We're living in a world that seems to get worse every day. We're the 80's/90's generation, and we're raised believing that everything is designed to grow/get better. Now, when things aren't going our way, we're easily getting disillusioned. We create or believe conspiracy theories to elucidate our "not-so-perfect-world". Sure, previous generations messed things up for us. Some people got extremely wealthy by doing unethical things. But we're the generation who's job it is to make things right. So stop fantasising and get a grip.
You're not a victim. No more reptilians/illuminati talk. The future is ours.
LikeASet United States. Jun 30 2012 19:44. Posts 2113
Word...
1. Give back to the community through meaningful and productive careers/philanthropy.
2. Treat people with respect even though much of the human population is ignorant and careless.
3. Stop raising spoiled ass children that grow up not knowing that the world is bigger than themselves.
4. Take part in your countries democratic processes.
In b4 someone sais voting is meaningless. For example I think if more people got off their asses in California, Prop 8 could have been turned down instead of passed through (A proposition in California that bans gay marriages). The votes for that proposition turned out basically a coinflip in slight favor of prop 8. Also other proposititions like the legalization of marijuana could have been passed etc. etc.
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dogmeat Czech Republic. Jun 30 2012 20:45. Posts 6374
democracy is bs
freedom > democracy
ban baal
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BILAT_POWER!!! Philippines. Jun 30 2012 21:08. Posts 1525
Lol. The earlier you get out of this 'phase' the happier in life you'll be.
On June 30 2012 20:08 BILAT_POWER!!! wrote:
Lol. The earlier you get out of this 'phase' the happier in life you'll be.
don't know which "phase" you're referring to, but I'm quite sure we're dealing with extraordinary circumstances. I guess you've seen it all before?
Js9s
Last edit: 30/06/2012 21:38
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BILAT_POWER!!! Philippines. Jun 30 2012 21:53. Posts 1525
Yup. And like you I felt the same way, like something must be done right now kinda shit. This was when I was younger. But then I dont know what happened. It was prolly triggered by my GF leaving me. I stopped caring. I partied hard but that got old so travelled/backpacked around the country on and off for two years.
Then I realized, everything is ok in life. For the first time I felt genuinely happy in years. I never let that go.
But Im not saying stop doing what you're doing. By all means do it. That is your path to self discovery. Good luck.
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BILAT_POWER!!! Philippines. Jun 30 2012 21:54. Posts 1525
Oh and it's a good thing you're doing all this now cos it would suck if you are at 'transitioning phase' at a later age which I've seen on some people I meet.
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bigredhoss Cook Islands. Jun 30 2012 22:02. Posts 8649
On June 30 2012 20:08 BILAT_POWER!!! wrote:
Lol. The earlier you get out of this 'phase' the happier in life you'll be.
don't know which "phase" you're referring to, but I'm quite sure we're dealing with extraordinary circumstances. I guess you've seen it all before?
i like the video and the message, but it's worth noting that it's a recurring theme in history for people of a given generation to view their era's issues as extraordinary and unique.
Truck-Crash Life
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BILAT_POWER!!! Philippines. Jun 30 2012 22:03. Posts 1525
On June 30 2012 18:44 LikeASet wrote:
2. Treat people with respect even though much of the human population is ignorant and careless.
3. Stop raising spoiled ass children that grow up not knowing that the world is bigger than themselves.
This is what I live by. Maybe I should have studied well and tried a little harder to get number 1, which honestly I regret not doing.
On June 30 2012 20:08 BILAT_POWER!!! wrote:
Lol. The earlier you get out of this 'phase' the happier in life you'll be.
don't know which "phase" you're referring to, but I'm quite sure we're dealing with extraordinary circumstances. I guess you've seen it all before?
i like the video and the message, but it's worth noting that it's a recurring theme in history for people of a given generation to view their era's issues as extraordinary and unique.
Well they really are. The world keeps changing, and we need the younger generation to make everyone aware and to slow down. But yeah, this goes on and on as we go. Which is good. The human race needs to keep itself going forward.
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BILAT_POWER!!! Philippines. Jun 30 2012 22:12. Posts 1525
On June 30 2012 21:05 Arirang wrote:
How's it feel like being perpetually 16 years old OP?
You started thinking about stuff at 16? What did you do about it?
Oh yay, another one of those "it's time to wake up!" videos. While I don't want to flame OP just for being childish and naive, I'll just say that this kind of video makes me nauseous.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
On June 30 2012 20:08 BILAT_POWER!!! wrote:
Lol. The earlier you get out of this 'phase' the happier in life you'll be.
don't know which "phase" you're referring to, but I'm quite sure we're dealing with extraordinary circumstances. I guess you've seen it all before?
i like the video and the message, but it's worth noting that it's a recurring theme in history for people of a given generation to view their era's issues as extraordinary and unique.
The human race needs to keep itself going forward.
Yeah, we need McDonald's and Wal-Mart stores on other planets, then we'll have something to be proud of.
On June 30 2012 20:53 BILAT_POWER!!! wrote:
Then I realized, everything is ok in life. For the first time I felt genuinely happy in years. I never let that go.
That sounds great. Except it's a stupid subjective view of things when in reality life is not 'okay'; it's a killing machine. And if you want to see it at work just spend some time on http://www.worldometers.info/. By the time I've written this over 30 people died of starvation alone. But it's good to know that you're happy.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
Last edit: 30/06/2012 22:35
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BILAT_POWER!!! Philippines. Jun 30 2012 22:26. Posts 1525
On June 30 2012 20:08 BILAT_POWER!!! wrote:
Lol. The earlier you get out of this 'phase' the happier in life you'll be.
don't know which "phase" you're referring to, but I'm quite sure we're dealing with extraordinary circumstances. I guess you've seen it all before?
i like the video and the message, but it's worth noting that it's a recurring theme in history for people of a given generation to view their era's issues as extraordinary and unique.
