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6$ set facing turn checkraise on very drawy board

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InsideMan   United Kingdom. Jul 21 2010 12:06. Posts 159

$3/$6 No Limit Holdem
6 Players
Hand Conversion Powered by http://weaktight.com/

Stacks:
UTG $1,450
UTG+1 $1,071.95
CO $1,326.35
Hero $600
SB $805.85
BB $875

Pre-Flop: ($9, 6 players) Hero is BTN Tc Ts
3 folds, Hero raises to $15, 1 fold, BB calls $9

Flop: 2d Jc 7c ($33, 2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $23, BB calls $23

Turn: Td ($79, 2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $58, BB raises to $172

Final Pot: $309

Villain is a regular whom I play with on a regular basis. I think there is a level of mutual respect between us. We haven't gotten into any unusual dynamics with eachother.
In this spot I feel as though villain is repping no value hand except for the occasional 98s and JhTh. So I'm thinking his range has to be geared towards weak made hands and draws. Against this range I expect to get no value from shoving, only hand protection. However I'm unsure of the additional value of calling as opposed to shoving on the turn. I feel the river might be hard to guess on when he shoves as there are a lot of tricky rivers. I guess I would call any x and any dx as well as any pairing card obv, but I'm also unsure of his bluffing frequency when he misses.
What are your thoughts on range and play?
Thanks in advance.

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There is no such thing as certainty in life, only opportunity.  

X YouGoTGoT   United States. Jul 21 2010 12:59. Posts 1118

Do you have stats on the villain you play with on a regular basis?

YA I TALK SHIT, GOTTA DEFECATE TO CONVERSATE 

NMcNasty    United States. Jul 21 2010 14:26. Posts 2041

I love to trap but I feel like this is a clear shove. Its pretty rare that a player would play a weak made hand like this, there's almost no hand that raises turn for value then folds to a shove. I would just get the money in now to insure JT or maybe a low set doesn't get scared by a bad river, and also cuz if u shove ur opponent is gonna feel priced in with a combo-draw even though it would probably be correct for him to fold.


Maynard!   United States. Jul 21 2010 14:31. Posts 4453

Wouldn't he be geared more towards value (slowplayed set/top 2/weak made hand looking to get $ out of your weak double barrel) than non-value b/c the fact that the board is so draw heavy and you're very likely to have a draw shooting another barrel w/ millions of draws or have a made hand? Both of which would likely never be folded out from a turn c-raise from him and he probably knows this and expects 0 turn folds.

I think you just gotta go w/ it and shove.

Now I really am a busto. Thanks FTP.Last edit: 21/07/2010 14:33

Fayth    Canada. Jul 21 2010 19:16. Posts 10085

board is way too drawy to do anything else than shove

Im not sure what to do tomorrow when I see her, should I shake her hand?? -Floofy 

TimDawg    United States. Jul 22 2010 10:54. Posts 10197


  On July 21 2010 18:16 Fayth wrote:
board is way too drawy to do anything else than shove

online bob is actually a pretty smart person, not at all like the creepy fucker that sits in the sofa telling me he does nasty shit to me when im asleep - pinball 

InsideMan   United Kingdom. Jul 23 2010 07:00. Posts 159

@ YouGotGot

I do, but I doubt I would have enough information to be of value in this spot as I don't datamine. I also don't use stats when I play. I either play with no hud or PFR/VPIP.

@ NMc

By weak made hand I mean a hand that he is not raising for value, like 76s. I agree that calling may scare out value hands on the river, but given his line and hand combinations he is rarely going to show up with a weaker made hand that he is raising for value. Shoving for value against combo draws makes sense to me though.

@ Maynard

Interesting, so you're saying that there is some chance he may show up with an AJ here? That would broaden his value range significantly and clearly favour shoving.

There is no such thing as certainty in life, only opportunity.  

EvilSky    Czech Republic. Jul 25 2010 07:39. Posts 8918

I think its a clear shove, why would he ever raise a weak made hand planning on folding to a shove on this board where you can continue with so much of your 2b range ?


HeRoS)eNGagE   Canada. Jul 25 2010 11:02. Posts 10896


  On July 21 2010 18:16 Fayth wrote:
board is way too drawy to do anything else than shove


 



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