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Greece to raise gambling tax to 35%!

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Garfed   Malta. May 26 2016 22:09. Posts 4818

Greece is trying to bring in more cash from taxes per year, so the Greek government is pushing forward with its plan to increase the tax implemented on its licensed online gambling operators from already insanely high rate of 30% up to 35%.

This latest gambling bill was approved last weekend and the Greek parliament hopes it will raise the current profits and deter any foreign operators from entering its country market.

The government said the new tax was “absolutely necessary” in order for the country to qualify for another wave of bailout funds from international entities. Newly imposed loan sanctions by the EU now require Greece to meet a 3.5% surplus on its budget by raising an additional €1.5 billion in taxes.

Aside from online gambling, the Greek government is also expected to impose similar fee increases for operators working within the heating oil, automotive, e-cigarette, pay-TV, coffee, luxury goods and alcohol industries.

The new 35% rate on online gambling duty is expected to be implemented at the beginning of 2017, meaning all 24 of Greece’s licensed international online gambling operators will need to re-apply if they want to continue serving Greek customers after the end of 2016.

This new application process, which seeks to replace all 24 temporary permits with permanent versions valid until the end of 2021, is rumoured to include one catch though – upfront fees of around €3 million for each operator.

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 Last edit: 27/05/2016 11:44

shootair   United States. May 27 2016 01:56. Posts 430

I'm moving to greece next month. If anyone wants to join, hmu!


nolan   Ireland. May 27 2016 03:41. Posts 6205

I really don't understand how struggling economies always seek to raise taxes to fix things.

A huge part of Greece's economic fuckup was that people already were dodging taxes more than usual. All this is going to do is make the bookie industry boom even more.

Just seems really naively optimistic, you see this time and again where governments raise a tax with a 'projected revenue' without factoring the human element that when you raise a sales/luxury tax a large % of people just do what they have to in order to move around it. See: Half of NYC smokers going to Pennsylvania to buy cigarettes en masse once a month.

On September 08 2008 10:07 Baal wrote: my head is a gyroscope, your argument is invalid 

Mortensen8   Chad. May 27 2016 06:49. Posts 1841

Rear naked woke 

uiCk   Canada. May 27 2016 07:42. Posts 3521

Lol ^


But on a serious note , the point of this , on economic pov, is that taxes (or tariffs) usually tend to have the effect of discouraging (or limiting) the given activity (which on another tangent, is why some people belive that taxes discourage employment/buisness)
So they (banks) want people to spend what they have on more economic valuable products who have greater positive economic impact then what they are targeting as luxury products (which can be rightly debated as being producta that produce less employment, have high costs and low returns on investement for the consumer/greek citize ). Although i dont understand the heating oil one, im assuming without actually lookong into it, is that most these products are not local prosuction and that there is some form of protectionism involved in these policies.

Yes it might be optimistic, and yes black markets will form, but greece is right now, more or less IMO an experiment ground for macro economic policies and systems.

The cigarette example nolan talked about is more or less valid. Quebec is notorious for black market smokes being product of high prices, but overall (mixed in eith other restrictions on tabacoo visibility/accessibility) the strategy works, given (i belive) that smokers have diminished overall wherever higher prices where implemented. Im sure there are valid numbers for this, ill gladly accept im wrong if proven otherwise.

Tabacoo & gov intervention:
http://web.worldbank.org/WBSITE/EXTER...~piPK:216618~theSitePK:376601,00.html

I wish one of your guys had children if I could kick them in the fucking head or stomp on their testicles so you can feel my pain because thats the pain I have waking up everyday -- Mike TysonLast edit: 27/05/2016 07:46

Spitfiree   Bulgaria. May 27 2016 11:28. Posts 9634


  On May 27 2016 02:41 nolan wrote:
I really don't understand how struggling economies always seek to raise taxes to fix things.


Following bad economy theories thats why


Baalim   Mexico. May 27 2016 11:34. Posts 34246

Taxations function is to take money away from the economy to provide services like education, transportation, security, healthcare etc.


When an economy is performing badly you should reduce these services and lower taxes, take a hit on the quality of life for a while so that the economy can grow again and when you stabilize you can tax an invest again, to increase taxes while your economy is tanking is the perfect recipe for a disaster.

This might sound over simplistic but it actually is that simple, its just that loans and bailouts make this effect much more difficult to see, you can keep providing services and subdidizing crap making the economy grow but getting a huge debt in the process and later on, that debt crushes you if the economy doesnt recover at the needed rate, and people really dont really know wtf happened since it was a delayed effect.

