Shove or call? AA set on Turn 200BB deep

Shove or call? BLACKICE781 is 20/13/4. He calls way too many 3bets preflop with a large range of hands. Any who, were 200BB deep, so what would you do in my shoes?

Submitted by : mrpav.com

PokerStars Game #18416079831: Hold'em No Limit ($1/$2) - 2008/06/27 - 11:11:34 (ET)
Table 'Bowell' 6-max Seat #6 is the button
Seat 2: MistTheFlop ($32.40 in chips)
Seat 3: metal_muts ($203 in chips)
Seat 4: BLACKICE781 ($396.60 in chips)
Seat 5: pappachips ($492.15 in chips)
Seat 6: ==PAV== ($408.60 in chips)
MistTheFlop: posts small blind $1
metal_muts: posts big blind $2

Holecards
Dealt to ==PAV==
BLACKICE781: raises $6 to $8
pappachips: folds
==PAV== : raises $16 to $24
MistTheFlop: folds
metal_muts: folds
BLACKICE781: calls $16

Flop (Pot : $51.00)

   
BLACKICE781: checks
==PAV== : bets $42
BLACKICE781: calls $42

Turn (Pot : $135.00)

   
BLACKICE781: checks
==PAV== : checks

River (Pot : $135.00)

   
BLACKICE781: bets $106
==PAV== : ?

set on river..why would u flat this...what was he calling on the flop with..a 6?
i say min raise

shove if he's tight, call if he's a monkey pf.

I think if he has a 6 here hes an idiot

I think I would probably just pussy call my way out of this one.

Well I think he has a lower set as often as he has a 6, and since he wont ever put you on a 6 you gotta raise here.

i see set on river here :< and ye i would shove, but i would also 3bet larger deep especially when he is calling light

i think a shove, i dont expect him to ever check a st on the turn esp with 2 fd out there, imo u win this alot. if its vs donk, flatcall

ship it

ez shove and ship it asaply, probably lower set or ak if hes a maniac

there might be the possibility of him thinking you were trying to steal it with a big bet on the flop because it looks pretty blank, then when he saw you checked the turn though u were weak or were bluffing with like aq aj it and bet his ace when it hit but that seems pretty ballsy

On June 27 2008 12:57 TT1 wrote: ez shove and ship it asaply, probably lower set or ak at best

So shove would be best? I think %80 of the time they have a set here

yea pretty sure he has pocket 8's(most likely) or 7's here, anyways wat happened ?

omg raise all-in

On June 27 2008 19:59 TT1 wrote: yea pretty sure he has pocket 8's(most likely) or 7's here, anyways wat happened ?

theres no difference here between 7s or 6s in this hand and theres no difference between 4s / 5s / 8s if he can have one he can have the other

and ya you should shove, unless he has a read on the deck him have a 6 here is highly unlikely

i know theres no difference but i dont see him calling 24 preflop with 5's or 4's but it could happen cus of his range, guessing the specific hand is more fun

I'm saying if he calls pf with 8s or 7s then he calls with any pocket pair

On June 27 2008 20:30 Python817 wrote: I'm saying if he calls pf with 8s or 7s then he calls with any pocket pair

qft

He tilts like no other, but I dont really have much thats constructive in this particular hand... he definitely calls any pp here pf given that its 2bi deep, hell he calls all pps even if it wasnt I think

I think a small raise/fold is optimal if hes really dumb and spewy. If hes not just call.

its as simple as...

if you think he will call with worse, jam.

If you think he never calls with anything worse, call.

On June 28 2008 02:44 BigRed0000 wrote: its as simple as... if you think he will call with worse, jam. If you think he never calls with anything worse, call.

Well its more like, if 50% of the hands he calls with are worse then shove.

Horrible shove IMO Pav.

I think you're a decent player though

On June 28 2008 02:16 gawdawaful wrote: He tilts like no other, but I dont really have much thats constructive in this particular hand... he definitely calls any pp here pf given that its 2bi deep, hell he calls all pps even if it wasnt I think

Lol.

Where've you been lately gawdawful?

He said he had a large PF range and being 200bb deep it might be even larger tbh i probably flat, against a tighty i shove

On July 11 2008 20:43 blackice781 wrote: Show nested quote + On June 28 2008 02:16 gawdawaful wrote: He tilts like no other, but I dont really have much thats constructive in this particular hand... he definitely calls any pp here pf given that its 2bi deep, hell he calls all pps even if it wasnt I think Lol. Where've you been lately gawdawful?

