Ethics: Exposed Cards

if you want the assholes to go down why do you draw the line with not telling them u can see ur cards

why dont you just stand up pick up your chair and skull fuck them

wuss

i just did 40 pushups in preparation for skull fucking some numbskull in san remo

Take full advantage of it the first time you see the cards, and maybe it costs him a lot of money, maybe not. Either way, tell him after the hand. Let people learn from their mistakes. If he happens to lose a lot of money because of it then after you tell him you saw his hand he will probably never make the same mistake again. It is poker, and in live poker covering up your cards is your responsibility.

Its just my opinion, I mean whats wrong with letting someone learn the hard way about a mistake. When I learn the hard way its always more memorable and effective.

On March 28 2008 20:18 lebowski wrote: Show nested quote + On March 28 2008 19:36 FrEaK[S.sIR] wrote: It has nothing to do with being polite, read my posts. nothing in your posts refers to this. all you say about it is how you would do what you would want others to do to you and generalise about being an auto-asshole if you don't mention to anyone that you see his cards,or how low such an act is. The first one is a good rule of thumb in general,but surely you can't expect anyone disliking you to treat you in such a manner, so it has nothing to do with the way you evaluate the act itself. So what is the basis of your negative evaluation for such an act towards another player? I don't know,so I'm refering to my own reasoning to sort this out;When we reveal to our villain that we see his holecards we do it to create a firm relationship of trust,a gentlemens' game.Politeness leads to a sense of mutual understanding that the game is set fairly and the winner will be determined by skills and luck,pretty much as it serves social cohesion in everyday life situations. When no intention of politeness or the reasons that induce it is evident,when we have a real asshole sitting next to us,name one good reason that makes the act of not pointing out his stupid mistake to him unethical. It's not like you are maphacking in a bw game btw, because you aren't supposed to maphack,whereas you're supposed to hide your holdings in poker. I think it really comes down to personal taste vs assholes. Some want their assholes busto the hard way and some others don't. edit:this is getting long and I'm getting sleepy

I don't care about a relationship of trust. I don't care about a "gentlemen's game". I don't care about politeness. I don't care how other people treat me. I don't care if my opponent is an asshoel or not. I don't care about being nice or polite. None of these things matter.

If I was accidentally showing my cards to somebody, I would want to be told. Whether or not the person is actually going to do so doesn't matter. If it happened, I'd want to know. Since I would want to know, I will tell when I am in the opposite situation. I don't care about the person's character. I don't care who you are. I don't care what you do. I don't care how nice or assholeish you are. I would tell you because I would want the same. I don't expect it, I would want it. Nothing else. It has nothing to do with negative evaluation. The only ethical part of it is not being a hypocrite when it comes to your personal beliefs. It has to do with what I would want out of a situation and what I expect out of myself when I am the opposite in that situation.

I made this clear in my earlier posts but now I'm spelling it out for you. Do you understand now?

On March 28 2008 21:52 Rekrul wrote: if you want the assholes to go down why do you draw the line with not telling them u can see ur cards why dont you just stand up pick up your chair and skull fuck them

REKRUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUULLLLL!!!!!

myth and daut its a human mistake u act like someone who accidentally shows his cards is guaranteed to be an idiot

and myth if u always make all your decisions in life to maximise EV then you'll end up being a pathetic person, you can't just say "do it cuz it earns money" as an argument we obviously realise that already

i'd tell anyone i can see their cards but i wouldn't go as far as antonio who folded his hand i woulda at least played the hand in that spot and if he wants to 1v1 knowing that i know one of his cards fine if not thats fine too

that's pretty interesting now that i think of it what if you were in the small blind and saw the bb's ace of clubs? after telling him u know he has the ace of clubs i wonder if it's even profitable to raise his bilnd with like 4 8 offsuit i dont think it is

