over $26k seized from PCA players

Kinda funny story in my opinion, 3 guys coming back from PCA tournament to USA didn't declare at the customs that they were carrying substanial amount of cash, because... they were late for plane and didn't want to be question Customs obv found out they have too much cash on them, they get arrested and 26k$ is gone.

Full story: http://www.tribune242.com/sports/01182012_lj-PokerMoney_news_pg1

shady of them to take all of the money; like i'd rather go to jail for a week / month than lose 25k. and their crime does not even warrant jail time so...

On January 19 2012 04:10 traxamillion wrote: like i'd rather go to jail for a MONTH than lose 25k.

LOL

If by funny you mean revolting and enraging...they just stole the kids money, I hope that magistrate bitch suffers somehow.

correct me if im wrong but not declaring over 10k is considered as smuggling, and in those annoying custom forms it always says very clearly that in case of smuggling you can get your items confiscated and a fine.

I feel for the guys tho, if i was in the same position of nearly missing the flight (i often am) i wouldnt declare, damn

On January 19 2012 05:11 Baalim wrote: correct me if im wrong but not declaring over 10k is considered as smuggling, and in those annoying custom forms it always says very clearly that in case of smuggling you can get your items confiscated and a fine. I feel for the guys tho, if i was in the same position of nearly missing the flight (i often am) i wouldnt declare, damn

you are right. bigggggggggggggg mistake not to declare, US customs are unreal rapists

US customs took my favourite Clipper lighter to stop me hijacking the plane. I fucking love Clippers - I have an awesome collection which now has a big gap in it. I expect those kids can understand my pain.

Well hope at least they had some really decent flight for that 25k. It's still dumb of them not to report, cuz what is the chance scanners dont detect their money? Looks super -EV to me

If that happened to me I would just "subtract" the loss's from my tax's over the next few years.

Damn I got lucky once then, I flew in with 10k euro and didn't check the box. Told them I thought I didn't have to do it cause I thought that was only for over 10k. Stayed at customs for 1,5 hours though, while they searched my bags and everything and asking me questions how much this pokerstars chip was worth:

1 mirrrion dollar chip

Anyone read the article?

"It was revealed by prosecution that a secondary search of the defendants brought on by the nervousness of the sweating younger brother, showed that the brothers were each in possession of $9,400."

No one had more than 10k, and one of the three arrested was just a cousin (different last name). So basically its all cuz they didn't declare "as family." Seems like they knew the law and were deliberately careful about it but are getting screwed by the fine print.

On January 19 2012 10:39 NMcNasty wrote: Anyone read the article? "It was revealed by prosecution that a secondary search of the defendants brought on by the nervousness of the sweating younger brother, showed that the brothers were each in possession of $9,400." No one had more than 10k, and one of the three arrested was just a cousin (different last name). So basically its all cuz they didn't declare "as family." Seems like they knew the law and were deliberately careful about it but are getting screwed by the fine print.

Damn that sucks, but I understand the law.

Otherwise you could just send a mexican family with $9,900 each on a plane and smuggle billions with just one relative hostage.

On January 19 2012 04:10 traxamillion wrote: shady of them to take all of the money; like i'd rather go to jail for a week / month than lose 25k. and their crime does not even warrant jail time so...

wtf family? how does that apply when each has under $10k. Pretty fucking stupid. So if you have $9500 you can cross border without saying a word?

On January 19 2012 13:02 Stim_Abuser wrote: Show nested quote + On January 19 2012 10:39 NMcNasty wrote: Anyone read the article? "It was revealed by prosecution that a secondary search of the defendants brought on by the nervousness of the sweating younger brother, showed that the brothers were each in possession of $9,400." No one had more than 10k, and one of the three arrested was just a cousin (different last name). So basically its all cuz they didn't declare "as family." Seems like they knew the law and were deliberately careful about it but are getting screwed by the fine print. Damn that sucks, but I understand the law. Otherwise you could just send a mexican family with $9,900 each on a plane and smuggle billions with just one relative hostage.

You can do that regardless of whether they are family or not though. Also when does "family" end? If my long lost cousin I've never seen before is carrying $20,000 undeclared and I have $2 in my wallet, am I smuggling? The law is ridic, the interpretation is ridic, and the punishment is especially ridic.

damn i had lotta money on me a couple times flying internationally and never checked the box and never got hassled. Talk about a free (for me) wakeup call.