At your moms house doing the macarena

On June 28 2008 06:15 SakiSaki wrote: Well its more like, if 50% of the hands he calls with are worse then shove.

thank you

glad somebody gets it

On July 12 2008 13:58 [vital]Myth wrote: Show nested quote + On June 28 2008 06:15 SakiSaki wrote: Well its more like, if 50% of the hands he calls with are worse then shove. thank you glad somebody gets it

dont we all?

almost all of his pair+gutshot hands on the flop (like 86s) would check/raise and get it in, i would think. that's how most loose monkeys at these stakes play anyway

so he has 76ss, 76hh, 66, or a set or 2pair.

therefore, since he isn't bet/folding 2pair or a set, you need to be value shoving here.

unless he doesn't bet the river with 2pair or a set, in which case it's a fold

for anyone saying to flat-call...do you really think you're bluff-catching that often? because if you think he's bet/folding a set or 2pair i think you're insane

for anyone possibly still confused, if his range of hands that bets the river is...

(1a) 2pair, set, 6x, extremely rare bluff ... then we value shove
(1b) 2pair, set, 6x, extremely rare bluff **BUT** 2pair and set will bet/fold ... then we flat call (but i think this is extremely unlikely)
(2) 6x, extremely rare bluff ... then we fold
(3) 6x, 25%+ bluffs ... then we flat
(4) 2pair, set, 6x, and 25%+ bluffs ... then we value shove

do u think he calls a shove with 2 pair?

i mean, i mean not to give much credit to fish but 2 pair of even a set its a bluff catcher since we not shoving worse for value ever.

On July 12 2008 14:32 Baal wrote: i mean, i mean not to give much credit to fish but 2 pair of even a set its a bluff catcher since we not shoving worse for value ever.

whoa, whoa, careful who you're calling a fish.

ya he's pro dontchaknow

I can tell just by his 6 posts he is retarded enough to have a 6 here so I'd just call


*edit*
went back through and didn't read Myths post til just now

it's not so much bluff catching imo as if I shove I'm only getting looked up by some stupid 6x hand and at best a set that he called with since we are deep that I'm sure he figures it's worth it oop

and this c/c on flop and lead on rvr line looks much more like 6x > bluff > set > two pair to me
just think the shove is thin is all - u could do it though
and no way could I fold, I'm to dumb for that

and btw, u didn't hit the set til rvr

On July 13 2008 06:41 tloapc wrote: ya he's pro dontchaknow I can tell just by his 6 posts he is retarded enough to have a 6 here so I'd just call *edit* went back through and didn't read Myths post til just now it's not so much bluff catching imo as if I shove I'm only getting looked up by some stupid 6x hand and at best a set that he called with since we are deep that I'm sure he figures it's worth it oop and this c/c on flop and lead on rvr line looks much more like 6x > bluff > set > two pair to me just think the shove is thin is all - u could do it though and no way could I fold, I'm to dumb for that

lmao whoever made posting a lot on a stupid forum a prerequisite for being good?

you're obviously an ignorant idiot.

On July 13 2008 06:25 blackice781 wrote: Show nested quote + On July 12 2008 14:32 Baal wrote: i mean, i mean not to give much credit to fish but 2 pair of even a set its a bluff catcher since we not shoving worse for value ever. whoa, whoa, careful who you're calling a fish.

HU?

DING DING DING

On July 16 2008 22:13 Baal wrote: Show nested quote + On July 13 2008 06:25 blackice781 wrote:   On July 12 2008 14:32 Baal wrote: i mean, i mean not to give much credit to fish but 2 pair of even a set its a bluff catcher since we not shoving worse for value ever. whoa, whoa, careful who you're calling a fish. HU?

sure, name stakes and a time

On July 13 2008 06:25 blackice781 wrote: Show nested quote + On July 12 2008 14:32 Baal wrote: i mean, i mean not to give much credit to fish but 2 pair of even a set its a bluff catcher since we not shoving worse for value ever. whoa, whoa, careful who you're calling a fish.

HU?

lololol

On July 20 2008 10:39 blackice781 wrote: Show nested quote + On July 16 2008 22:13 Baal wrote:   On July 13 2008 06:25 blackice781 wrote:   On July 12 2008 14:32 Baal wrote: i mean, i mean not to give much credit to fish but 2 pair of even a set its a bluff catcher since we not shoving worse for value ever. whoa, whoa, careful who you're calling a fish. HU? sure, name stakes and a time

I'll refree the match for 10% of profits

lol who is this guy? lololol

btw i think i flat here unless there's any significant reason why you'd shove this river (ie. history/image). assuming you're in a vaccuum, you're obv never shoving as a bluff and i think any one with a brain could get away from 2pr/low set here.