The human race needs to keep itself going forward.
Yeah, we need more McDonald's and Wal-Mart stores on other planets, then we'll have something to be proud of.
I see what you're saying but what are you doing about it?
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BILAT_POWER!!! Philippines. Jun 30 2012 22:27. Posts 1525
On June 30 2012 21:17 Loco wrote:
Oh yay, another one of those "it's time to wake up!" videos. While I don't want to flame OP just for being childish and naive, I'll just say that this kind of video makes me nauseous.
I see you went through the same as OP but came out from it... differently.
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bigredhoss Cook Islands. Jun 30 2012 22:29. Posts 8649
On June 30 2012 20:08 BILAT_POWER!!! wrote:
Lol. The earlier you get out of this 'phase' the happier in life you'll be.
don't know which "phase" you're referring to, but I'm quite sure we're dealing with extraordinary circumstances. I guess you've seen it all before?
i like the video and the message, but it's worth noting that it's a recurring theme in history for people of a given generation to view their era's issues as extraordinary and unique.
Well they really are. The world keeps changing, and we need the younger generation to make everyone aware and to slow down. But yeah, this goes on and on as we go. Which is good. The human race needs to keep itself going forward.
i mean, i guess they're unique in the sense that evolution always creates more solutions along with more "problems" (or at least always has up to this point), but the stature of the problems (relative to our increasing abilities to deal with them) usually isn't unique in the context of history the way some people think it is.
Truck-Crash Life
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BILAT_POWER!!! Philippines. Jun 30 2012 22:31. Posts 1525
Yup. It goes on and on and on. It's pretty normal. Everyone went through this way of thinking at some point in their lives, and hopefully come out as better people after it.
On June 30 2012 20:08 BILAT_POWER!!! wrote:
Lol. The earlier you get out of this 'phase' the happier in life you'll be.
don't know which "phase" you're referring to, but I'm quite sure we're dealing with extraordinary circumstances. I guess you've seen it all before?
i like the video and the message, but it's worth noting that it's a recurring theme in history for people of a given generation to view their era's issues as extraordinary and unique.
The human race needs to keep itself going forward.
Yeah, we need more McDonald's and Wal-Mart stores on other planets, then we'll have something to be proud of.
I see what you're saying but what are you doing about it?
You clearly don't see what I'm saying if you ask me such a stupid question.
"By all evidence we are in the world to do nothing." Try to meditate on that.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
Last edit: 30/06/2012 22:34
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BILAT_POWER!!! Philippines. Jun 30 2012 22:39. Posts 1525
On June 30 2012 20:08 BILAT_POWER!!! wrote:
Lol. The earlier you get out of this 'phase' the happier in life you'll be.
don't know which "phase" you're referring to, but I'm quite sure we're dealing with extraordinary circumstances. I guess you've seen it all before?
i like the video and the message, but it's worth noting that it's a recurring theme in history for people of a given generation to view their era's issues as extraordinary and unique.
The human race needs to keep itself going forward.
Yeah, we need more McDonald's and Wal-Mart stores on other planets, then we'll have something to be proud of.
I see what you're saying but what are you doing about it?
You clearly don't see what I'm saying if you ask me such a stupid question.
"By all evidence we are in the world to do nothing." Try to meditate on that.
Did I say you should do something about it? You were the one who mentioned McDonalds and Walmart as if implying something.
I don't know which part you didn't understand, but I quoted you saying we "needed to go forward", and I responded in an ironic fashion to show the absurdity of your statement. As in, no, we don't need to go and habitate other planets and spread our stupidity and exploitative nature there, clearly.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
Damn, she speaks really well for someone who has never heard before. My girl friend is 100% deaf and she lost her hearing when she was 13 and even she doesn't speak that clearly.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
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BILAT_POWER!!! Philippines. Jun 30 2012 23:01. Posts 1525
Did I say going forward means to habitate other planets and spread our 'stupidity and exploitative' ways? You are the one implying there is something really wrong with human society but also believe that we're here to do nothing.
On June 30 2012 22:01 BILAT_POWER!!! wrote:
Did I say going forward means to habitate other planets and spread our 'stupidity and exploitative' ways? You are the one implying there is something really wrong with human society but also believe that we're here to do nothing.
I am not implying anything, I am stating a fact. Our existence is completely meaningless and unnecessary; thus, we are here to do nothing. We just happen to suffer if we do nothing because of our evolutionary programming, so we can't do nothing for very long. Unless you are religious and you deny abiogenesis you don't have any reason to disagree here.
You didn't have to say it, many people think that this is the next big step forward for humanity.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
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BILAT_POWER!!! Philippines. Jun 30 2012 23:21. Posts 1525
I do not agree or disagree with your beliefs. What I do believe in tho, is just to be happy the best way I can be with my own life. I respect your beliefs, and I am not here to impose mine on you or anyone. That is wrong.
I also believe in resolving all that is conflicting in yourself. Like I had a cousin who was really cool, but noticed as we got older he became hateful about everything, blaming society, the govt. etc etc... He different from what he was. Then later I found out he came out and was actually gay. And after that he was cool with everything again. He told me the most difficult thing to do was to admit to himself that he was gay. Until people resolve their inner conflicts, you cant be truly happy.
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BILAT_POWER!!! Philippines. Jun 30 2012 23:29. Posts 1525
In a way he was trying get into these pseudo beliefs to escape the fact that he had to admit he is gay. When he finally came out he started believing that there is really a higher 'something', like a power or a god. He started being a believer again and is happy for it.