On January 19 2012 05:58 daysare wrote: Well hope at least they had some really decent flight for that 25k. It's still dumb of them not to report, cuz what is the chance scanners dont detect their money? Looks super -EV to me

i traveled with 6k in $20 bills in my laptop bag, and in that denomination it looks like a shitload of money, nobody said a thing even if they saw money in the Xray machines

On January 19 2012 13:41 Highcard wrote: wtf family? how does that apply when each has under $10k. Pretty fucking stupid. So if you have $9500 you can cross border without saying a word?

Yes you can cross with $9,999.99

On January 19 2012 13:54 NMcNasty wrote: Show nested quote + On January 19 2012 13:02 Stim_Abuser wrote:   On January 19 2012 10:39 NMcNasty wrote: Anyone read the article? "It was revealed by prosecution that a secondary search of the defendants brought on by the nervousness of the sweating younger brother, showed that the brothers were each in possession of $9,400." No one had more than 10k, and one of the three arrested was just a cousin (different last name). So basically its all cuz they didn't declare "as family." Seems like they knew the law and were deliberately careful about it but are getting screwed by the fine print. Damn that sucks, but I understand the law. Otherwise you could just send a mexican family with $9,900 each on a plane and smuggle billions with just one relative hostage. You can do that regardless of whether they are family or not though. Also when does "family" end? If my long lost cousin I've never seen before is carrying $20,000 undeclared and I have $2 in my wallet, am I smuggling? The law is ridic, the interpretation is ridic, and the punishment is especially ridic.

Hard to get a plane full of people to smuggle money for you and not just rip you off. If they're all family you can just get one family member hostage down in Mexico, and everyone will play along.


Mostly though, I was just trying to troll Baal.

On January 19 2012 14:06 Baalim wrote: Show nested quote + On January 19 2012 13:41 Highcard wrote: wtf family? how does that apply when each has under $10k. Pretty fucking stupid. So if you have $9500 you can cross border without saying a word? Yes you can cross with $9,999.99

i've crossed with 9,800 before. the agent asked me if i had cash i told him i had 9,800 he asked me like 3 times sternly if i am sure it is under 10k and let me go without looking.

another time in Miami airport I declared that I had something like 20k and got detained/questioned for like 2 hours while the agents knew full well i was going to miss a connection and instantly provided all documentation of where the money came from / where i was.

i'm pretty confident that incident #2 was related to flying in from south america to Miami airport but still airport security has some crazy RNG

On January 19 2012 10:39 NMcNasty wrote: Anyone read the article? "It was revealed by prosecution that a secondary search of the defendants brought on by the nervousness of the sweating younger brother, showed that the brothers were each in possession of $9,400." No one had more than 10k, and one of the three arrested was just a cousin (different last name). So basically its all cuz they didn't declare "as family." Seems like they knew the law and were deliberately careful about it but are getting screwed by the fine print.

i think there is a law to combat this called structuring which makes it illegal for one person to divide up his money (exceeding 10k obv) across x amount of people such that each person has less than 10k. this is what i heard at pca a few years ago and almost everyone was guilty of it leaving pca but it seems generally hard to prove. i dont know the people (nor did i read the article sry t.t) but people who brought family generally had them take back $9xxx. given the improbability of 3 actual good poker players in a family thats probably what happened. generally it seems hard to prove but with minimal legwork it probably wouldnt be in this occasion (if its the case)

I'm unclear on this, what happens if you just do the honest thing and declare that you have over $10k? Do you pay a tax on it or something?

^no tax, but you may be pulled aside for questioning that might take a while.

I would be interested to see the exact wording on the customs form. Whether its asked on the form or by the officials if it's "Are you bringing in10k in more?" saying you have more than 10k when it's only $9400 would be lying.

