NL200 6m: AK in 3bet pots

Hi there!

I just moved to NL200 6max from NL100 Fullring basically. Anyhow, 6max is not new to me, I used to play 6max about a year ago.
Needless to say that my aggression factor did skyrock, but I am getting owned with AK the whole time.

Please someone tell me what I am doing wrong here:

All my opponents had like 24/22/3 stats.

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most of the time there hasn't been a history, so I am i playing this over aggressively? What can I do to avoid this? I guess 3betting AK is fine, but what if we get 4bet. You know, blah, his likelyhood to hold AA or KK is reduced by 50% and against the other hands i am at least racing, blahblahblah, we've all heard it over and over again.

Here is another hand against some superaggro player, can we avoid this?

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Text results appended to pokerstove.txt

431,500,608 games 0.078 secs 5,532,059,076 games/sec

Board:
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 38.824% 18.14% 20.68% 78295380 89232168.00 { AKo }
Hand 1: 61.176% 40.50% 20.68% 174740892 89232168.00 { QQ+, AKs, AKo }

giving this tight range i am still about 40%, with the money invested it's close. Now give my opponent another few hands and this is an easy all-in or am i missing something?

I never shove AK preflop without a read, some people do, but generally, think about the player's range and how much he or she is going to fold. AKo is a drawing hand, so you need fold equity, make sure you have it. So, 4bet shove (or potbet, depending on game flow) your AK if he's really tight and will give up a lot of 3bet pots preflop if he doesn't have KK+ or if he has a very wide range in 3betting (i.e. he squeezed, defended his blind or generally 3bets very lightly), or just give up when you do not have one of these reasons to jam your AK. I generally don't like to play AK aggressively preflop with deep stacks, you're rarely going to get a favorable stack size ratio if you get it postflop, and if you're getting it in preflop you're usually behind because a lot of player's shoving ranges or shove calling ranges are much more tighter when deep.

This all looks good. Unlucky mate.

All standard.

standard

i know what you are doing wrong, you are losing ! WTF ?! at least win hand #3 !

Hand 1: Ship
Hand 2: Ship
Hand 3: Timebank then Ship

just variance

you're just unlucky.

On May 07 2008 02:31 Sjorris wrote: I never shove AK preflop without a read, some people do, but generally, think about the player's range and how much he or she is going to fold. AKo is a drawing hand, so you need fold equity, make sure you have it. So, 4bet shove (or potbet, depending on game flow) your AK if he's really tight and will give up a lot of 3bet pots preflop if he doesn't have KK+ or if he has a very wide range in 3betting (i.e. he squeezed, defended his blind or generally 3bets very lightly), or just give up when you do not have one of these reasons to jam your AK. I generally don't like to play AK aggressively preflop with deep stacks, you're rarely going to get a favorable stack size ratio if you get it postflop, and if you're getting it in preflop you're usually behind because a lot of player's shoving ranges or shove calling ranges are much more tighter when deep.

ya dont listen to this just close eyes and shove

So basically you guys always shove AK no matter what?

Question:
Lots of the equity AK has vs a QQ+,AKo+ range comes from the fact that opponent has the same hand as us, AK (20% tie)

Wouldnt that make us less happy about sticking it in, I mean we are only 18% to actually win the pot
Often pot odds are just compared to the equity(but doesnt the fact that so much of equity comes from ties change anything?)

maybe all the people who have no clue stop posting, k thx.
Back in the good times there was something like a med staked ban standard, dunno about today.

If the high rollers and green stars tell me i am playing fine, I am fine.

guy above me: read what i wrote in the original thread: us hold AK reduces the likelihood our opponent has AA or KK by 50%, making it more likely him having QQ, that's why our equity is almost 40%.

dont rly like your 4bet sizing on hand 3, either just shove since hes playing short or make a more inducing 4bet imo! otherwise standard yeah

only hand id consider folding is the AK in hand 3. But even then he showed up with QQ there. Dont be results oriented. Looks fine

"Don't be result oriented"...

I am not result oriented. Problem is that I never am ahead when I shove, that is the problem.

On May 07 2008 08:50 Royal_Rumble wrote: guy above me: read what i wrote in the original thread: us hold AK reduces the likelihood our opponent has AA or KK by 50%, making it more likely him having QQ, that's why our equity is almost 40%.

Doesnt PokerStove already take that into account?

On May 07 2008 02:31 Sjorris wrote: I never shove AK preflop without a read, some people do, but generally, think about the player's range and how much he or she is going to fold. AKo is a drawing hand, so you need fold equity, make sure you have it. So, 4bet shove (or potbet, depending on game flow) your AK if he's really tight and will give up a lot of 3bet pots preflop if he doesn't have KK+ or if he has a very wide range in 3betting (i.e. he squeezed, defended his blind or generally 3bets very lightly), or just give up when you do not have one of these reasons to jam your AK. I generally don't like to play AK aggressively preflop with deep stacks, you're rarely going to get a favorable stack size ratio if you get it postflop, and if you're getting it in preflop you're usually behind because a lot of player's shoving ranges or shove calling ranges are much more tighter when deep.

Personally I think there are many combinations of opponent-gameflow-3bet/4bet ranges that make some of these situations easily foldable.

I get it in hands 3 and 4 because they're somewhat short stacked, and I really don't need much of a read other than that piece of information plus stats that simply aren't ultra nitty.

Hands 1 and 2 look like folds to me if I don't have at least some suspicion that they could be holding a worse hand. We're still spewing hard if their range is 10-10+/AK. There is no fold equity here - they are both pot committing 4bets in response to reasonably small 3bets by us. If they can't be holding AQ, it seems irresponsible to write these off as coolers.

I haven't played 6max in a long time though so I guess it's possible that pe