You're really smart and everything loco, but you're a bit of a pessimist, I watched through most of the stuff you link to, or browse, skim books you casually mention. It's a bit over the top, the words you are using now is also "useless" if you "meditate" on it a little bit. After all, it's just chemicals and electrical currents n shit flowing through your brain. When you zoom out and "think" about everything, it's breath-takingly amazing, and not "we're not here to do anything". And if we're here to not do anything, why are you doing something?
So I usually read what you write, then I "spice" it up a bit, and I feel that kinda hit the marks, you're maybe 63% too negative. (But don't change, I respect you equally much regardless xD)
(What I was thinking about was that nihilistic video you posted in one of Tutz blogs. It's all a bit over the top, don't think it's good for any brain to get too consumed in that way of thinking).
One that comes to mind was the Roman Empire one "blabla, proof that all great civilizations come to dust" something along those lines, a bit over the top, kinda have to smile and close the link. Although I do like to contemplate and think in those thoughts for awhile, try to really "feel it", just to get a sense for it, then put on some pink glasses, to get both sides.
Hmm, I'm not really saying much here, might be trying to be too polite, not to hurt your feelings xD
I'd still go back to my gay cousin story if I see someone pessimistic and conflicted. Cos I've seen every stage of his process into becoming and the coming out of who he really is.
On June 30 2012 22:21 BILAT_POWER!!! wrote:
I do not agree or disagree with your beliefs. What I do believe in tho, is just to be happy the best way I can be with my own life. I respect your beliefs, and I am not here to impose mine on you or anyone. That is wrong.
Again, this is the problem. I am not speaking about my beliefs but about the actual fact that our existence has been revealed to us as just being some fluke and completely meaningless. Do you understand how this is the truth of things? You seem to be deliberately avoiding to concede it because here you are making everything into subjective opinion. Every human being acts as if he is the one fixed point in the Universe, just like you are doing right here, and this is exactly why humanity will not "go forward". Other than with technological progress, we are built to fail as a species. Just like any other species before us we will go extinct and nothing no one will have ever done will have actually mattered.
'The Wisdom of Life' Section 26:
"Most men are so thoroughly subjective that nothing really interests them but themselves. They always think of their own case as soon as ever any remark is made, and their whole attention is engrossed and absorbed by the merest chance reference to anything which affects them personally, be it never so remote: with the result that they have no power left for forming an objective view of things, should the conversation take that turn; neither can they admit any validity in arguments which tell against their interest or their vanity."
On June 30 2012 22:21 BILAT_POWER!!! wrote:
I also believe in resolving all that is conflicting in yourself. Like I had a cousin who was really cool, but noticed as we got older he became hateful about everything, blaming society, the govt. etc etc... He different from what he was. Then later I found out he came out and was actually gay. And after that he was cool with everything again. He told me the most difficult thing to do was to admit to himself that he was gay. Until people resolve their inner conflicts, you cant be truly happy.
Why is this important to mention? You're implying that I am the way I am (too pessimistic I suppose) because I can't truly accept who I am. But this has nothing to do with anything.... at all. Your cousin was someone with low self-esteem who depended on what other people thought of him to generate his self-worth because he was no-one in his own eyes. That's the only reason people hide who they are (and to themselves, too!). And while I would tend to agree with you on the last line, I have come to understand that the people who "face their own demons" and resolve them and claim happiness at a young age simply had very weak demons and their happiness is actually very frail and it is just a matter of time before time destroys every illusion they had constructed for themselves. For a human being to be made "whole", he needs to do much more than accept his Ego as it is, he needs to destroy it completely. I am so absolutely certain of this that if the person I esteem the most tried to convince me otherwise I would suddenly take him for a complete fool.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
On June 30 2012 23:07 BILAT_POWER!!! wrote:
Just a funny thought. Loco, when you say we are here to do nothing, you mean absolutely nothing? Just eat, drink, shit, fuck nothing?
I wish everyone actually believed and followed this cos I'd definitely be doing something if they did.
I say nothing more than what I said. That by all evidence we are here to do nothing. It means nothing more than that we have no purpose down here, objectively speaking. The purposes that people give themselves to make their lives meaningful is something else, and sure, I would say that there is better to do than eating, drinking, shitting and fucking. And I sure am glad not all people are swine who only care about these things.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
On June 30 2012 22:29 BILAT_POWER!!! wrote:
In a way he was trying get into these pseudo beliefs to escape the fact that he had to admit he is gay. When he finally came out he started believing that there is really a higher 'something', like a power or a god. He started being a believer again and is happy for it.
He had these beliefs because he couldn't admit the truth to himself because the truth fucking sucked in his eyes. Now he has these new beliefs about a 'higher power' for the same fucking reason. The more deluded and ignorant you are, the more happy you are probably going to be. Your cousin is not an example to follow, I don't know why you think he is.
"So long as man is protected by madness, he functions, and flourishes."
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
I'm just passing by and might die anytime soon so I'd rather do things that make me happy now and spend time with all the good people around me while their still around cos they are gonna die anytime too.
Oh and I'm not implying you're gay, pessimistic or whatever. Just stating a fact that my cousin isntt as hardcore to the stuff that he used be hardcore with after the acceptance of being gay.
You're really smart and everything loco, but you're a bit of a pessimist, I watched through most of the stuff you link to, or browse, skim books you casually mention. It's a bit over the top, the words you are using now is also "useless" if you "meditate" on it a little bit. After all, it's just chemicals and electrical currents n shit flowing through your brain. When you zoom out and "think" about everything, it's breath-takingly amazing, and not "we're not here to do anything". And if we're here to not do anything, why are you doing something?
