200nl 200bb deep tough spot PF w/ AKs

There was a hand leading up to this one that made this decision so tough. My opponent is running 11/10/3 over a decent sample, I was running 22/18, this hand happened roughly 1 rotation prior.....

Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em, $2 BB (6 handed) Full-Tilt Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

saw flop|saw showdown

MP ($393.05)
CO ($252.10)
Button ($199.55)
SB ($200)
Hero ($200)
UTG ($431)

Preflop: Hero is BB with Q, J.
1 fold, MP raises to $7, CO calls $7, Button calls $7, 1 fold, Hero raises to $36, MP folds, CO folds, Button raises to $65, Hero raises to $200 (All-In), Button calls $134.55 (All-In).

Flop: ($414.55) 3, 4, J (2 players, 2 all-in)

Turn: ($414.55) 7 (2 players, 2 all-in)

River: ($414.55) 3 (2 players, 2 all-in)

Final Pot: $414.10

Results in white below:
Hero has Qs Jh (two pair, jacks and threes).
Button has 5d 5c (two pair, fives and threes).
Outcome: Hero wins $414.54.

basically the whole table started saying I was insane and/or crazy/out of my mind, most notably villain in the following hand...

Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em, $2 BB (6 handed) Full-Tilt Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

saw flop|saw showdown

SB ($406.65)
BB ($232.10)
UTG ($185.80)
MP ($200)
Hero ($411.80)
Button ($425)

Preflop: Hero is CO with A, K.
1 fold, Hero raises to $7, Button raises to $24, 2 folds, Hero raises to $68, Button raises to $160, Hero ......????

Question is ... yeah I realize hes tight, and that first hand, though I think it was standard, because basically the whole table was talking about me being nuts, I felt like my image was ridiculous at that point, do you think that's enough to justify a jam?

I dont think clueless fish usually raise huge into the percived monkey so I think its probably a fold.

nvm

I mean, is he putting in like 40% of his stack with like AQ hoping you bluffshove the rest?

i dont know, i felt like he might be doing this expecting me to shove really light, so possibly as a merge? i dont give him credit for understanding merging, but im sure if he thinks im capable of jamming JQo that he doesnt need the absolute nuts to get it in? i dunno, at that point if he has just queens i think i have to get it in, right?

so if im gonna fold to his 5bet doesnt that mean i probably shouldnt 4bet? in which case how else would u play the hand?

call 3 bet and play poker?

marshall...why always stick it in preflop? Play some postflop poker geeze!

honestly I flat AK 200bb deep oop. The hand is super easy to play against a tight 11/10 guy...his range is so narrow and we won't get much anyways when he misses.

4b with a plan plz...it's almost like you're saying to yourself "i have AK the preflop nuts so i 4b...oh shit...he 5b...i guess i don't have the nuts...maybe i'll fold the nuts this time...fuck it...I beat nothing in his range but AK is the nuts and I have balls."

You need to know how nits and fish react to agressive/retarded plays. In general I find they dont adjust their preflop ranges to get it in sorta light 200bbs deep, the wait for premiums to play back with and station you with any part of the flop otherwise.

I think calling the 3-bet is way superior to 4-betting yes.

royalsu, yeah youre right, thx for calling me out on that. i didnt make the play cuz i "have balls" ... i really felt like this scenario was very rare and that i should most likely be getting it in because of the dynamic. i did get it in, i suppose i just asked the question wrong, i should have been asking is 4bet/getting it in superior to flatting his 3bet given the dynamic.

saki, yeah i think i agree flatting def is much better, thx.

WTF LOOOLOLOOOLOLOLLL

On July 11 2008 02:27 JonnyCosMo wrote:

rofl

btw mathematically you are breaking even if he shoves QQ+ AK. Take out AK and you're fucked. Take out QQ and you dribble a little bit of money.

if the 5's vs QJ happened 1 orbit prioir, what hand did button double up with to get to 200bb? did he steamshove some random hand or something or did he cooler someone? i'd scan through the HH and make a descion based on that

Tom i don't think villain in hand 2 is the same villain from hand 1.

in that case - just shove it, f it

ur freerolling $200 of ur stack so ur only rly shoving 100bb and u'd obviously get that in with AK

so ship it freeroll life

hahah

On July 11 2008 12:02 FrinkX wrote: ur freerolling $200 of ur stack so ur only rly shoving 100bb and u'd obviously get that in with AK so ship it freeroll life

by this argument, im basically always freerolling and should never consider not shoving.

I think that shoving QJ in that spot for 100bb is much worse than shoving AKs here for 200bb

On July 11 2008 16:29 TalentedTom wrote: I think that shoving QJ in that spot for 100bb is much worse than shoving AKs here for 200bb

qffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffft

On July 11 2008 16:29 TalentedTom wrote: I think that shoving QJ in that spot for 100bb is much worse than shoving AKs here for 200bb

wow, surprised u think that.... i wish i knew how to do an equity calculation ... pretty sure it has to be +ev w/ dead money vs his range

i misread the QJ hand the first time around. I thought you reshoved over the preflop raiser. It's actually not that bad now that I think of it. The overcaller has a medium pair most of the time so we're flipping.

yea the QJ hand doesn't look bad