On January 19 2012 16:21 nolan wrote: Show nested quote + On January 19 2012 14:06 Baalim wrote:   On January 19 2012 13:41 Highcard wrote: wtf family? how does that apply when each has under $10k. Pretty fucking stupid. So if you have $9500 you can cross border without saying a word? Yes you can cross with $9,999.99 i've crossed with 9,800 before. the agent asked me if i had cash i told him i had 9,800 he asked me like 3 times sternly if i am sure it is under 10k and let me go without looking. another time in Miami airport I declared that I had something like 20k and got detained/questioned for like 2 hours while the agents knew full well i was going to miss a connection and instantly provided all documentation of where the money came from / where i was. i'm pretty confident that incident #2 was related to flying in from south america to Miami airport but still airport security has some crazy RNG

It was probably because you're black.

On January 19 2012 19:02 NMcNasty wrote: I would be interested to see the exact wording on the customs form. Whether its asked on the form or by the officials if it's "Are you bringing in10k in more?" saying you have more than 10k when it's only $9400 would be lying.

Its asked in the form and sometimes the officials ask you too.

The forms always have those checkboxes asking if you have been in contact with animals or are bringing any vegetables etc, usually at the bottom it says that if you carry over 10k (including travelers checks) you write down how much and you usually get pulled and questioned about the money a bit, ive heard its really quick but it seems that some people here were there a long time.

On January 19 2012 16:21 nolan wrote: Show nested quote + On January 19 2012 14:06 Baalim wrote:   On January 19 2012 13:41 Highcard wrote: wtf family? how does that apply when each has under $10k. Pretty fucking stupid. So if you have $9500 you can cross border without saying a word? Yes you can cross with $9,999.99 i've crossed with 9,800 before. the agent asked me if i had cash i told him i had 9,800 he asked me like 3 times sternly if i am sure it is under 10k and let me go without looking. another time in Miami airport I declared that I had something like 20k and got detained/questioned for like 2 hours while the agents knew full well i was going to miss a connection and instantly provided all documentation of where the money came from / where i was. i'm pretty confident that incident #2 was related to flying in from south america to Miami airport but still airport security has some crazy RNG

Miami airport is one of the worst airports in the world, i missed my connection flight to Bahamas because the immigration line was over an hour long and you still had to go through security again

I would rather go to Norwegian jail for 1 month than lose 25k

But i rather die than go to American jail for 1 month i think

missing plane or not need to def declare that shit...26k lesson learned. sick beat tho ;(

it's standard for customs to just take your shit if it's breaking any sort of laws...such as fruit/meats etc. and cash/monies is no exception

On January 19 2012 20:39 VanDerMeyde wrote: I would rather go to Norwegian jail for 1 month than lose 25k But i rather die than go to American jail for 1 month i think

what

On January 19 2012 21:13 SpasticInk wrote: Show nested quote + On January 19 2012 20:39 VanDerMeyde wrote: I would rather go to Norwegian jail for 1 month than lose 25k But i rather die than go to American jail for 1 month i think what

he'd rather go to a nice resort prison compared to the federal pound me in the ass prison

On January 19 2012 19:57 Baalim wrote: Show nested quote + On January 19 2012 16:21 nolan wrote:   On January 19 2012 14:06 Baalim wrote:   On January 19 2012 13:41 Highcard wrote: wtf family? how does that apply when each has under $10k. Pretty fucking stupid. So if you have $9500 you can cross border without saying a word? Yes you can cross with $9,999.99 i've crossed with 9,800 before. the agent asked me if i had cash i told him i had 9,800 he asked me like 3 times sternly if i am sure it is under 10k and let me go without looking. another time in Miami airport I declared that I had something like 20k and got detained/questioned for like 2 hours while the agents knew full well i was going to miss a connection and instantly provided all documentation of where the money came from / where i was. i'm pretty confident that incident #2 was related to flying in from south america to Miami airport but still airport security has some crazy RNG Miami airport is one of the worst airports in the world, i missed my connection flight to Bahamas because the immigration line was over an hour long and you still had to go through security again

My wife and I have both been detained there on separate occasions. Me for walking too fast and her for having a common latino name

On January 19 2012 18:54 NMcNasty wrote: ^no tax, but you may be pulled aside for questioning that might take a while.

So get there early, declare and there's no problem? Sigh, poker players.

If you know you have more than 10k why would you ever take the chance? If I had 20k on me I'd make sure to get at the airport a few hours early before departure. But hey, that's only the logical thing to do.