I have already answered that last bit. I am doing something because to be is to do. No animal simply stays still for all its lifetime waiting to expire and go back to being the dust it once was. I am evolutionary programmed to need and seek certain things out, and my abstention from these things would simply lead to suffering to a point that would become too unbearable if prolonged.
Yes, it can be "breath-takingly amazing", but only for as long as you are not seeing or experiencing the darker side of it all, the price that is being paid daily by other consciousnesses for you to be currently enjoying your experience. For as long as it is concealed from you it will be possible. But it will not be breath-takingly amazing if you are observing a child in a third-world country having its face eaten alive by bugs, or a pet dog being brutally beaten to death by some cruel redneck, or some elderly woman having such a gigantic tumor in her face that it gouges one of her eyes out. But this has little impact upon reading, so let's use pictures instead.
Here you have Joseph Merrick, also known as the 'Elephant Man'. He was made into a freak show and survived for a while earning money from his exhibitions until his illness killed him. Do you think this person (or any other with Elephantiasis) ever woke up in the morning and thought "this is breath-takingly amazing! I am so glad to be here."? Assuming this person isn't very happy with his existence, would you blame this person for being too pessimistic about life? Would you link him to your pathetic sites on self-improvement and teach him how to avoid negative thoughts?
On June 30 2012 23:10 Mariuslol wrote:
So I usually read what you write, then I "spice" it up a bit, and I feel that kinda hit the marks, you're maybe 63% too negative. (But don't change, I respect you equally much regardless xD)
(What I was thinking about was that nihilistic video you posted in one of Tutz blogs. It's all a bit over the top, don't think it's good for any brain to get too consumed in that way of thinking).
One that comes to mind was the Roman Empire one "blabla, proof that all great civilizations come to dust" something along those lines, a bit over the top, kinda have to smile and close the link. Although I do like to contemplate and think in those thoughts for awhile, try to really "feel it", just to get a sense for it, then put on some pink glasses, to get both sides.
Hmm, I'm not really saying much here, might be trying to be too polite, not to hurt your feelings xD
Well, you said it yourself, you think that putting on pink glasses is the way to go. I don't. I don't believe in putting any glasses on. I certainly don't believe self-deception amounts to anything of value. And I have also deepened things to a point where self-deception is a very hard thing to accomplish, whereas it comes to most very easily. I also have enough strength to not only look at things as they really are but also to keep doing so, so I guess that's one of the differences between our approach to life.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
On July 01 2012 00:34 BILAT_POWER!!! wrote:
Ok so its a fact.
...
I'm just passing by and might die anytime soon so I'd rather do things that make me happy now and spend time with all the good people around me while their still around cos they are gonna die anytime too.
Oh and I'm not implying you're gay, pessimistic or whatever. Just stating a fact that my cousin isntt as hardcore to the stuff that he used be hardcore with after the acceptance of being gay.
Isn't that what most people want anyway? To be happy? To live in the present, to care for people and have people care for them? It's just the way people go about these things that differ. I am no different from you in desiring these things. But human stupidity and evil will not go anywhere, and these pointless inspirational videos are not going to help humanity "move forward" as you said. People have never had their shit together, what makes you think they eventually will?
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
On July 01 2012 00:34 BILAT_POWER!!! wrote:
Ok so its a fact.
...
I'm just passing by and might die anytime soon so I'd rather do things that make me happy now and spend time with all the good people around me while their still around cos they are gonna die anytime too.
Oh and I'm not implying you're gay, pessimistic or whatever. Just stating a fact that my cousin isntt as hardcore to the stuff that he used be hardcore with after the acceptance of being gay.
Isn't that what most people want anyway? To be happy? To live in the present, to care for people and have people care for them? It's just the way people go about these things that differ. I am no different from you in desiring these things.
Yup, no use going into the world is this or that. We all die and that's it. So right now, dont worry be happy.
On July 01 2012 01:05 Loco wrote:
I am not very fit for traveling.
I wish you did. Cos where I'm from, the people having the hardest life still find it easy to smile.
I know that. In many ways adversity makes people appreciate life more. Self-pity is mostly a spoiled person trait. That doesn't take away from the awful conditions they are in, and the fact that it's not okay, that a lot of shit just isn't okay, and that people lie to themselves about it all and shut it out of their world because otherwise their lives aren't bearable.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
On July 01 2012 01:05 Loco wrote:
I am not very fit for traveling.
I wish you did. Cos where I'm from, the people having the hardest life still find it easy to smile.
I know that. In many ways adversity makes people appreciate life more. Self-pity is mostly a spoiled person trait. That doesn't take away from the awful conditions they are in, and the fact that it's not okay, that a lot of shit just isn't okay, and that people lie to themselves about it all and shut it out of their world because otherwise their lives aren't bearable.
Theres no 'its ok or not ok' with it. Its just the way it is.
On July 01 2012 01:05 Loco wrote:
I am not very fit for traveling.
I wish you did. Cos where I'm from, the people having the hardest life still find it easy to smile.
I know that. In many ways adversity makes people appreciate life more. Self-pity is mostly a spoiled person trait. That doesn't take away from the awful conditions they are in, and the fact that it's not okay, that a lot of shit just isn't okay, and that people lie to themselves about it all and shut it out of their world because otherwise their lives aren't bearable.
Theres no 'its ok or not ok' with it. Its just the way it is.
That's at least your second cliché with "don't worry be happy". It's easy to say and even agree with when shielded from the horrors, but the truth of it your senses will let you know when you see them. Some things just will never feel okay, natural or otherwise.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
No I see it everyday right in front of me. I do charity work for homeless kids with my wife. Lets say we just dont go deep into it and just act and do what we can to help the ones in need.
Better that than thinking and talking about a lot of 'stuff' from books.
