25nl - Monster Draw: How much to raise?

Ran pretty bad at 50nl, down like 8bi and about 80% of that is just the difference between my Allin Lines. %_%
Moving down to rebuild for the time being.

Pretty simple hand I think, but I have a lot of trouble playing draws.

PF: I opened up my stealing range/lowered betsize because of how the table is working out. A9s from the co is good enough imo since:

Richi211 has been running 85/30/1.5 for the last hour or so, down like 4.5bi. Play is erratic. Limps strong hands, minraise/shoves trash and the nuts. Everyone else is running like <18 and camping this guy.

Flop: How much do we raise here? At the high end we have like 20 outs; there's a good chance some of our straight cards/diamonds aren't good. Not all of our outs are clean, etc.

What I'm really wondering is, is shoving here appropriate? Do you think I might lose value against either the tag or the loose retard? At minimum the stacks are going in for a flip. =s

+ Show Spoiler +

the check-call from foxik doesnt mean much to me here, i think with a set on this board he's looking to get you out of the pot and just play vs the lagtard

the minraise from richi could be anything, top pair, 2pair etc, i'm putting in a big raise here to either take it down or get it in w/ richi because you have so much equity vs his range here

go all in.

On June 28 2008 01:38 BigRed0000 wrote: go all in.

you have the nuts make a big pot

MINRAIZE! xD

So we're not worried at all about losing any value? Shove's good?

On June 28 2008 05:08 ck20 wrote: MINRAIZE! xD

!

we're way too deep to go allin? i'd raise enough to leave richi or whatever his name is room to make a shove with fold equity so like 11 dollars or something.

On June 28 2008 15:03 CrownRoyal wrote: we're way too deep to go allin? i'd raise enough to leave richi or whatever his name is room to make a shove with fold equity so like 11 dollars or something.

11 dollars is too little.

If you want to go for value ill still put something like 15 +/-

Raise to about 9.95$ because there's good chance to call both opponents and make the pot bigger than u push and richi call and foxik fold..

Hmmm, I went 16 and thought it was a bit low. Tag shoved and we ended up getting more in on the flop.

On June 28 2008 01:38 BigRed0000 wrote:
go all in.

+ Show Spoiler +

it's not good call of foxiks allin, u should push, if u push on this flop it's +EV but not on this turn.

On June 29 2008 00:56 Elastopete wrote: it's not good call of foxiks allin, u should push, if u push on this flop it's +EV but not on this turn.

can't raise foxik's allin.

yeah i see no reason to shove the turn.

i'd just c/c the turn and c/f the riv if i missed, sometimes he'll just check it down with a really good hand and save you 21 dollars and if you hit we're obv shoving....

On June 29 2008 21:40 CrownRoyal wrote: yeah i see no reason to shove the turn. i'd just c/c the turn and c/f the riv if i missed, sometimes he'll just check it down with a really good hand and save you 21 dollars and if you hit we're obv shoving....

really good point there. Ugh. lol. I have shit equity vs his range on the turn.
Wow what a retarded spew. >_<