Please give me a working luckbox...by Kilay, August 22
I've been running so bad lately, it all started out at my shot on 50NL and it just keeps on going. I already cashed 300$ so I got my initial deposit and a little extra already out of my roll so I am basically freerolling. Still it's so annoying to just not catch any break and keeping getting sucked out on.
In my last session today I got a set crushed by a runner Flush (ATo on 983hh board, I had 99) and another overpair killed by a flopped flushdraw (I know, kind of standard) and got it in on the turn and got there on the river. And after those beats tonight I just started tilt shoving for my last orbit on every table and I even won back two buy-ins that way. When you think of it, it's probably hilarious...
Notice the last part where I started tilt shoving and insta-won 2 buy-ins...
I know, all whine, whine, whine, so standard and crap like that... True but this has been going on for a solid two weeks now and it feels like it's never going to end... I know, more whine, whine but writing it down helps me a little bit so I thought might as well write it down here and let people get a laugh out of it, right ??
Btw, I am going to make a video of myself playing very soon (not now though because I am totally NOT in the right mood to play a good solid game right now, note: the tilt shoving) so it'd be really cool if you guys would have a look at it and note some leaks once I got it made.
Well, I hope you all have more luck on tables, later, Kilay
This is a semi-bump, semi new post. I made a in depth blog post yesterday which I thought was pretty good but it didn't get that many views, so this bump is in the hope that people scroll down and check it out. I also found 2 vids I wanna post. One is Olbermann following my lead (haha jk) on the POW card and houses shit, and the other is the "Fabulous Life of John McCain"
So please scroll down and check out the blog post below!
Good evening!
This summer i have put a lot of effor playing poker, but to say the least the whole summer was epic fail. Basically, i would really apreciate if someone could observe my play for like 1 hour and make notes on leaks or whatever, i believe my play is fine, i don't think i need coaching, just i must regain confidence and i need someone to confirm that i am just running bad, because i gave up all my hopes, ambitions and motivation on poker, don't feel like winning again...
So if anyone has some free time i would be really happy to hear constructive opinion about my play!
well anyway thanks in advance
Well I'm officially back to playing online poker -.-;
or will be after eChecks are all good [depositing is a bitch now on stars!]
Anyways I'll deposit like 2k for 100NL and see where I am in a month.
So far I have like 200 still in my account xD
P.S. I just put in my 2 week notice at the bank :D IM ALMOST A FREE MAN weeeee
College in January. Accepted + Ready to roll the fuck out.
Getting out of my lease also
Oh ya and now single and has a $2,000.00 Engagement Ring for sale... ANY TAKERS!?!? :O
It's been a while since I posted a blog. The months right before WSOP I hardly played poker or did anything except tennis and XBOX, so that demotivated me a bit to blog. During WSOP I was exhausted and I had a rough schedule, so nothing really happened there either, sorry about that. However, I'm getting myself in grind mode again, plus the new site Pokernews Strategy is gonna be launched soon. For people that haven't heard about it, you can check it our here:
It's gonna be an instructional site, with Patrik Antonius, Chris Lee (Genius28), Corwin Mackey (mig.com) and myself as the main instructors. Of course you can be expecting lots of video's from others as well, but this would be our starting group. What I think makes us different, is that all the sites say that they give out all their secrets and then u see a lot of the same stuff or a lot of lower no limit videos. Also the main instructors post videos as irregular as 1 vid every 5-6 weeks in some cases. Antonius will be uploading a nice consistent stream of videos and also of highstakes! So stay tuned. Also our apologies for launching later than expected. We wanted to launch before the Main Event, but as that moment neared we realized it was gonna be close. The decision then was to do it exactly how we wanted it and make it what looks and works best for everyone, hence the delay. This time it will definitely be within a week or 2 from launch.