And you talk about horrors and all that stuff. Let me ask you this, what did you do to make things better for yourself and the 'horrors' around you?
Cos you're from Canada and I think you are far far away from the real horrors you talk about yet you delve into it. You remind me of my gay cousin who was really hardcore about nihilism. But when he finally admitted he was gay he just let all that stuff go and went on to being himself.
Not this again... again just more stuff about your personal life and your stupid gay cousin who has probably never opened a philosophy book in his life and yet you judge that he was "hardcore into nihilism". Someone who is into nihilism doesn't come out the other side with a "but there must be a higher power!"-mentality, so no. I'm done trying to have any reasonable discussion with you because you can't help but get personal about things and you keep getting everything wrong. I've already told you what I meant by "we are here to do nothing" and it has nothing to do with actually doing nothing in day to day life, and yet you are now trying to use it this way against me to paint a picture of you living a noble life serving the ones in need while I do nothing. Very dishonest and also self-righteous.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
Nono. I am just stating that you really remind me of him before he came out of the closet. He used to tell me all the stuff you are telling me now and we would argue about it all night long. Then years later he came out and told everyone he was gay. Then at times we still talk but his views arent the same. So I assume all that being a 'nihilist' was some sort of escape cos he still couldnt admit he was gay at the time.
You reminded me of him thats all.
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K40Cheddar United States. Jul 01 2012 03:54. Posts 2202
GG
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Stroggoz New Zealand. Jul 01 2012 04:34. Posts 5365
On July 01 2012 01:19 whamm! wrote:
This thrad is quite depressing
not for me
One of 3 non decent human beings on a site of 5 people with between 2-3 decent human beings
On June 30 2012 21:05 Arirang wrote:
How's it feel like being perpetually 16 years old OP?
I actually understand why you say that, but I think you're wrong. The post seems childish, but I don't think I am. Though, I do have a disregard for cheap oneliners. Felt better about yourself while posting that?
Anyway, I'm just sick of the negative thoughts, the crap on the internet, the discussions with friends where I'm the negative prick.
I just rather am "naive" and work on a future that might collapse some day, than being negative and not getting shit done right now.
On June 30 2012 23:11 Mariuslol wrote:
^ All of that is a bunch of my opinions, that's aaaalll it iz
Having written a bunch of things and then using the "it's my opinion" bs just shows where you are at intellectually. Instead of trying to demean Loco you should be thanking him. He constantly gives people insight into and disects the problems so well one must make an effort to misinterprit his intentions. He basicly destroyed hours of your efforts with one sentence. + Show Spoiler +
"Would you link him to your pathetic sites on self-improvement..."
I guess people just want to participate in a tug-of-war with Loco for different reasons.
Yeah but if you are only expressing your opinions (no matter how irrelveant, poorly argumented, plain stupid) you can never be wrong and ride a unicorn to the end of the rainbow to greet the leprechaun that holds a pot of fools gold.
Oh cmon loco. Yes we are not here for anything, there is no grand purpose. The world is in many ways a dark and evil place. But there is also happiness and beauty and things are in many ways getting better. Not saying that will keep going forever but we do live in the least violent of times and many 3rd world countries are making extraordinary progress.These changes in the world are many times driven forward by people believing we can make the world better(an attitude that you obv despise).
You might be "right" and they might be wrong, naive disillusional or w/e but I will still side with them any day. So what if our existence is meaningless, me and and majority of the worlds population are still happy to be experiencing it.
well it seems like this thread has turned into a philosophical well for Loco =)
One think I'd like to suggest though, is that while I find the things about the absence of meaning in life to be true, the optimistic or pessimistic way to look at it is in the eye of the beholder.
Where one sees the absence of meaning as devastating the other can see it as an opportunity to get rid of the need of meaning completely (based on the idea that it's a metaphysical concept spread widely by Christianity)
Nietzsche and Schopenhauer, two philosophical monsters of similar intellectual personalities, reach impressively opposite conclusions... One stands for life/self affirmation in an even aggressive manner, the other one for accepting existence as the greatest of evils,with the Buddhist monk presented as an ethical ideal of life.
Take your pick gentlemen, I find myself closer to N. for various reasons, also if I ever played diablo3 even there I'd prefer a warrior over a monk's avatar =O
new shit has come to light... a-and... shit! man...
as always i like to play a bit of freedom/choice/action/attitude devil's advocate.
re: elephant man
There is no denying that that would be a pretty shitty starting point/situation but he certainly had the opportunity to parlay that into making some scratch and trying to find some meaning. He could find an elephant woman or women w/ elephant man fetishes online, join a freak show circuit and make some friends, w/e he wants to try and experience, accomplish, acquire, build.
Starving kids in Africa is much tougher. How much reason, agency, responsibility can small children really have?
When faced with that reality it's hard to know what to think especially since most people, myself included, "delude" themselves by just not thinking about it. Changing the channel or riding a different ride like I have said in previous posts.
Currently, I have about 0 impact utility wise on making any sort of dent in that situation. I could make it my life's work to try and become a famous billionaire so i would have some impact utility wise in changing the situation but the situation is still probably going to be shitty. That sounds extremely frustrating and depressing.
Life can be extremely frustrating and depressing no matter what you do so I just try to take the evidence and information available and try and make choices based on that evidence/information that lead to the opposite of frustrating and depressing outcomes.
As always, we don't exist, then we do, then we don't but it certainly doesn't seem meaningless while spending time in that place you want to be, doing those things you want to be doing with people (or lack of people) you want to be with.
It comes down to semantics:
Does occupation/transcendence/losing ones' self = delusion?
Does occupying a consciousness with fun, enjoyable, stimulating, passionate occupation/meaning = deluding ones' self?
