UFC 173: Barao vs. Dillashaw

Once barao got dropped in the first round, that probably killed his confidence and started to doubt himself.

I mean anyone with that type of winning streak will feel invincible and most of the time under estimate their opponent, until something unexpected happens like in the first round.

On May 25 2014 19:31 jvilla777 wrote: Once barao got dropped in the first round, that probably killed his confidence and started to doubt himself. I mean anyone with that type of winning streak will feel invincible and most of the time under estimate their opponent, until something unexpected happens like in the first round.

What happened to Silva 1st fight, Jones vs Gustafson, Pettis vs Henderson ( well tbh I feel like Henderson was just dumb to be overconfident, but w/e ) , all title fights, all people that were overconfident, only Jones managed to snap out of it and there could still be a discussion about his win...

yea, he was just lost and very nervous after 2nd or 3rd round
I remember when he stop to complain about an eye poke and while he was looking at the judge Dillashaw punched his face

when the round finished, he said to Pederneiras "he put his hand in my eyes" and Dedé tried to calm him down "it's ok, it's ok calm down"

This list is from BloodyElbow. This list is prior to the Dillashaw/Barao fight. Dillashaw is now at #3 on that list of upsets, as they listed Barao as being a -910 favorite.

that list is off. eddie wineland was a bigger favorite than most of those 2 weeks ago as was chandler over brooks.

barao clearly wasnt 100% after almost getting finished. but dillashaw was doing well before that and was unbelievable after that. barao is still a monster clearly, but dillashaw, just wow. that was the best performance start to finish that ive seen since jones vs shogun. probably even better though

On May 25 2014 16:08 Daut wrote: just watched. that was incredible by dillashaw. i almost want to go back and watch his old fights because from what i remember, he never looked like he had the potential to do something like this. sure he was a great athlete with great wrestling and solid power that would sometimes land a big shot and finish someone, but he seemed to struggle against much worse fighters. basically the key to figuring this out was the improvement of mighty mouse. they are actually really similar. when you have a ridiculous athlete with great cardio and great wrestling that works really hard and is still young he can make massive improvements in small amounts of time when skills start reaching a critical mass. he seriously looked like tyron woodley + mighty mouse combined. that was just insane. i read the result last night but didnt read play by play and i expected barao to have looked bad. he looked great. dillashaw was just that good.

That's exactly what i was going to say!
Amazing i was wathching the fight with open mouth unable to believe what is happening.He made Barao look 55 years old.Mighty Mouse style!!My new favourite fighter OMG

Off topic:

Dominick Cruz will fight again someday but, by the time he comes back, he'll probably be in a similar situation to Brian Bowles, in that Bowles career has been plagued with injuries and, despite being a WEC champion, he was never the same fighter once he started fighting a lot again. Most importantly, all of the other top 5 people in Bowles' division got much better in his absence and eventually passed him by and kicked his ass, not to mention Bowles still gets injured; he got failed some UFC drug test, and his chin and gas tank are weak these days which is why he got knocked out by George Roop.

Regarding Bowles' failed drug test: "The NSAC allows a T/E Ratio of 6:1 and Bowles was over 20:1.[13] Bowles did not appeal the result and was subsequently suspended for nine months and fined $5,700."
Bownles hasn't fought since May 25th, 2013.

Anyway, Cruz hasn't fought since October 1st, 2011, and he's had multiple injuries during that time, mostly to his knees. His style of fighting as well all know is the quick movement + cutting angles while picking apart his opponent, but he has no KO power whatsoever. The last guy who finished via strikes was Brian Bowles in 2010. Dillashaw showed a way better version of Cruz this past Saturday, so I'm interested to see where his career goes from here.

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There will be 2 UFC events this coming Saturday, one in Germany and one in Brazil. The first one is strictly on UFC Fight Pass, and the next one will be shown on Fox Sports 1. The events don't overlap, you'll basically be able to watch both events back-to-back.

PR how is fightpass these days? when i watch live i stream the first few fights that are on fightpass so i see the small issues during fights. but how is the fight library, layout, etc?

