalyptic nuclear 3rd world war to "honor their word"?. China has grown apart lately from NorthKorean ideologies and its drifting towards modernity, NK is nothing but their old rabid dog that was useful in the past, but now that its their time to climb to the top of the world they wont hesitate in putting it down if it comes to it. If China dishonors one treaty, would they dishonor any of it's other treaties? Do you think Russia, Taiwan, Australia, and other countries would not care at all? They would shit fucking bricks. Do you know about BRICS? Do you think Brazil, India, Russia and South Africa would keep doing business with China? I'm not saying China will immediately start nuking everyone. I'm saying that China will engage in military combat if NK is attacked. It's like playing poker with some people, and one of the people goes all-in, loses, and refuses to actually pay up. Would you ever play with that person ever again? Word would spread and other people would avoid that player. Do you think China would willingly lose it's trading partners?

Chinas trading partners dont give a flying fuck about north korea, probably as the rest of the world they secretly hope it finally turns into a smoldering crater, China wouldnt look sleazy or weak to the rest of the world if they abandon NorthKorea, it would look like a sensible country for the first time.

On April 02 2013 08:01 NewbSaibot wrote: NK is an exception to the rule. Nobody would give a rat fuck if China dropped them in a hot minute, and in fact it would probably be expected. China's relationship with NK is nothing like their relationship with other nations. China only backs NK as part of some historical communist drama before China became the industry it is today. China benefits absolutely nothing from NK and their financial support of them practically amounts to a rounding error on the yearly budget sheets. "Oh NK? Shit we're still sending them goods? Well, whatever. It's more hassle to stop than it is to just continue, fuck it". But if NK loses their shit and some retarded commander orders a missile launch while a B-2 is flying by? Yeah shit is on now and no way China risks their economy to "uphold their word" to a nation nobody expects them to give a fuck about. It'd be like if the USA stopped sending aid to fuckin, zimbabwe or some dumb shit. You think anybody would give a fuck about a broken treaty like that?

First time i agree with NewbSaibot ever

China would use that treaty as toilet paper if it would mean they lose their trillions of dollars in collectibles from the rest of the world

Think of having a really prosperous business and your asshole of a cousin is bugging all your customers and threatening them all the time lol

I think what's happening is this: Kim Jong Un is new, and is just trying to basically do the same his father did to make sure he doesn't loose the control of his country. He's trying to prove himself to his people. But its not working, USA is ignoring them. So he has to QQ harder and harder and harder until he gets his toy. China can tell him to calm down all it wants, it doesn't matter.

But this Kim guy doesn't look very stable, so its hard to predict what he will do once he realize all this QQing won't do anything.

China probably just wants all of this to end, but also surely doesn't want NK to disapear. If NK attacked SK and Allies attacked NK, i don't know what China would do. My guess would be is they will help out NK but not start WW3 or something.

I'm wonder for those who are that no one cares about NK, do you actually work for the government, or is that just your opinion?

http://english.yonhapnews.co.kr/north.../0401000000AEN20130403001900315F.HTML

NK holds up S. Korean workers' departure to Kaesong industrial complex

I've read all of your posts (Floofy) in this thread, and as someone who actually keeps in tune with Canadian politics and geo-political stances... also combined with some of your other ideas - I can very confidently say you don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

On April 03 2013 00:12 devon06atX wrote: I've read all of your posts (Floofy) in this thread, and as someone who actually keeps in tune with Canadian politics and geo-political stances... also combined with some of your other ideas - I can very confidently say you don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

Why don't you point out where i am wrong? Because if you say everything i said is wrong, then you are the one who has no clue. But its def possible some of my points are wrong especially when i mention i am just doing guesses.

NK has the go-ahead to use nukes. Rumors of two submarines missing. Chinese tanks on the Korean border. THAAD? missile defense warships mobilized. Rumors of Fort Knox on lockdown. Rumors of Defcon 3.

Best news yet:

WASHINGTON IS PUSHING TO MAKE FACEBOOK ACCOUNT PASSWORD HANDOVER FOR EMPLOYMENT MANDATORY!

http://112.170.78.145:50000/chosun

North korean tv live stream, need vlc addon to your browser. im using firefox, works flawless. odd shit, wish i could understand what they say. Live now, some Korean opera on tv.

From TL:
+ Show Spoiler +

^you can just add the link to VLC directly

nvm, it was already posted in rofl thread

On April 07 2013 01:55 uiCk wrote: http://112.170.78.145:50000/chosun North korean tv live stream, need vlc addon to your browser. im using firefox, works flawless. odd shit, wish i could understand what they say. Live now, some Korean opera on tv. From TL: + Show Spoiler + Show nested quote + On April 02 2013 05:44 s3rp wrote: 16:30-17:00 Test Pattern with digital clock (Music and clock ident with bell, Russian orthodox, Roman Catholic cathedral & clock) 30-minutes 17:00-17:10 National Anthem, Introduction Announcement, Kim Il-sung (instrumental and minus one anthem) & Kim Jong-il (instrumental version), Television Listings 10-minutes 17:10-17:20 News (Metropolitan Edition) 10-minutes 17:20-17:25 Weather Forecast (Metropolitan Edition) 5-minutes 17:25-17:30 Newspaper Review 5-minutes 17:30-18:00 Situation Comedy 30-minutes 18:00-18:20 Sports 20-minutes 18:20-18:40 Military 20-minutes 18:40-19:00 Law Enforcement 20-minutes 19:00-19:25 News (Local Edition) 25-minutes 19:25-19:30 Weather Forecast (Local Edition) 5-minutes 19:30-20:00 Music Video 30-minutes 20:00-21:00 Drama 1-hours 21:00-22:30 Movie Theater 90-minutes 22:30-22:45 Late News (Metropolitan & Local Edition) 15-minutes 22:40-22:45 Weather Forecast (Metropolitan & Local Edition) 5-minutes 22:45-23:00 Music Videos 15-minutes 23:00-23:10 TV Listings for Tomorrow, Farewell announcenent, National Flag 10-minutes 23:10-17:00 Fade Out Black, Test Pattern 18-hours and 10 minutes There you go . You just have to adjust your time and korean local and you can allways follow the program. Pretty strange they only broadcast from 5 PM on out and also only for 6 hours . Edit: just read on weekends and holidays they broadcast 15 hours ! I am really curious what situation comedy is. That and what kind of music videos they show.

[/QUOTE]

This makes me even more wanna go to war against North Korea.

Black Hawk down near the North border. No details as of yet, but this comes after a fresh threat that the North will launch a blitzkrieg on the South unless they stop preparing for a possible attack. (ultimatum)

Don't prepare for an attack, or we'll attack you!

On April 16 2013 00:53 whamm! wrote: Don't prepare for an attack, or we'll attack you!

Lower your defenses and we won't attack you!

On April 16 2013 00:53 whamm! wrote: Don't prepare for an attack, or we'll attack you!

haha yeah, my thoughts exactly