WSOP
Vegas is not good for me. At least when I'm living out of my suitcase. It's a very rough schedule and I don't have a lot of rest. Not only at night, but also mentally. It wears you down and becomes mentally challenging. Of course it would be different when you run hot or have some good results, then being tired is fine. When you lose and you're tired, it's hell . I had a rough WSOP, with a couple of huge stacks that got minimized in unfortunate ways, and sometimes mistakes by me. Even though the good results weren't there, I did learn and realize a lot. I improved greatly since last years WSOP, mainly when it comes to patience and shortstack tournament play. This is something I really had to learn. I was reading live updates after I got knocked out and I noticed every time it said: RaSZi loses big pot, it would say RaSzi busted 3 posts later. I figured there's no coincidence there, so I tried working on that, and I'm happy with the result. I did almost make the final table of the 1500$ shoot-out event, finishing 3rd at the second to last table.
Another thing i was really happy with, was beating CTS in the 2nd round of the 10k HU tournament. He is one of the sickest heads up players worldwide, so I wasn't too thrilled about drawing him. When they announced: 'If you wanna know who you are playing in the next round if you win your match, just look to the other side of the table. You're playing the winner of that match.' I look over to see CTS playing BrynKenny, are you serious?!?! I ended up drawing CTS, but I kinda had a freeroll idea. He is a better player than me, but I'm good enough to beat him, especially in a single heads up sng. So I did and I was thrilled, only to lose against a much weaker person in the next round, yugh. I learned a lot, but yay variance.
The best thing about Vegas was definitely 'meeting' my new girlfriend, Evelyn Ng. We already met two years ago in Vegas and got along great, but nothing specific. The past year we have been talking a lot online and we have a lot of things in common. I went to hang out at the charity barbecues for Phil Ivey's charity foundation, where Evelyn organized a Guitar Hero tournament for charity. In the week after we saw each other daily and we're going out since then. I actually stayed in Vegas for 2 extra weeks. So i came back from Vegas a winner in the end ~ :D.
Tennis
Ok, that was a quick wrap-up of what I've been up to. I'm back in Europe now and Im feeling better and better. Ive suffered from Vertigo for a while, but that's gone now too. Also I picked up tennis again! I actually had to play a doubles match 2 days ago. It was the first time in 8 years (!) I had to play an official match again. My partner was Bas de Zeeuw, with whom I play a lot. Him and his girlfriend Lies, really good too, are really cool and they are always up for some tennis, which is nice. We had to play at midnight, yes i know, in a city close to Rotterdam. We play in catagory 4 ( no idea what that would be internationally) and won! I was nervous as hell, but Bas kept me relaxed and we won 7-5 6-1. Jaco is making a lot of video's today and he shot this:
He also did an after-match interview, in which I'm exhausted. I wasn't used to the tension and exhaustion official matches can bring. I noticed a lot of people on the pokernews forum, if you like to see inside movies, Jaco posts them on http://www.blogmysport.tv/ You can also find blogs of Dutch athletes there. Hollaaa.
I'm playing again tonight, August 22nd at LTC Spijkenisse at 9 pm. People were asking me about it and some wanted to come watch, so there . Would be fun if people came, especially now that I am less nervous lol. Interview after match:
Talking about sports, shoutout to Fatima Moreira de Melo (wut) for winning gold medal at the olympics womens field hockey event today! I met her beginning this year and I'm really happy for her and she deserves it. Also, Thiemo de Bakker, a dutch tennis talent, is playing a tournament in Italy and just won the first set in his 3rd round match. He is 19 and ranked around 200 in the world, on his way up. Flippie~
Guitar Hero
I've been thinking about the subjects on my blog, but then I realized, this is my blog and what happens in my life. I don't mean to sound like an asshole, but if you don't like it, just skip the paragraphs you don't like :D. I play this game a lot and I love it, so I wanna spew it on my blog too. I've been making some movies which you can find in my youtube channel:
Here is an example video of me playing Don't Speak by No Doubt:
I will definitely keep uploading videos I found on youtube on my blog. Just random or impressive shit I come across on the interwebs.
Poker
I haven't played online in ages. I was sick for about 3 weeks and I needed to get some energy back. I feel good now again so I started playing. I wanna get into shape again and learn how to grind so I started out 15-tabling 2-4 No limit. I played 13k hands first day and 6k hands yesterday, so I'm started out well. I'll be playing it a lot and also I'll be recording a lot of videos this weekend. I'll save my interesting hands to post once in a while.
I hope you guys will enjoy my blog, comments and questions are welcome as usual.. see ya.