Can one find "meaning" in a "meaningless" existence?
Loco I usually agree with a lot of the stuff you are saying, but I have a hard time with your claim that life is meaningless for a fact. Of course this is no fact, as in a self evident fact, it is your claim, nothing more, it certainly isn't a fact.
What is a fact? and how do you verify that your fact is also my fact? You can't and you will never be able to, due to our subjective experience. Your life might be meaningless while your neighbour finds a lot of meaning in his life. Even if there was no meaning, it is still an experience, which provides a meaning in itself, namely that of an experience.
We think we are so smart, but we are nothing in the big picture, life is so much bigger than us and our tiny earth. Open you eyes and mind, and be amazed of this complexity we call life and existence. We have only scratched the surface of knowledge, there is an endless world with endless possibilities to explore out there.
Take a word of advice and a lesson in humility from good old Socrates who said "scio me nihil scire" "I know that I know nothing".
I started out with nothing and I still got most of it left
You're really smart and everything loco, but you're a bit of a pessimist, I watched through most of the stuff you link to, or browse, skim books you casually mention. It's a bit over the top, the words you are using now is also "useless" if you "meditate" on it a little bit. After all, it's just chemicals and electrical currents n shit flowing through your brain. When you zoom out and "think" about everything, it's breath-takingly amazing, and not "we're not here to do anything". And if we're here to not do anything, why are you doing something?
I have already answered that last bit. I am doing something because to be is to do. No animal simply stays still for all its lifetime waiting to expire and go back to being the dust it once was. I am evolutionary programmed to need and seek certain things out, and my abstention from these things would simply lead to suffering to a point that would become too unbearable if prolonged.
Yes, it can be "breath-takingly amazing", but only for as long as you are not seeing or experiencing the darker side of it all, the price that is being paid daily by other consciousnesses for you to be currently enjoying your experience. For as long as it is concealed from you it will be possible. But it will not be breath-takingly amazing if you are observing a child in a third-world country having its face eaten alive by bugs, or a pet dog being brutally beaten to death by some cruel redneck, or some elderly woman having such a gigantic tumor in her face that it gouges one of her eyes out. But this has little impact upon reading, so let's use pictures instead.
Here you have Joseph Merrick, also known as the 'Elephant Man'. He was made into a freak show and survived for a while earning money from his exhibitions until his illness killed him. Do you think this person (or any other with Elephantiasis) ever woke up in the morning and thought "this is breath-takingly amazing! I am so glad to be here."? Assuming this person isn't very happy with his existence, would you blame this person for being too pessimistic about life? Would you link him to your pathetic sites on self-improvement and teach him how to avoid negative thoughts?
On June 30 2012 23:10 Mariuslol wrote:
So I usually read what you write, then I "spice" it up a bit, and I feel that kinda hit the marks, you're maybe 63% too negative. (But don't change, I respect you equally much regardless xD)
(What I was thinking about was that nihilistic video you posted in one of Tutz blogs. It's all a bit over the top, don't think it's good for any brain to get too consumed in that way of thinking).
One that comes to mind was the Roman Empire one "blabla, proof that all great civilizations come to dust" something along those lines, a bit over the top, kinda have to smile and close the link. Although I do like to contemplate and think in those thoughts for awhile, try to really "feel it", just to get a sense for it, then put on some pink glasses, to get both sides.
Hmm, I'm not really saying much here, might be trying to be too polite, not to hurt your feelings xD
Well, you said it yourself, you think that putting on pink glasses is the way to go. I don't. I don't believe in putting any glasses on. I certainly don't believe self-deception amounts to anything of value. And I have also deepened things to a point where self-deception is a very hard thing to accomplish, whereas it comes to most very easily. I also have enough strength to not only look at things as they really are but also to keep doing so, so I guess that's one of the differences between our approach to life.
What's with the pictures? Stephen Hawking? My point still stand, but thanks for going out of your way trying to be a dick (felt an insult here was okay), hiding it in your fluent linguistics.
Insinuating I've not seen or experienced the darker side of it all, just words, for all you know, I might have.
And I wouldn't post a link to any of these people to my pathetic sites on self-improvement.(This is interesting, you usually don't go out of your way being a dick, wonder what nerve was hit, and you're like everybody else, except with better grammar lol).
I would feel compassion and empathy toward their situation.
Reason I need to put on pink glasses is because, much like you, but not to the same extent, I am a pessimist, I scrutinize, I find faults, I dissect, I take apart. So when something happens, or I try and analyze a situation, I know I'm overly critical, so if I take a step back, do it again, with "pink glasses" I kinda hit closer to the actual mark.
Aaaand toward the end, meh, not sure if I want to reply lol, more camouflaged insults, assumptions pulled out of your ass (another insult here for making it even) and "crap".
Don't like you trying to compare our life's approaches. You look at things "as they really are" with the knowledge and beliefs you already have, that isn't any different from what I am doing.
Your self deception is probably far deeper than mine, I just can't articulate it as convincingly as you over a forum. Nor do I go out of my way trying to do so. Most of my life I've followed what I felt was Real, even though everyone around me said/did the contrary. I never needed books, people, teachers, shit like that to show me, I just felt it. Most of the time that is lol.
EDIT: I don't feel motivated, or excited enough to put in more effort than roughly 17% when talking on the forums (a couple of times I have mustered up a little more, maybe 25%), but I "feel" I'm pretty spot on in my assessment on you as a person Loco. And I felt bad for not taking what you put quite a bit of effort into explaining seriously. So I decided to "study" a little bit on something I feel was related to you. And I made another "pathetic blog", at least when I do that I put in more than 60% effort, and I feel that's a sign of respect <3
Ps, the sentence above isn't an insult. But in my head I feel you'll take it as one, maybe 60% sure you would.