On May 25 2014 13:01 PuertoRican wrote:

how is it possible that 2nd judge actually gave him that rd.

On May 26 2014 02:39 Daut wrote: PR how is fightpass these days? when i watch live i stream the first few fights that are on fightpass so i see the small issues during fights. but how is the fight library, layout, etc?

I don't use Fight Pass. I used the free trial up until February 26th or so. I've been using streams since then. Fight Pass has benefits but, streamers have stepped it up with streaming the FP fights and I don't have the time to watch many replay/vods right now, so it's not worth it for me.

I think they're offering another 7-day free trial but, like I mentioned above, I can just watch a stream. If you have the money to spend, I'd say watching FP in HD with the rewind and different camera angle capabilities is worth it.

I mean its 10 bucks a month, its definitely worth it.

On May 25 2014 17:22 TimDawg wrote: can anyone provide me with a link to the dillashaw vs barao fight?

http://www.sockshare.com/file/AEA140235545FE67

Also www.mmashare.cc shows full replays of the fights

Andre Pederneiras: Let’s see if TJ Dillashaw is man enough to fight Renan Barao in Brazil

"We're asking for an immediate rematch. It's fair, and we're looking a way to do it," Pederneiras said in an interview to radio show No Mundo da Luta. "It can't happen in less than five or six months, but I think that's how long T.J. is going to be out. Everybody wants to see another fight between them, since it was the fight of the night."

"The ideal would be bringing this fight to Brazil," he said. "There's going to be a big event here in Brazil, apparently in October in Rio de Janeiro. Let's see if these guys are man enough to fight Barao in his house."

"After the first knockdown, Renan couldn't get into the fight anymore and he went dizzy with every blow," he said. "Even between the rounds, when we were talking to him, he wasn't even looking at us."

http://www.mmafighting.com/2014/5/26/...-renan-barao-ufc-173-rematch-mma-news

andre is somewhat right.

read an opinion piece today that i 100% agreed with. suppose that barao was finished in the first round after being knocked down by the big shot. it seems to be the opinion of most people that had that happened he would have been more deserving of an immediate rematch than he is now after being dominated for 5 full rounds while he was concussed. kinda nonsensical. give the man an immediate rematch, its not like anyone else deserves it.

On May 27 2014 01:53 Daut wrote: andre is somewhat right. read an opinion piece today that i 100% agreed with. suppose that barao was finished in the first round after being knocked down by the big shot. it seems to be the opinion of most people that had that happened he would have been more deserving of an immediate rematch than he is now after being dominated for 5 full rounds while he was concussed. kinda nonsensical. give the man an immediate rematch, its not like anyone else deserves it.

Andre is a fucking idiot.

- He says a rematch is fair. How so? Your fighter got his ass handed to him for 4.5 rounds and then finished in the 5th. The UFC could sell a rematch, however, an immediate rematch would sell less than Barao's past PPV's due to the fact that he got owned and hasn't shown that he is worthy of a rematch yet.

- He says that everyone wants to see another fight between these two since it was the FOTN. The only reason it was FOTN is because of Dillashaw, it was clear that Barao wasn't doing anything offensively to make it FOTN, he was just getting outworked 90% of the time.

- He says the ideal fight would be a rematch in Brazil. How so? Aside from there being an event in Brazil later this year, the only plus side to them fighting in Brazil is that Barao will be closer to home, which gives him multiple minor advantages. Saying, "Let's see if these guys are man enough to fight Barao in his house," is just laughable. He might as well say, "look, we can't beat you outside of our home country, so fight us in Brazil so we can get any and every advantage possible."

- He makes it sound as if the only reason Barao lost was because he was concussed in round 1 and was never able to recover. Well, how the fuck do you think that happened? Barao didn't slip on a banana peel. If you know your fighter isn't properly responding to you in between rounds, especially after he was knocked down and almost finished in round 1, you might want to rethink how you corner your fighters.


Brazilian fighters and their team are often described as being crybabies and make a ton of excuses after losses. Well, this is one of those moments.