Ex-PokerStars Team Pro OnlineLast edit: 27/05/2016 11:35

uiCk   Canada. May 27 2016 13:58. Posts 3521


  On May 27 2016 10:34 Baalim wrote:
Taxations function is to take money away from the economy to provide services like education, transportation, security, healthcare etc.


When an economy is performing badly you should reduce these services and lower taxes, take a hit on the quality of life for a while so that the economy can grow again and when you stabilize you can tax an invest again, to increase taxes while your economy is tanking is the perfect recipe for a disaster.

This might sound over simplistic but it actually is that simple, its just that loans and bailouts make this effect much more difficult to see, you can keep providing services and subdidizing crap making the economy grow but getting a huge debt in the process and later on, that debt crushes you if the economy doesnt recover at the needed rate, and people really dont really know wtf happened since it was a delayed effect.



How does an economy magical grow by itself exactly?

How do you grow an economy without investing in it?
You are assuming all economies automatically always grow if you dont interfere with them. (Which is false ofc)

Also your view on taxes is also simplistic. Like i said earlier , one function of taxes/tarifs is also to discourage or move certain economic activities to other fields.

I wish one of your guys had children if I could kick them in the fucking head or stomp on their testicles so you can feel my pain because thats the pain I have waking up everyday -- Mike TysonLast edit: 27/05/2016 14:01

dnagardi   Hungary. May 27 2016 17:46. Posts 1776


  On May 27 2016 10:34 Baalim wrote:
Taxations function is to take money away from the economy to provide services like education, transportation, security, healthcare etc.


When an economy is performing badly you should reduce these services and lower taxes, take a hit on the quality of life for a while so that the economy can grow again and when you stabilize you can tax an invest again, to increase taxes while your economy is tanking is the perfect recipe for a disaster.

This might sound over simplistic but it actually is that simple, its just that loans and bailouts make this effect much more difficult to see, you can keep providing services and subdidizing crap making the economy grow but getting a huge debt in the process and later on, that debt crushes you if the economy doesnt recover at the needed rate, and people really dont really know wtf happened since it was a delayed effect.



mr phd in economics, you should run the country.

i love how you always have a very solid view on every subject and state your oppinion as the one and only true facts


redrain0125   Canada. May 27 2016 18:18. Posts 5455


  On May 27 2016 16:46 dnagardi wrote:
Show nested quote +



mr phd in economics, you should run the country.

i love how you always have a very solid view on every subject and state your oppinion as the one and only true facts


standard Baal stuff


lebowski   Greece. May 27 2016 19:42. Posts 9205

they can't (for the most part) collect the ridiculous 30% the way they do things right now, unless something else changes they won't be able to collect 35% either.
The upfront fees might play a role here, this could be a move to force the cardrooms to be their collectors more actively

new shit has come to light... a-and... shit! man... 

Stroggoz   New Zealand. May 27 2016 20:44. Posts 5290


  On May 27 2016 10:34 Baalim wrote:
Taxations function is to take money away from the economy to provide services like education, transportation, security, healthcare etc.


When an economy is performing badly you should reduce these services and lower taxes, take a hit on the quality of life for a while so that the economy can grow again and when you stabilize you can tax an invest again, to increase taxes while your economy is tanking is the perfect recipe for a disaster.

This might sound over simplistic but it actually is that simple, its just that loans and bailouts make this effect much more difficult to see, you can keep providing services and subdidizing crap making the economy grow but getting a huge debt in the process and later on, that debt crushes you if the economy doesnt recover at the needed rate, and people really dont really know wtf happened since it was a delayed effect.

this is contrary to economic theory, during a recession you have to spend more so businesses can continue selling goods. If people stop spending , business stop selling, and it creates a vicious cycle. Over 90 percent of the bailout simply went to german and french bankers anyway.

One of 3 non decent human beings on a site of 5 people with between 2-3 decent human beings 

shootair   United States. May 27 2016 21:57. Posts 430


  On May 27 2016 17:18 redrain0125 wrote:
Show nested quote +



standard Baal stuff


He feels the need to always prove himself


Baalim   Mexico. May 28 2016 02:12. Posts 34246


  On May 27 2016 12:58 uiCk wrote:
Show nested quote +



How does an economy magical grow by itself exactly?

How do you grow an economy without investing in it?
You are assuming all economies automatically always grow if you dont interfere with them. (Which is false ofc)

Also your view on taxes is also simplistic. Like i said earlier , one function of taxes/tarifs is also to discourage or move certain economic activities to other fields.



How does an economy in general grow? is that your question? because you are either making a point in a dumb rhetorical question or are you asking me economics 101?

