STT final hand

It's his deal and I have him covered by a small amount. My holecards are KJo and I make a standard raise of about 2.5bb, maybe 1/15 our stacks. He calls and the flop comes KJ4 rainbow. I check and he minbets. I flat. The turn comes 7c, putting two clubs on the board. I check again, hoping to stack him with my top two, because his range is huge and I've got top two. He bets again, something sizable, and I call. The river is a third club. I fire, leaving me with about 1/2 of what I started with, he reraises all-in, and I tank before making a call, knowing he has a flush. He shows Q6c and I muck.

I know I misplayed the turn by not betting it hard and the river by calling. Was my flop check justified and what was worse, the river call or the turn check?

Well, it wasn't the final hand but I had 1.5 blinds left after it so...

Why do you check flop. Seems bad to me (not all the time.) Your opponent is going to call with hands that you are way ahead of on the flop... he could have a QT type of hand for OESD, a king or jack... :/

And turn is even worse. Just shove if you're check raising there... seriously this hand is played bad. You say "i check again hoping to stack him with my top two" and then you proceed to check...... call. Ok.

Raise pre, c/c two streets with a really strong hand HU, and then whine when he sucks out on your bad slowplay...

Please don't say that I'm whining. I don't think I'm whining when I say stuff like "which was worse" and "I know I misplayed" talking about my own play.

What do I do on the turn and river considering that it's SOMETIMES ok to check a flop that I'm absolutely dominating on? Is check-shoving the turn the only option? Assuming I've check-called and a blank club hits on the river, can I call an all-in here with over half the chips in play in the pot and no straights on the board? Obviously he had a flush here but I think I would be a fool to fold to an all-in here every time.

I mean, if he doesn't have two clubs here he's got Kx, a weaker 2p, or a missed draw, right?

if you don't have reads on the player play ABC instead of running traps etc. Your hand is strong enough to slow-play on the flop, so checking probably OK. When he donks you can raise him though. Turn check may be OK too but when he bets always raise. I think that's the only big mistake in this hand.

lol vasoline , slowplay flop is totaly fine (40 bb deep )
but please bet turn or as played c/r all in

Thanks for the advice everyone. I actually did have a really strong read on him and that's why it didn't occur to me to bet the turn harder in spite of the clubs hitting. He was staring at the board looking for something on the flop and the turn (characteristic of a hand that needs to improve to win) but I watched his eyes as the river came and his eyebrows went up and he leaned back and suddenly he stopped looking at the board. Then he shoved.

I had to think he had a strong hand here, but I thought he might have caught two pair with a K8 or something, because the river was the 8c. 9T makes sense but it's more unlikely than two clubs with his style and betting. I know there were a lot of hands that beat me but I got caught up thinking about my own hand too much. So, thanks for the input, I understand now that the problem wasn't calling on the river but letting the river hit in the first place.

On June 04 2010 02:51 offsuit wrote: Thanks for the advice everyone. I actually did have a really strong read on him and that's why it didn't occur to me to bet the turn harder in spite of the clubs hitting. He was staring at the board looking for something on the flop and the turn (characteristic of a hand that needs to improve to win) but I watched his eyes as the river came and his eyebrows went up and he leaned back and suddenly he stopped looking at the board. Then he shoved. I had to think he had a strong hand here, but I thought he might have caught two pair with a K8 or something, because the river was the 8c. 9T makes sense but it's more unlikely than two clubs with his style and betting. I know there were a lot of hands that beat me but I got caught up thinking about my own hand too much. So, thanks for the input, I understand now that the problem wasn't calling on the river but letting the river hit in the first place.

I'm not sure that's exactly the problem, letting river hit. The mistake is letting people hit their draws for free.
Think of it this way: if a club didn't come on the river, what would he do? He'd either bluff, which is unlikely, or just give up. You probably wouldn't make any money on the river. On the turn, he has a draw, and might call your raise. Basically, your goal is to get money into the pot when you are ahead, giving him wrong odds when he is on a draw.

either raise flop or raise turn.. flatting is so retarded on both streets.. you say he has a huge range of hands.. flop can easily be a gutshot or an oesd.. turn is even worse.. if you check flop most people think you immediately give up.. holding low pp or Ax that you'd raise pf and sometimes cbet sometimes c/f on flop.. even if you hit that well you should bet bet bet, maybe bet flop and if he calls try to c/r turn depending on how he plays, if youre not sure just fire all 3 streets, because this hand incl. outcome is the perf. example of how not to play a hand.

Hmm... I just had a read on him that he had absolutely nothing and I didn't want him to just fold. Probably a mental mistake on my part. I should be happy taking down a raised pot.