This movie is the nuts. These two guys were raising a lion cub from birth, before releasing it in the wild. They wanted to see Christian the Lion again, so they went and looked for him TWO YEARS later. This is after Christian spent 2 years in the wild. Little dangerous if you ask me. Watch and enjoy.
worst fuckin hangover everrrrrrrrrrr. it's just epic. i feel worse than a piece of shit. and every fkin time i take aspirin i start puking like a bulimic model. ughhhhhhh
my favourite thing in worldby angryfishes, August 22
Going all in getting ur money in good 200bb deep. Then getting raped beyond recognition. Its like somewhere up there god said lets see him get sucked out in the most hilarious way. hahahaha!!! KK VS AA? Lets give my opponemt a 9, a 10, a j and a Q!! funny right! lolZzlzlzZL!!
Submitted by : angryfishes
Game #6512023503: Hold'em NL (£0.10/£0.20) - 2008/08/22 - 12:52:48 (UK)
Table "Dagotep" Seat 2 is the button.
Seat 1: Hero (£49.65 in chips)
Seat 2: Lilabner sits out
Seat 3: Sindr0107 (£36.16 in chips)
Seat 4: Ada271213 (£14.90 in chips)
Seat 5: Houchen1 (£21.06 in chips)
Seat 6: jackQKA sits out
Sindr0107: posts small blind £0.10
Ada271213: posts big blind £0.20
Holecards(Odds) dealt to Hero
Houchen1: calls £0.20
Hero : raises to £1
Sindr0107: raises to £3
Ada271213: folds
Houchen1: folds
Hero : raises to £9
Sindr0107: raises to £36.16 and is all-in
Hero : calls £27.16
Showdown Sindr0107: shows (A Straight, King high)
Hero : shows (A Pair of Aces, Queen high)
Sindr0107 collected £70.72 from Main pot
Summary Total pot £72.72 Main pot £70.72 Rake £2
Board
Seat 1: Hero showed and lost with A Pair of Aces, Queen high
Seat 3: Sindr0107 (small blind) showed and won (£70.72) with A Straight, King high
Seat 4: Ada271213 (big blind) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: Houchen1 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
==================
and my personal favourite, KA vs Q6.
How about letting me pair my king on the flop and give him 2 pair on the river? Sound good?? yup! loLzlZozl!!
Submitted by : angryfishes
PokerStars Game #19806662571: Hold'em No Limit ($0.10/$0.25) - 2008/08/22 - 07:52:44 (ET)
Table 'Pulcova III' 6-max Seat #3 is the button
Seat 1: kamikaze 55 ($44.70 in chips)
Seat 2: michiwurst ($23.75 in chips)
Seat 3: Airija ($30.40 in chips)
Seat 4: b1grich ($40.55 in chips)
Seat 5: Hero ($27.60 in chips)
Seat 6: FAustuxXP ($10.35 in chips)
b1grich: posts small blind $0.10
Hero : posts big blind $0.25
Holecards(Odds) Dealt to Hero
FAustuxXP: folds
kamikaze 55: folds
michiwurst: raises $1.50 to $1.75
Airija: folds
b1grich: folds
Hero : raises $2.75 to $4.50
michiwurst: raises $10 to $14.50
Hero : raises $13.10 to $27.60 and is all-in
michiwurst: calls $9.25 and is all-in
Uncalled bet ($3.85) returned to Hero
Showdown Hero : shows (a pair of Kings)
michiwurst: shows (two pair, Queens and Sixes)
michiwurst collected $45.25 from pot
Summary Total pot $47.60 | Rake $2.35
Board
Seat 1: kamikaze 55 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 2: michiwurst showed and won ($45.25) with two pair, Queens and Sixes
Seat 3: Airija (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: b1grich (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 5: Hero (big blind) showed and lost with a pair of Kings
Seat 6: FAustuxXP folded before Flop (didn't bet)
another different 2 hands i posted on the forum 200bb deep again. lol?!
anway ive had a revelation a few days ago and im like the god of 6 max micro stakes now. see my bb! WHO WANTS COACHING?! i find the games now ridiculously easy whereas a couple of weeks ago i was struglling at stars.