So what's the exact rule? Less than 10k per person? Just checking that my girlfriend and I can go with <20k and have no troubles not declaring.

On January 20 2012 08:32 exalted wrote: So what's the exact rule? Less than 10k per person? Just checking that my girlfriend and I can go with <20k and have no troubles not declaring.

No. Even though that's the rule that makes the most sense, and that's the question asked by authorities and on the forms, apparently its not worth the risk. You either must declare or carry less than 10k total.

On January 20 2012 07:48 Twisted wrote: Show nested quote + On January 19 2012 18:54 NMcNasty wrote: ^no tax, but you may be pulled aside for questioning that might take a while. So get there early, declare and there's no problem? Sigh, poker players. If you know you have more than 10k why would you ever take the chance? If I had 20k on me.....

No one had more than 10k on them. The point is its ridiculous to assume the law pertains to the group you're traveling with and not just each person individually, since what constitutes your group or family can vary.

Copy of form

To be honest the form is clearer than I suspected, but I think a lot depends on how many forms they filled out. Its pretty clear its just a lazy idiot move if they only filled out one, though full seizure of their funds is still unjustified imo. If they did fill out more than one form their main mistake was admitting guilt too quickly. It still doesn't seem like there's any way it can be proven that they aren't just carrying their own money.

Here's the extra form you have to fill out when you declare:

http://www.fincen.gov/forms/files/fin105_cmir.pdf

On January 20 2012 11:14 NMcNasty wrote: Show nested quote + On January 20 2012 07:48 Twisted wrote:   On January 19 2012 18:54 NMcNasty wrote: ^no tax, but you may be pulled aside for questioning that might take a while. So get there early, declare and there's no problem? Sigh, poker players. If you know you have more than 10k why would you ever take the chance? If I had 20k on me..... No one had more than 10k on them. The point is its ridiculous to assume the law pertains to the group you're traveling with and not just each person individually, since what constitutes your group or family can vary.

Well I think it works like this. If each person in the group can prove how and where they got the money from and that it is theirs then they'd likely be able to keep it.

Like say all 3 of them cashed in the tournament for >9k then they'd probably all get to keep their money.

It's probably because only one of them could prove where he got his money from in that they could determine it was all his and just divided up.

Im actually curious, is you miss your flight due to 3h long investigation by retarded customs agent, are you getting any refund/ticket for next flight?

i came back to the states from greece 10 days ago and had 14k $ on me.
i didnt know what to do with that , so i just checked the box. they asked me in 3 different places at philly airport
about the money.i said im going to gamble with it playing poker and nothing stopped me.spent few hours checking
my luggages tho ;/

On January 20 2012 11:58 Defrag wrote: Im actually curious, is you miss your flight due to 3h long investigation by retarded customs agent, are you getting any refund/ticket for next flight?

yeah. i'm not sure if this was something where the airline agrees to cover for this type of thing or what. I was flying with Copa (Panama national airline) and customs instructed me to go see someone at the Copa Airline office in the airport and they instantly gave me a ticket for the next flight going to my destination. There was no refund/compensation but I did not have to pay anything more than I already had for the ticket. The next flight was in 7 hours though and I had to sleep on an airport floor until the next morning, I wasn't offered a hotel room or anything like that.

On January 20 2012 11:58 Defrag wrote: Im actually curious, is you miss your flight due to 3h long investigation by retarded customs agent, are you getting any refund/ticket for next flight?

very likely they will give you a free ticket for the next plane, i lost my connection due to the retarded long line in immigration and they sent me in the next plane.

On January 20 2012 17:01 Baalim wrote: Show nested quote + On January 20 2012 11:58 Defrag wrote: Im actually curious, is you miss your flight due to 3h long investigation by retarded customs agent, are you getting any refund/ticket for next flight? very likely they will give you a free ticket for the next plane, i lost my connection due to the retarded long line in immigration and they sent me in the next plane.

next time instead of just standing there just show ur ticket to an airport person and they will put u in the front of the line O_O

On January 20 2012 18:29 Rekrul wrote: Show nested quote + On January 20 2012 17:01 Baalim wrote:   On January 20 2012 11:58 Defrag wrote: Im actually curious, is you miss your flight due to 3h long investigation by retarded customs agent, are you getting any refund/ticket for next flight? very likely they will give you a free ticket for the next plane, i lost my connection due to the retarded long line in immigration and they sent me in the next plane. next time instead of just standing there just show ur ticket to an airport person and they will put u in the front of the line O_O

I know you can go to priority security lines when ur running late or skip ppl while documenting but this huge room in immigration had way over a thousand people, unbelievably crowded and chaotic, when i was getting my new ticket i asked the guy at the front desk and he told me that over 20 people lost the connection flight to bahamas, almost every non-americans.