As for the next person in line at Bantamweight, that is most likely going to be Raphael Assuncao. Assuncao won a split-decision in Brazil against Dillashaw, a fight where many people, including myself, thought Dillashaw won. Dillashaw/Assuncao #2 won't be held in Brazil, that's for sure.

andre was right about barao being rocked after the first and not the same fighter. of course hes a moron for demanding a rematch in brazil and trying to goad TJ into it.

from @mmaphilosophy on twitter

An explanation of why people are sometimes (apparently very!) confused about the significance and meaning of flash-KOs. Consider the following two scenarios: Scenario (I) It's Round 1 of an important fight. Fighter A (challenger) and Fighter B (title holder) are circling. Fighter B, the champion, is expected to win the fight. Suddenly, Fighter A steps in with a looping overhand right that connects with horrifying force on Fighter B's chin. Fighter B collapses to the ground, rolls onto his knees, weakly grabs Fighter A's ankle, and gets smashed twice in the ear. The referee steps in and stops the fight. Fighter B -- who is badly concussed -- loses his belt. Scenario (II) It's Round 1 of an important fight. Fighter A (challenger) and Fighter B (title holder) are circling. Fighter B, the champion, is expected to win the fight. Suddenly, Fighter A steps in with a looping overhand right that connects with horrifying force on Fighter B's chin. Fighter B collapses to the ground, rolls onto his knees, weakly grabs Fighter A's ankle, and gets smashed twice in the ear. (*Note that to this point, everything is absolutely identical.*) Just as Fighter B gets smashed for the second time in the ear, he manages to roll onto his back and secure an extremely loose half guard. Fighter B is badly concussed and operating on auto-pilot. He survives the round, but barely. His corner allows him to continue fighting on pure instinct for four more rounds, with badly impaired reaction times and no intelligible gameplan, due to his concussion. At no point in the fight was Fighter B a legitimate threat to Fighter A. At the end of the fight, Fighter B loses a lopsided decision. Some people would have you believe that the version of Fighter B in Scenario (I) would be *more* deserving of an immediately title rematch than the version of Fighter B in Scenario (II). They would claim that Fighter A proved his superiority in Scenario (II), but not in Scenario (I). That's fucking absurd. The crucial difference between the two scenarios is that in the first scenario Fighter B succumbs to the beating, while in the second scenario Fighter B summons the strength to carry his concussed, barely-present, totally useless husk of flesh around the ring for 20 extra minutes. It would be crazy of us to think less of Fighter B in Scenario (II) than in Scenario (I). My point in all of this isn't that Scenario (II) doesn't strongly count in favor of Fighter A's dominance. Instead, I'm making the opposite point: I'm saying that it's stupid to undervalue Fighter A's performance (or overvalue Fighter B's performance) in Scenario (I). Flash KOs are KOs, and unless they're controversial, they must be regarded as legitimate, meaningful wins. And, indeed, I think that (blatant controversy aside), they should often be judged as *more* meaningful than five-round shellackings. Of course, in real life it is never easy to tell whether a case falls neatly into one of the above categories. And I'm certainly not claiming that there are *no* cases in which a five-round pummelling proves more than a quick KO. (There are early stoppages and bad stoppages. There are five-round beatings where the losing fighter rather obviously isn't concussed to the point of proto-consciousness. And so on.) But none of that speaks against my point, since I'm not making an absolute claim.

given that there is nobody else that deserving of a title shot and barao is coming off 33 straight wins, i think he has earned it. getting rocked and almost finished in the first but surviving and then dominated for 4.5 rounds is NOT worse than getting dropped and finished in the first. assuncao getting the nod over dillashaw was BS. not to mention assuncao is boring as fuck.