So i just played in a $2 nl 2-7 wcoop proving grounds tournament for 8 hours where stars is testing their tournament structures for the wcoop events that are new and they are requesting feedback about them. I wrote stars an email where I find the bottom to be really interesting in terms of suggestions and if you like the idea you should email them about it too.
Hey guys I just played in your $2 wcoop proving grounds tournament semi-regretfully because I didn't see what I was getting myself into. I played for 8 hours straight and came in 8th place after eventually getting frustrated and actually getting it in with the best although I know it was misplayed. First of all, I realize that most of the feedback you're probably gonna get here is mostly worthless because it's a $2 tournament however if there is some way you can check my history you can see that I'm a winner and have a huge huge amount of experience playing even if I never made the big times.
With all of that said the structure of your tournament is sick. It's really geared in such a deepstack way that I'm pretty sure you're gonna see only really high quality players @ your final table. This is really good in my opinion but I think at the same time you're gonna see a 18+ hour tournament which would be very acceptable in say a $5k buyin tournament but for a $215 tournament I think that this is really bad. If that's something that you guys are going for I guess it's fine but I'm pretty sure you know your time windows and how long approximately things should last. In my own opinion as a poker player 12 hours is grueling and probably sufficient and anything after that should start to be considered for multiple day events.
Just my own two cents on the whole situation
gl with your wcoop and you guys should run wcoop main event proving grounds for like $100 or something cause I love deepstacked tournaments and I know I have huge edges there.
Actually, What if you guys ran tournaments that started @ the same identical time to every wcoop event with the same structures but on a much smaller scale buyin wise. Like instead of $215 how about $21.50 or something along those lines. I think that would be really actually quite attractive to most of the microstakes guys in a contrast similar to the sunday 200g and the sunday million. You could even add competitions with prizes based on TLB scores in the regular and smaller buyin tournaments for the entire series which also would be _extremely_ cool and probably promote some revenue as guys who normally wouldn't play in a razz tournament might find himself in it just to scrape together some points.
I love you guys at stars and you're awesome
Caleb "tehskies" Gunter
such a bad beat playing in a $2 deepstack though i made $5 for 8 hours of work, fuck my life.
In America, we have 400 million citizens. 31,000 people die from gun related incidents every year. 55% are from suicide. That means that 17,000 people are murdered by guns.
"The 31 states that have "shall issue" laws allowing private citizens to carry concealed weapons have, on average...a 19 percent lower murder rate"
So in states that have concealed carry... 19% lower murder rates. Nationwide this would mean that 3,240 lives would be saved with the murder rate was lower and in states where the murder rate is lower there are concealed carry licenses.
Polar bears can swim steadily for many hours in order to get from one piece of ice to another. They have water-repellent coat and partially webbed feet, which both are adaptations to swimming. Although known individual bears have only been recorded swimming about 100 km or so, they are likely capable of swimming much further if necessary.
suck a dick you propaganda feeding al gore bitch. wtf.
States that allow registered citizens to carry concealed weapons have lower crime rates than those that don't.
True. The 31 states that have "shall issue" laws allowing private citizens to carry concealed weapons have, on average, a 24 percent lower violent crime rate, a 19 percent lower murder rate and a 39 percent lower robbery rate than states that forbid concealed weapons. In fact, the nine states with the lowest violent crime rates are all right-to-carry states. Remarkably, guns are used for self-defense more than 2 million times a year, three to five times the estimated number of violent crimes committed with guns.
god i can't believe i used to be this flaming homo liberal...not saying i'm conservative, i think conservatives are closed minded idiots afraid of change, but liberals don't even make sense
i dont know why im doing this, but i just went out and bought "how to practice the way to a meaningful life" by dalai lama and "an open heartracticing compassion in everyday life" by the dalai lama
i plan to read these while playing some poker and i guess while not also, and pokerwise my roll has gone 2550----->1900 over the past 15k hands; pokerev says thats about exactly how below average s-bucks i am. but i dont want to be someone who sways with their run, esp i dont really trust pokerev to be the end all measure of how good i run since it doesnt really say anything about setups and shit, or how badly im playing.
so ummm, cheers folks hopefully ill stop being so pessimistic
So I've made the switch to 100% cg right now. After having the worst summer of my life both poker-wise and irl. I had the worst tournament run in my life making 1-2 FT in like 300 tournaments - beyond horrible.