On January 20 2012 20:57 RaSZi wrote: an overwhelming majority of the law enforcement system in the US is so stupid... They are the biggest assholes I have ever met in my life probably.

fyp

On January 20 2012 20:57 RaSZi wrote: Border patrol in the US is so stupid, even if you check the box for carrying over 10k, they will question you and might confiscate the money cause you are a poker player. They are the biggest assholes I have ever met in my life probably.

wtf thats possible, what if you claim you do something else, do you have to back i up with papers or something?

i don't play professionally or anything so correct me if I'm wrong but wouldn't it just be more efficient to set up international bank accounts if you traveled a lot and deposit your cash before crossing into another country? You could always use a check or e-check to transfer from one account to another.

On January 21 2012 19:39 Baalim wrote: Show nested quote + On January 20 2012 20:57 RaSZi wrote: Border patrol in the US is so stupid, even if you check the box for carrying over 10k, they will question you and might confiscate the money cause you are a poker player. They are the biggest assholes I have ever met in my life probably. wtf thats possible, what if you claim you do something else, do you have to back i up with papers or something?

uhh, wtf do you need more than 9,999.99 USD in cash? wtf people.

dolla dolla billz yo

aside - i have no sympathy for these people. it's obvious, claim your shit. i don't believe raszi for a second that "zomg poker players get robbed!!!', i believe it has moreso to do with retards not conforming to customs strict laws.

the people in question fucked up, and they got fucked. standard procedure.

yes, they're strict. deal with it. if you don't, prepare to get smacked.

On January 22 2012 05:04 devon06atX wrote: aside - i have no sympathy for these people. it's obvious, claim your shit. i don't believe raszi for a second that "zomg poker players get robbed!!!', i believe it has moreso to do with retards not conforming to customs strict laws. the people in question fucked up, and they got fucked. standard procedure. yes, they're strict. deal with it. if you don't, prepare to get smacked.

have u even read this topic? facepalm

On January 20 2012 20:57 RaSZi wrote: Border patrol in the US is so stupid, even if you check the box for carrying over 10k, they will question you and might confiscate the money cause you are a poker player. They are the biggest assholes I have ever met in my life probably.

raszi,

at the expense of looking douchey couldn't you just tell them to google you or something to verify you are a high stakes player? just curious if you've actually had a negative experience and tried to persuade them to pull your credentials.

On January 22 2012 04:27 K40Cheddar wrote: i don't play professionally or anything so correct me if I'm wrong but wouldn't it just be more efficient to set up international bank accounts if you traveled a lot and deposit your cash before crossing into another country? You could always use a check or e-check to transfer from one account to another.

so you are going to an LAPT brazil, you somehow open a brazilian account? wtf.

On January 22 2012 05:01 devon06atX wrote: Show nested quote + On January 21 2012 19:39 Baalim wrote:   On January 20 2012 20:57 RaSZi wrote: Border patrol in the US is so stupid, even if you check the box for carrying over 10k, they will question you and might confiscate the money cause you are a poker player. They are the biggest assholes I have ever met in my life probably. wtf thats possible, what if you claim you do something else, do you have to back i up with papers or something? uhh, wtf do you need more than 9,999.99 USD in cash? wtf people. dolla dolla billz yo

errr playing cashgames?... also not all tournaments accept PS money and you have to pay in cash for side events