On June 30 2012 23:11 Mariuslol wrote:
^ All of that is a bunch of my opinions, that's aaaalll it iz
Having written a bunch of things and then using the "it's my opinion" bs just shows where you are at intellectually. Instead of trying to demean Loco you should be thanking him. He constantly gives people insight into and disects the problems so well one must make an effort to misinterprit his intentions. He basicly destroyed hours of your efforts with one sentence. + Show Spoiler +
"Would you link him to your pathetic sites on self-improvement..."
I guess people just want to participate in a tug-of-war with Loco for different reasons.
It's their end phrase in every episode, I just say it as a personal lul to myself. T_T, nice to see you've decided to be a bit of a douche lately though =p
"That's aaaaalll it iz, just advice man... YOU CAN DO WHATEVER THE FUUCK, you wanna do" <-----
On July 01 2012 09:22 RiKD wrote:
There is no denying that that would be a pretty shitty starting point/situation but he certainly had the opportunity to parlay that into making some scratch and trying to find some meaning. He could find an elephant woman or women w/ elephant man fetishes online, join a freak show circuit and make some friends, w/e he wants to try and experience, accomplish, acquire, build.
that would be so brutal though, according to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proteus_syndrome there's currently about 120 people living with that disorder. say half of them are women, so he's down to 60 potential mates. then let's say 10 of the elephant women are out of his league, and 10 of them are undesirable due to pointy elbows and so on.
he's down to 40 potential partners, so if he just goes on 2 dates with different girls and they both fail he's already eliminated 5% of his potential partners. that's a lot of pressure, plus he probably has a higher rate of failure due to confidence/self-image issues, fuck his life.
On July 01 2012 09:22 RiKD wrote:
There is no denying that that would be a pretty shitty starting point/situation but he certainly had the opportunity to parlay that into making some scratch and trying to find some meaning. He could find an elephant woman or women w/ elephant man fetishes online, join a freak show circuit and make some friends, w/e he wants to try and experience, accomplish, acquire, build.
that would be so brutal though, according to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proteus_syndrome there's currently about 120 people living with that disorder. say half of them are women, so he's down to 60 potential mates. then let's say 10 of the elephant women are out of his league, and 10 of them are undesirable due to pointy elbows and so on.
he's down to 40 potential partners, so if he just goes on 2 dates with different girls and they both fail he's already eliminated 5% of his potential partners. that's a lot of pressure, plus he probably has a higher rate of failure due to confidence/self-image issues, fuck his life.
"Lymphatic filariasis affects over 120 million people, primarily in Africa and South-East Asia, with about 40 million disfigured and incapacitated by the disease."
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
On July 01 2012 10:33 Zorglub wrote:
Loco I usually agree with a lot of the stuff you are saying, but I have a hard time with your claim that life is meaningless for a fact. Of course this is no fact, as in a self evident fact, it is your claim, nothing more, it certainly isn't a fact.
What is a fact? and how do you verify that your fact is also my fact? You can't and you will never be able to, due to our subjective experience. Your life might be meaningless while your neighbour finds a lot of meaning in his life. Even if there was no meaning, it is still an experience, which provides a meaning in itself, namely that of an experience.
We think we are so smart, but we are nothing in the big picture, life is so much bigger than us and our tiny earth. Open you eyes and mind, and be amazed of this complexity we call life and existence. We have only scratched the surface of knowledge, there is an endless world with endless possibilities to explore out there.
Take a word of advice and a lesson in humility from good old Socrates who said "scio me nihil scire" "I know that I know nothing".
So do you then deny abiogenesis? The origin of life is pretty clear where we stand on the meaning scale. Unless you have a God to delude yourself with, I don't understand why you would tell me that it is my opinion that life is meaningless. It's as objective as it gets. What is a fact? We exist only due to a rare incident that happened some 3.5+ billion years ago. The right chemicals being there at the right time to create organic matter out of inorganic matter. And as far as we know it was never reproduced again in the entire known universe. What is another fact? Evolution by natural selection. The thing that seperates us from our ancestors is our level of self-awareness and the fact that it leads to a conscience of death. But is this accepted? No. People live in fear and denial of their mortality at every waking second. The only way to function is to be unaware of the fact that you will cease to exist and that you are a construction of atoms that, when disassembled, have absolutely no significance in the universe. Yes, the absurdity of being human! Living is only possible if we find meaning in our lives, and true meaning can never be found, since the universe doesn't have room for any.
I don't think we are so smart, I think we're fucking stupid, weak, and corrupt animals, eating, shitting and distracting our way to extinction. Some people have been very smart and have led us to great insights about the world we live in, though, and it is an insult to them to think the Socrates quote applies to everything. We do know more than we needed to know about our condition. And what's next in store? Lovecraft had a nice thought about it: "Life is a hideous thing, and from the background behind what we know of it peer daemoniacal hints of truth which make it sometimes a thousandfold more hideous. Science, already oppressive with its shocking revelations, will perhaps be the ultimate exterminator of our human species — if separate species we be — for its reserve of unguessed horrors could never be borne by mortal brains if loosed upon the world."
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
as always i like to play a bit of freedom/choice/action/attitude devil's advocate.
re: elephant man
There is no denying that that would be a pretty shitty starting point/situation but he certainly had the opportunity to parlay that into making some scratch and trying to find some meaning. He could find an elephant woman or women w/ elephant man fetishes online, join a freak show circuit and make some friends, w/e he wants to try and experience, accomplish, acquire, build.
Starving kids in Africa is much tougher. How much reason, agency, responsibility can small children really have?