On May 27 2014 02:47 Daut wrote: andre was right about barao being rocked after the first and not the same fighter. of course hes a moron for demanding a rematch in brazil and trying to goad TJ into it. + Show Spoiler + from @mmaphilosophy on twitter Show nested quote + An explanation of why people are sometimes (apparently very!) confused about the significance and meaning of flash-KOs. Consider the following two scenarios: Scenario (I) It's Round 1 of an important fight. Fighter A (challenger) and Fighter B (title holder) are circling. Fighter B, the champion, is expected to win the fight. Suddenly, Fighter A steps in with a looping overhand right that connects with horrifying force on Fighter B's chin. Fighter B collapses to the ground, rolls onto his knees, weakly grabs Fighter A's ankle, and gets smashed twice in the ear. The referee steps in and stops the fight. Fighter B -- who is badly concussed -- loses his belt. Scenario (II) It's Round 1 of an important fight. Fighter A (challenger) and Fighter B (title holder) are circling. Fighter B, the champion, is expected to win the fight. Suddenly, Fighter A steps in with a looping overhand right that connects with horrifying force on Fighter B's chin. Fighter B collapses to the ground, rolls onto his knees, weakly grabs Fighter A's ankle, and gets smashed twice in the ear. (*Note that to this point, everything is absolutely identical.*) Just as Fighter B gets smashed for the second time in the ear, he manages to roll onto his back and secure an extremely loose half guard. Fighter B is badly concussed and operating on auto-pilot. He survives the round, but barely. His corner allows him to continue fighting on pure instinct for four more rounds, with badly impaired reaction times and no intelligible gameplan, due to his concussion. At no point in the fight was Fighter B a legitimate threat to Fighter A. At the end of the fight, Fighter B loses a lopsided decision. Some people would have you believe that the version of Fighter B in Scenario (I) would be *more* deserving of an immediately title rematch than the version of Fighter B in Scenario (II). They would claim that Fighter A proved his superiority in Scenario (II), but not in Scenario (I). That's fucking absurd. The crucial difference between the two scenarios is that in the first scenario Fighter B succumbs to the beating, while in the second scenario Fighter B summons the strength to carry his concussed, barely-present, totally useless husk of flesh around the ring for 20 extra minutes. It would be crazy of us to think less of Fighter B in Scenario (II) than in Scenario (I). My point in all of this isn't that Scenario (II) doesn't strongly count in favor of Fighter A's dominance. Instead, I'm making the opposite point: I'm saying that it's stupid to undervalue Fighter A's performance (or overvalue Fighter B's performance) in Scenario (I). Flash KOs are KOs, and unless they're controversial, they must be regarded as legitimate, meaningful wins. And, indeed, I think that (blatant controversy aside), they should often be judged as *more* meaningful than five-round shellackings. Of course, in real life it is never easy to tell whether a case falls neatly into one of the above categories. And I'm certainly not claiming that there are *no* cases in which a five-round pummelling proves more than a quick KO. (There are early stoppages and bad stoppages. There are five-round beatings where the losing fighter rather obviously isn't concussed to the point of proto-consciousness. And so on.) But none of that speaks against my point, since I'm not making an absolute claim. given that there is nobody else that deserving of a title shot and barao is coming off 33 straight wins, i think he has earned it. getting rocked and almost finished in the first but surviving and then dominated for 4.5 rounds is NOT worse than getting dropped and finished in the first. assuncao getting the nod over dillashaw was BS. not to mention assuncao is boring as fuck.

Regarding an immediate rematch: There's 3 types of people.

- Those who say Barao shouldn't get a rematch because he was clearly dominated, and that Cain Velasquez had to fight once before getting a rematch versus JDS.

- The people who compare Barao to Anderson Silva and say that if Anderson got two immediate rematches, Barao should too.

- Then there's the people who say that Barao is nothing like Anderson, in that Barao's win-record consists of a bunch of random Brazilian fighters that he beat to pad his record, similar to what professional boxers do.

In my opinion, Raphael Assuncao should be next in line for Dillashaw. Dillashaw said he's okay fighting either Assuncao or Barao next. Also, Barao only defended his title 3 times in the UFC, so it's not like he was the longtime reigning champ that had stopped everybody in the UFC for many years. If Barao entered the UFC with a 10-0 record and then beat the same guys that he did, his record wouldn't be used as a tool for him getting an immediate rematch.

Hopefully Chad Mendes can beat Aldo; I'd expect to see an immediate rematch for that fight if Mendes won.

If Gus didn't get an immediate rematch after that controversial decision there is no way Barao should get one imo

barao vs cruz
dillashaw vs assuncao

FTW