I mean when all the economic sector is allowed to have a higher profit margin it generates reinvestment higher wages etc in general is a better situation for the economy at the expense of less income for the government.

Private citizens invest in their private business, the economy does not require a state to run, in fact it is a big deadweight for it with taxation.

So your idea is that overtaxing luxury businesses you archive what? you think you relocate capital into businesses that prive more jobs? jobs are only a result of the economy is not a solution but a byproduct of an actual solution, thats why the government employing a lot of people (bureocrats etc) who dont produce anything is a terrible thing for the economy and its sadly done sooo often to "create jobs" which arent true jobs, its just a hand out who doesnt help the economy.

Ex-PokerStars Team Pro Online 

Baalim   Mexico. May 28 2016 02:14. Posts 34246


  On May 27 2016 16:46 dnagardi wrote:
Show nested quote +



mr phd in economics, you should run the country.

i love how you always have a very solid view on every subject and state your oppinion as the one and only true facts


thats what knowing stuff does, you usually have an formed opinion on many subjects you are absolutely right to debate me and point where Im wrong instead of your weak sarcasm

Ex-PokerStars Team Pro Online 

Baalim   Mexico. May 28 2016 02:20. Posts 34246


  On May 27 2016 19:44 Stroggoz wrote:
Show nested quote +

this is contrary to economic theory, during a recession you have to spend more so businesses can continue selling goods. If people stop spending , business stop selling, and it creates a vicious cycle. Over 90 percent of the bailout simply went to german and french bankers anyway.


Exactly that is my point, in a recession you need liquidity on the streets, and how do you do that? the best way is to reduce taxation so people purchasing power and businesses profit margins are bigger, another one is the good old fiat favourite, fuck around with the money supply and try find the sweet spot where hyperinflation doesn't fuck you even harder than the recession, sadly it happens often because governments care about their term not the next one.


But again that is exactly what im suggesting... increase liquidity, sacrifice services and qualify of life until the economy is stable.

Ex-PokerStars Team Pro Online 

uiCk   Canada. May 28 2016 03:06. Posts 3521

[


  In general, however, since a luxury good has a high income elasticity of demand by definition, both the income effect and substitution effect will decrease demand sharply as the tax rises




  Luxury tax is based on the concept of positional goods, which are scarce goods whose value arises as status symbols largely from their ranking against other positional goods. This creates a zero-sum game in which the absolute amount of goods purchased is less relevant than the absolute amount of money spent on them and their relative positions. Agents competing in such a game for pure positional goods do not lose utility if some of this money is taken as tax, because their utility comes as status from the amount of money (displayed to be) spent rather than the use-value of the goods themselves. For a pure positional good, a luxury tax is the perfect form of taxation because it raises revenue without any adverse utility effects.[1]


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luxury_tax


Two things that happen here
A) most people who can afford luxury goods are already paying a premium for said luxury good, so an increase does usually little difference to this consumer -> more taxes collected
B) the more price sensitive ones will shift habits and consume diferent products (that might be and probably are more beneficial )

I wish one of your guys had children if I could kick them in the fucking head or stomp on their testicles so you can feel my pain because thats the pain I have waking up everyday -- Mike TysonLast edit: 28/05/2016 06:07

uiCk   Canada. May 28 2016 03:29. Posts 3521

Who cares

I wish one of your guys had children if I could kick them in the fucking head or stomp on their testicles so you can feel my pain because thats the pain I have waking up everyday -- Mike TysonLast edit: 28/05/2016 06:07

uiCk   Canada. May 28 2016 04:30. Posts 3521

Who cares

I wish one of your guys had children if I could kick them in the fucking head or stomp on their testicles so you can feel my pain because thats the pain I have waking up everyday -- Mike TysonLast edit: 28/05/2016 06:07

uiCk   Canada. May 28 2016 06:24. Posts 3521


  On May 28 2016 01:20 Baalim wrote:
Show nested quote +



Exactly that is my point, in a recession you need liquidity on the streets, and how do you do that? the best way is to reduce taxation so people purchasing power and businesses profit margins are bigger, another one is the good old fiat favourite, fuck around with the money supply and try find the sweet spot where hyperinflation doesn't fuck you even harder than the recession, sadly it happens often because governments care about their term not the next one.


But again that is exactly what im suggesting... increase liquidity, sacrifice services and qualify of life until the economy is stable.


Lol hi austrian school of garbage economics. Back to youtube young lad.

I wish one of your guys had children if I could kick them in the fucking head or stomp on their testicles so you can feel my pain because thats the pain I have waking up everyday -- Mike TysonLast edit: 28/05/2016 06:25

 
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