nl 25 QQ river shove

Submitted by : Sath

PokerStars Game #18444646820: Hold'em No Limit ($0.10/$0.25) - 2008/06/28 - 16:13:42 (ET)
Table 'Helenos II' 6-max Seat #6 is the button
Seat 1: tommylivno ($42.25 in chips)
Seat 2: henil65 ($11.90 in chips)
Seat 3: Hero ($24.90 in chips)
Seat 4: radzikb ($42.65 in chips)
Seat 6: Pakashkan ($26.45 in chips)
tommylivno: posts small blind $0.10
henil65: posts big blind $0.25

Holecards
Dealt to Hero
Hero : raises $0.75 to $1
radzikb: folds
Pakashkan: folds
tommylivno: calls $0.90
henil65: folds

Flop (Pot : $2.25)

   
tommylivno: checks
Hero : bets $1.50
tommylivno: calls $1.50

Turn (Pot : $5.25)

   
tommylivno: checks
Hero : bets $4
tommylivno: calls $4

River (Pot : $13.25)

   
tommylivno: checks
slev1n7 joins the table at seat #5
Hero : bets $6
tommylivno: raises $29.75 to $35.75 and is all-in
Hero :

fold.. what do you think you beat?
this looks like JT or set with no reads
and on rare occasions AA

On June 28 2008 14:36 ChromaX wrote: fold.. what do you think you beat? this looks like JT or set with no reads and on rare occasions AA

Altough there are some idiots that bluff failed flush like this.

i might consider calling since you bet so smallish. if opponent is capable of sensing some weakness he could certainly bluff you on river here.

loool

id never fold here after betting so small on the river

not to mention he is representing like absolutely nothing

i'm pretty sure i call here every time even with just a J for sure

On June 28 2008 14:58 CrownRoyal wrote: not to mention he is representing like absolutely nothing i'm pretty sure i call here every time even with just a J for sure

wow this is the worst advice in this therad. Your thinking is completely wrong and absolutely backwards. No one at these lvls c/r bluffs rivers. no one. This is the easiest fold ever.

On June 28 2008 14:57 CrownRoyal wrote: id never fold here after betting so small on the river

idk your betsize is prob insignificant at this level in this particular situation

are they really keen enough to raise weak bets like this?

easy fold...looks like a set here. i dont think he is just c/c a flop like this with JT, maybe T T....

fold here, u beat only bluffs, AJ, AT

On June 28 2008 14:58 CrownRoyal wrote: not to mention he is representing like absolutely nothing i'm pretty sure i call here every time even with just a J for sure

so you're advocating calling your stack with TP against river check raise AI made by unknown? You better be joking man... How can you give such a bad advice?

78hh lolz

ur beat, just give up on the hand. he prob has a higherpp or set

we'll i ended up calling and he flipped over JT. i was 90% sure this guy had JT but i called anyways. probly tilt cause of having to move down from nl 50.

Uhh...

On June 28 2008 14:58 CrownRoyal wrote: i'm pretty sure i call here every time even with just a J for sure

Probably not a good idea. QQ is still only one pair vs an unknown.

On June 28 2008 22:43 BigRed0000 wrote: No one at these lvls c/r bluffs rivers. no one.

Not true at all. People do c/r bluff. These players just aren't predictable.

On June 28 2008 14:46 SpasticInk wrote: i might consider calling since you bet so smallish. if opponent is capable of sensing some weakness he could certainly bluff you on river here.

Agreed. =s

Oh, right. I still fold though. xP

if you guys dont believe me or think that people cant bluff/arent capable wtfever

look at my hand histories. I play a pretty lag style and get a lot of action though.

another problem i have is id never bet the river for 6 for any reason other than a trap so im biased

i think you guys are crazy to think we are always beat here... it's like JT, TT or nothing.

i'm split between crown and the rest of the advice in the thread, both have valid points

the problem is the $6 bet on the river, if you had made it like $8+ then you're not going to be in this shitty spot to be shoved over

personally if I feel my opponent is on a busted draw, I'd deliberately bet small to give them a chance to bluff their stack off

i think you should pay more attention to the hand, and have some kind of idea of WHAT he's holding before you even decide to bet the river...

I'm somewhat with crownroyal on this i play lower stakes and everytime i get action I'm not scared of a set/straight or w/e

loosen up and get some action.

That said I like the size of your bets the first 2 streets.

river is problems though

betting 6 dollars opposed to a bet more consistent with flop/turn like 8-12 is bad for a few reasons

you miss value with a smaller bet; I don't feel like a smaller bet expands his calling range while at the same time i don't feel a larger bet decreases it.

Your river bet will never be called by better only shoved on so it is in no way a blocker

You increase his river bluffing frequency which can be ok if you have history and want him to shove busted hearts or something (but since the jh is out i don't think he shows up often with busted hearts as often. he can't have that combodraw and probably doesn't flatcall Ax suited out of the blinds and if he did he'd prolly raise it earlier. that doesn't leave much).

With no history though you don't want to bet small and have him decide he is better off shoving than folding or calling.

.

I call in this spot sometimes with certain history cause he is repping pretty much only j10 (1010 if hes tight pre?) but vs unknown here a bet/fold should be ok.

If I think he calls/floats/spews too much and can bluff then I might c/c

If u are nto sure about your hand and dont want shove so check behind the river...

uh i think he miss his frush

i absolutely agree with trax. you're getting laid pretty good odds to call here since you're only 100bb at the beginning of the hand. but it seems like you have an idea if his shovebluff-a-busted-draw : JT/TT frequency is higher than your 3:1 odds. gambol imo.

Gotta call after that tilt inducing bet sizing on the river. Seriously that bet is like fucking his mother, such a huge chance he's going to just flip out.