On March 28 2008 23:54 FrEaK[S.sIR] wrote: Show nested quote + On March 28 2008 20:18 lebowski wrote:   On March 28 2008 19:36 FrEaK[S.sIR] wrote: It has nothing to do with being polite, read my posts. nothing in your posts refers to this. all you say about it is how you would do what you would want others to do to you and generalise about being an auto-asshole if you don't mention to anyone that you see his cards,or how low such an act is. The first one is a good rule of thumb in general,but surely you can't expect anyone disliking you to treat you in such a manner, so it has nothing to do with the way you evaluate the act itself. So what is the basis of your negative evaluation for such an act towards another player? I don't know,so I'm refering to my own reasoning to sort this out;When we reveal to our villain that we see his holecards we do it to create a firm relationship of trust,a gentlemens' game.Politeness leads to a sense of mutual understanding that the game is set fairly and the winner will be determined by skills and luck,pretty much as it serves social cohesion in everyday life situations. When no intention of politeness or the reasons that induce it is evident,when we have a real asshole sitting next to us,name one good reason that makes the act of not pointing out his stupid mistake to him unethical. It's not like you are maphacking in a bw game btw, because you aren't supposed to maphack,whereas you're supposed to hide your holdings in poker. I think it really comes down to personal taste vs assholes. Some want their assholes busto the hard way and some others don't. edit:this is getting long and I'm getting sleepy I don't care about a relationship of trust. I don't care about a "gentlemen's game". I don't care about politeness. I don't care how other people treat me. I don't care if my opponent is an asshoel or not. I don't care about being nice or polite. None of these things matter. If I was accidentally showing my cards to somebody, I would want to be told. Whether or not the person is actually going to do so doesn't matter. If it happened, I'd want to know. Since I would want to know, I will tell when I am in the opposite situation. I don't care about the person's character. I don't care who you are. I don't care what you do. I don't care how nice or assholeish you are. I would tell you because I would want the same. I don't expect it, I would want it. Nothing else. It has nothing to do with negative evaluation. The only ethical part of it is not being a hypocrite when it comes to your personal beliefs. It has to do with what I would want out of a situation and what I expect out of myself when I am the opposite in that situation. I made this clear in my earlier posts but now I'm spelling it out for you. Do you understand now?

Chill,it's not like you wrote a masterpiece on those posts and I think I understand well what you said. I'm still bothered with the origin of your ethics and the way that you treat it as pretty self evident.I don't say it can't be right,I'm saying it's definately not in an obvious way

It's only hypocrisy if you would like someone to correct one of your silly mistakes and that does depend on who that person is.

I wouldn't expect/like someone I dislike to correct me so thers obv no reason to feel mixed up about my personal beliefs.If it was a friend I would like him to keep the game at a good level so I'd definately feel eager to tell him.

And let me make myself also a bit more clear with an example; if I'm playing bw with a better assholeish opponent I wouldn't want him to point out my silly mistakes,even giving him unknowingly vision of the map. Or if someone I really dislike tells me "OMG I have a huge tell on you LOL", I'd be like "great, now charity from a retard" and would definately feel inclined to leave

So, as you can see,being helpful to someone you dislike is in actuality a form of hostility,it's giving you a higher ground and making you feel good for yourself (or even if it doesn't it puts the asshole in a weaker spot)
F.Nietzsche found the origins of saying "thank you" in the wish for revenge for being weakened by being offered help

That's why I said it boils down to personal taste. Do you want his cash or his humiliation?
Stay quiet or speak it up accordingly,but there's no room for ethical preaching here

Vs a stupid asshole villain I'd go for his cash because he wouldn't have the decency to feel ashamed anyway

of course you tell the person

lifes about not being a faggot

i stfu and take every advantage i get to pay for my crack cocaine addiction

On March 29 2008 06:55 PoorUser wrote: of course you tell the person lifes about not being a faggot

ofc it is :D

and you guys are idiots for saying covering up your cards is part of poker, its not like you have to do it online. its just the only way to play live and if there was another way to play live then you would. but if you guys get off on being the live POTRIPPER then your all fags :[

look at the kid with xray vision preaching to the choir

hypocrite

well straate has his opponents cards set to translucent mode, ethical?

On March 29 2008 07:53 PoorUser wrote: and you guys are idiots for saying covering up your cards is part of poker, its not like you have to do it online. its just the only way to play live and if there was another way to play live then you would. but if you guys get off on being the live POTRIPPER then your all fags :[

well you don't have to have a good pokerface online either

i think most people would maintain that theres a huge difference between the 2

anyways empathize and dont be a faggot

On March 29 2008 08:18 PoorUser wrote: i think most people would maintain that theres a huge difference between the 2 anyways empathize and dont be a faggot

Why would you assume I wouldn't tell?
I'm talking about assholes,which I believe is a different case

i think youre being weak and showing too much concern for people whose money you are trying to take. i think you are making really really bad decisions by telling them what their cards are and its just fucking retarded. not telling them isnt being a faggot. nothing about it is unethical. if he is not covering them up and letting me see he should get what is coming to him. all of what you said doesnt count online IS LIVE POKER. the only legitimate reasons to tell someone that you can see their cards is if you are friends with that person or if telling them would somehow create a more +EV atmosphere for you to play in. if you think trying to make the most money playing poker in a totally legit way is being a faggot then you should probably quit playing online and taking peoples money to begin with.

i cant believe no one mentioned this (i think)

but you wouldnt tell an asshole but u would tell a friend? you realize gaining extra information against that one player and saying nothing about it means you're cheating everyone at the table, not just that guy

what makes you think you deserve to see his cards and they dont?