I have/had a bunch of things irl that didnt go my way and it sucked ass.
Now onto things, sOah staked me for one session of NL200.
So I kept $1000 to start off playing NL50 on stars. Well the hud fucked up, and I was down to $825 so I got money back on FTP and proceeded to play cash there.
so my cashout didn't come through. if you read my last blog, i said i would probably quit poker, but with the extra cash now i couldn't beat the temptation to play again so i played some 10nl, ran like god, and i'm rolled for 25nl!! woohoo!! great.. i was actually going to study hard this semester but i guess i just run bad at life in general, seeing as how this poker thing just getting ready to ruin yet another semester for me.
oh by the way, one bright side of life is that i'm somehow working out/running every day and results are actually beginning to show =D
well that's a nice way to wrap up this summer i suppose... i traveled all across the states, spent thousands of my parents' money and poker wise, i cashed out 1k and i'm more or less right back to where i started the summer.. 25nl. haha...
I'm so sick of the fucking POW card. Sick and tired of it. Anytime McCain does something wrong they say "he was a POW and tortured, leave him alone". When you try to say that POW experience doesn't qualify him for being president people lose their shit as if you're questioning his patriotism or whether he was a hero. I totally agree with General Wesley Clark when he said "Well I don't think riding in a fighter plan and getting shot down is a qualification to be president."
Wesley Clark's Statement
Now McCain can't remember HOW MANY HOUSES HE HAS, and what do they do? McCain's campaign plays the fucking POW card again and say "This is a guy who lived in one house for five and a half years -- in prison."
Yep, so even though he can't remember how many he has, and when he asks his aides they tell him 4, even though he has 7, it's all good, forget about it, he is a POW and you best not be questioning McCain on anythin.
See all of McCain's Houses
I'm tired of it. I'm sick of it. I'm angry about it. And I'm not going to be scared to say shit about McCain because he was a POW, and I'm not going to give his POW status more credit than it deserves. Yes it's pretty fucking hardcore to survive that shit. I give him props for that. But surviving a POW camp 30 years ago and running the country right now are 2 different things. His policies of today are way different than his policies of 8 years ago, so why should I think what he did 30 years ago reflects how he will act now? The character that I assumed he would have developed from that experience hasn't shown it's face lately as he has gone from the straight talking moderate to a manipulating,smearing, fear mongering conservative so that he can win this election and appeal to the far right.
The other thing that drives me crazy is how McCain made a point about how he doesn't want to talk about Vietnam, how he didn't want to make his POW story what his campaign was about, but he's done the exact opposite and turned the POW story into his entire narrative. McCain is saying that he's a war hero cause of his POW experience and HE puts his country first, while Obama is an elitist snob who is willing to lose a war to win an election. That's McCain's story and I call BULL-FUCKING-SHIT on it. He went from saying "oh I don't want to talk about my POW experience" to using it as the answer to several of the questions at the Saddleback forum and playing it as a trump card whenever he fucks up. "Yeah, he can't remember how many houses he has, but forget about that, HE'S A WAR HERO! HE WAS A POW! RESPECT DAT!"
So he went from this:
In his first presidential campaign, eight years ago, John McCain went out of his way to avoid talking about his military background. Four years ago, when John Kerry campaigned in part on his military service, McCain criticized him for it, saying he was “sick and tired of re-fighting the Vietnam War.” McCain even disparaged Kerry personally, saying his emphasis on his military record is “clearly a tactical or strategic move.”
To this:
McCain's Cross Story @ Saddleback
It reminds me of that Jib-Jab video from 2004 with Kerry always saying "I have 3 purple hearts!" Now I feel like it's McCain screaming "I was a POW and I'm a war hero!" as if that's the only fucking thing that matters.
I'm sticking with Obama, cause like me he has 1 house, and like me he grew up without a father, and like me he experimented with drugs in his teen years but then got his head on straight, and like me he took on loans to pay for college, and like me he spent time working in the community, and like me he has lived in other parts of the world and seen serious poverty first hand.... Obama is a hell of a lot more like me than McCain is and I'm sick of this constant effort by the GOP to say that he's "different". They're trying to paint a question mark over his head and say "you don't know him, he's different, stick with the guy you know, vote McCain!"