On January 22 2012 18:07 Baalim wrote: Show nested quote + On January 22 2012 05:01 devon06atX wrote:   On January 21 2012 19:39 Baalim wrote:   On January 20 2012 20:57 RaSZi wrote: Border patrol in the US is so stupid, even if you check the box for carrying over 10k, they will question you and might confiscate the money cause you are a poker player. They are the biggest assholes I have ever met in my life probably. wtf thats possible, what if you claim you do something else, do you have to back i up with papers or something? uhh, wtf do you need more than 9,999.99 USD in cash? wtf people. dolla dolla billz yo errr playing cashgames?... also not all tournaments accept PS money and you have to pay in cash for side events

good point. never really thought about how hard it could be to access 'home funds' in some countries.

now i feel like a bit of an idiot

On January 22 2012 18:25 devon06atX wrote: Show nested quote + On January 22 2012 18:07 Baalim wrote:   On January 22 2012 05:01 devon06atX wrote:   On January 21 2012 19:39 Baalim wrote:   On January 20 2012 20:57 RaSZi wrote: Border patrol in the US is so stupid, even if you check the box for carrying over 10k, they will question you and might confiscate the money cause you are a poker player. They are the biggest assholes I have ever met in my life probably. wtf thats possible, what if you claim you do something else, do you have to back i up with papers or something? uhh, wtf do you need more than 9,999.99 USD in cash? wtf people. dolla dolla billz yo errr playing cashgames?... also not all tournaments accept PS money and you have to pay in cash for side events good point. never really thought about how hard it could be to access 'home funds' in some countries. now i feel like a bit of an idiot

lol yeah .

On January 22 2012 18:05 Baalim wrote: Show nested quote + On January 22 2012 04:27 K40Cheddar wrote: i don't play professionally or anything so correct me if I'm wrong but wouldn't it just be more efficient to set up international bank accounts if you traveled a lot and deposit your cash before crossing into another country? You could always use a check or e-check to transfer from one account to another. so you are going to an LAPT brazil, you somehow open a brazilian account? wtf.

Even if you don't open a brazilian account couldn't you arrange some sort of bank wire/credit card payment to cover your tournament costs? I don't really know how some of these big tournaments work but using electronic money through credit/debit cards and bank transfers seems a lot more convenient to me than carrying 10k cash in my pocket.

lol that is a pretty funny interaction and exactly how I would expect it to go based on the questions/your answers.

When you guys go to WSOP do you just try to get cash from other players when your there? Always wondered how euros bring over like $40k cash or a travellers cheque or what? How are you supposed to play the tourneys and sides games with under $10k.

LOL @ that convo raszi thats so gay

but yeah u have to be super polite 'yes sir' with a 'nice guy' tone (but not too meek) with these usa border fks and not question them at all or else u will get shit

i've actually been questioned AFTER i got through customs waiting for baggage claim some officer came up to me acting 'friendly' but was grilling me with questions.

so if someone was completely innocent of any wrongdoing but felt like being a dick to one of those border guys, what's the worst they can do to you?

I think they'd be nicer if they all got rid of that huge cock rammed up their ass...kinda hard to not be grouchy when you're that uncomfortable

i remember i was once traveling with my sister so im literally the last and only guy in the line, so as soon as my sis is done i walk straight to the booth and the guy stops me and makes me walk back to the yellow line and only after that he just calls me... ridiculous the power trip of those minimum wage assholes.

look at this guy...thinkin hes too good for the line

On January 25 2012 16:21 RaSZi wrote: Give you a lifetime ban from entering the United States of Freedom.

what if you're US citizen tho

they have stripped searched me before. i came back to usa from costa rica dressed in khakis and a polo, carrying only like $20 and they detain me for hours upon hours and ripped up a couple books looking for drugs and demanded to take me to a hospital for xrays. they were complete scum. i hope they die in a grease fire. they are a horrible representation of the usa

flew into orlando btw

On January 26 2012 18:01 chris wrote: they have stripped searched me before. i came back to usa from costa rica dressed in khakis and a polo, carrying only like $20 and they detain me for hours upon hours and ripped up a couple books looking for drugs and demanded to take me to a hospital for xrays. they were complete scum. i hope they die in a grease fire. they are a horrible representation of the usa

what in the fuck

jeez fuck USA...

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/19/...warning-high-stakes-travelers-398198/

land of the free

Have any of you gone through the bomb-residue detector?

They put you in a transparent tiny cabin and tell you that its going to make some sounds, to not get scared... and holy shit many loud bangs and compressed air being shot in your face, of course i got scared.