I'm not scared of a black man with a funky name, so it's not going to work on me. Obama 08 is thx.
I enjoyed this clip of Obama talking about all of this house and economy shit, so I'll close with it.
And this is what I sit down to - the horror. A 4 buyin loss in about 300 hands. I played well but just got raped over and over again. Here are my top 10 winning hands and then top 10 losing hands. Notice the All in EV on the far right... the pain. (this is @ NL50)
And here are the 4 biggest losing hands. Notice how my 5th biggest losing hand was only $11.50. Overall I was doing well avoiding big pots without a good hand, but I was also getting no action on the few good hands I made.
Showdown allen6786: shows (two pair, Sevens and Fives)
k2o4 : mucks hand
allen6786 collected $98.25 from pot
Summary Total pot $100.25 | Rake $2
Board
Seat 1: k2o4 (button) mucked
Seat 2: olifant 12 (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 3: allen6786 (big blind) showed and won ($98.25) with two pair, Sevens and Fives
Seat 4: aky9999 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
k2o4 : checks
Marty2773: bets $9.50
k2o4 : raises $34.60 to $44.10 and is all-in
Marty2773: calls $29.90 and is all-in
Uncalled bet ($4.70) returned to k2o4
River (Pot : $99.30)
Showdown k2o4 : shows (a pair of Kings)
Marty2773: shows (two pair, Aces and Queens)
Marty2773 collected $96.30 from pot
Summary Total pot $99.30 | Rake $3
Board
Seat 1: k2o4 (small blind) showed and lost with a pair of Kings
Seat 2: olifant 12 (big blind) folded before Flop
Seat 3: allen6786 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: Darby23 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: jeffnwl folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: Marty2773 (button) showed and won ($96.30) with two pair, Aces and Queens
Showdown k2o4 : shows (two pair, Queens and Jacks)
rth1: shows (three of a kind, Queens)
rth1 collected $97.50 from pot
Summary Total pot $100.50 | Rake $3
Board
Seat 1: phishkiller folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 2: I_Pown_Lives folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: I80PROOF folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: 1Bunn (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: k2o4 (small blind) showed and lost with two pair, Queens and Jacks
Seat 6: rth1 (big blind) showed and won ($97.50) with three of a kind, Queens
I quit for the night after the 4th buyin was lost. Gay. hopefully tonight goes better!
After some nice Nl100 HU results i went back to 6max cashgame today
Hm i still havent really figured out how to cursh it >-<
currently i am beating it for ~ 4.0 BB/100 on average which is not too bad
however i am not really satisfied
Overall my NL50 hourly is a little higher than my NL100 hourly which sucks
I play 6table NL506max for ~ 11BB/100 average ( over 35K hands now) and 4 tables Nl100 for 4BB/100 average .. ( NL100 has higher rakeback though which adds a bit)
The thing is NL50 on Ipoker is just so ridiculously easy and predictable.
everybody i faced at NL50 ipoker so far sucked in every aspect of poker.
Its like walking into a Goldmine , taking out some money while relaxing and then quit session.
Nl100 Ipoker is totally different.
Its confusing me for the most part.
I have the feeling there are a shitload of semi medicore regs at NL100 6max ipoker.
they are not particularly good but they also dont suck so much.
You really need to watch villians plays closely and then estimate how ure range is on average , cause its kinda difficult to get really accurat reads. Many regs at Nl100 variy their lines and plays a lot.
Its like 60% of Ipoker Nl100 6max players probably suck a good amount at poker but have some CR or leggo account and therefore know lots of moves and lines from Videos which they try to apply to their game.
When i 6 table NL100sh i get completely lost for the most part >_< WIth 4 tabling its okay though. i then can watch almost all the important action closely.
most villian stats are like 23/18/3 45% fold to flop bet which also makes their flop calling and betting ranges kinda polarized and therefore more difficult to read.
http://www.liquidpoker.net/user_pictures/dfa3dd753196fba199127694d1457455.jpg
I really wanted to keep going at it but I can't
I played for 14 hours and still have to drive for an hour in the rain to pick up my family. I gotta get at least an hour and a half of sleep so I'll take that sprint at the end. Thought it would never come