When faced with that reality it's hard to know what to think especially since most people, myself included, "delude" themselves by just not thinking about it. Changing the channel or riding a different ride like I have said in previous posts.
Currently, I have about 0 impact utility wise on making any sort of dent in that situation. I could make it my life's work to try and become a famous billionaire so i would have some impact utility wise in changing the situation but the situation is still probably going to be shitty. That sounds extremely frustrating and depressing.
Life can be extremely frustrating and depressing no matter what you do so I just try to take the evidence and information available and try and make choices based on that evidence/information that lead to the opposite of frustrating and depressing outcomes.
As always, we don't exist, then we do, then we don't but it certainly doesn't seem meaningless while spending time in that place you want to be, doing those things you want to be doing with people (or lack of people) you want to be with.
It comes down to semantics:
Does occupation/transcendence/losing ones' self = delusion?
Does occupying a consciousness with fun, enjoyable, stimulating, passionate occupation/meaning = deluding ones' self?
Can one find "meaning" in a "meaningless" existence?
following a naturalistic approach on altruism and consequently on sympathy/pity for others one reaches the conclusion that some sort of egoism is always behind them. Meaning that there really is no action that is truly altruistic/sympathetic at all.
Sympathy/pity do have positive aspects in several instances, but to metaphysically name them the moral compass of any action that is good and then to frown upon the world that doesn't work this way and deny life in it's entirety - like Schopenhauer did - is not self evident at all (for me at least). Nietzsche on the other hand with his tragic optimism treats pity like poison (maybe even goes too far with this) and concludes that yes, life is shitty and troubling etc, but one should fight all the hardships like a warrior, even without hope; the strong man should laugh at the obstacles fate brings upon him and never give up
new shit has come to light... a-and... shit! man...
as always i like to play a bit of freedom/choice/action/attitude devil's advocate.
re: elephant man
There is no denying that that would be a pretty shitty starting point/situation but he certainly had the opportunity to parlay that into making some scratch and trying to find some meaning. He could find an elephant woman or women w/ elephant man fetishes online, join a freak show circuit and make some friends, w/e he wants to try and experience, accomplish, acquire, build.
Starving kids in Africa is much tougher. How much reason, agency, responsibility can small children really have?
When faced with that reality it's hard to know what to think especially since most people, myself included, "delude" themselves by just not thinking about it. Changing the channel or riding a different ride like I have said in previous posts.
Currently, I have about 0 impact utility wise on making any sort of dent in that situation. I could make it my life's work to try and become a famous billionaire so i would have some impact utility wise in changing the situation but the situation is still probably going to be shitty. That sounds extremely frustrating and depressing.
Life can be extremely frustrating and depressing no matter what you do so I just try to take the evidence and information available and try and make choices based on that evidence/information that lead to the opposite of frustrating and depressing outcomes.
As always, we don't exist, then we do, then we don't but it certainly doesn't seem meaningless while spending time in that place you want to be, doing those things you want to be doing with people (or lack of people) you want to be with.
It comes down to semantics:
Does occupation/transcendence/losing ones' self = delusion?
Does occupying a consciousness with fun, enjoyable, stimulating, passionate occupation/meaning = deluding ones' self?
Can one find "meaning" in a "meaningless" existence?
There is no parlaying. There is no winning here. I'm a bit shocked that you would think the Elephant Man could have had a life worth living. He was exploited until his death and lived most of his life in horrible pain, emotional and physical. Would you really want to 'make-do' as someone like him? I don't think so. If you want to look at life as a game, it is a zero-sum game. And it is one rough lottery. But there is nothing to be won in this lottery. The only thing every alive thing can do is reduce its amount of suffering imposed on itself from being born into the world. Every moment is an escape from the present moment, a projection into the future, an imagining of what one ought to get in order to be satiated. All motivation is born from deprivation. A deprived state of being needing to be removed. Pleasure is a negative because it is the removal of a deprivation, which is the basic state of being. Were we to need to do nothing to sustain our bodies we would do nothing and kill ourselves out of boredom.
Yes, "changing channels" is living with illusions. To protect ourselves from harm we are automatically going to do this. We cannot live while being truly conscious of things as they really are. Reality is the void. "We define only out of despair, we must have a formula... to give a facade to the void." To live is to deceive oneself over and over again.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
On July 01 2012 06:24 patti wrote:
amen to that. if I remember loco/marius dynamic correctly, I'm surprised loco even responded to marius specifically
I'll take the time here and respond to you. I'd say the difference between me and you are quite similar to the gap between me and Loco Poco.
Yeah, fairly accurate.
You're welcome <3
Lol, ill also take a moment; I was referring to your incessant need for attention and validation. It's pretty clear that any response from loco to you makes you wet.
as always i like to play a bit of freedom/choice/action/attitude devil's advocate.
re: elephant man
There is no denying that that would be a pretty shitty starting point/situation but he certainly had the opportunity to parlay that into making some scratch and trying to find some meaning. He could find an elephant woman or women w/ elephant man fetishes online, join a freak show circuit and make some friends, w/e he wants to try and experience, accomplish, acquire, build.
Starving kids in Africa is much tougher. How much reason, agency, responsibility can small children really have?
When faced with that reality it's hard to know what to think especially since most people, myself included, "delude" themselves by just not thinking about it. Changing the channel or riding a different ride like I have said in previous posts.
Currently, I have about 0 impact utility wise on making any sort of dent in that situation. I could make it my life's work to try and become a famous billionaire so i would have some impact utility wise in changing the situation but the situation is still probably going to be shitty. That sounds extremely frustrating and depressing.
Life can be extremely frustrating and depressing no matter what you do so I just try to take the evidence and information available and try and make choices based on that evidence/information that lead to the opposite of frustrating and depressing outcomes.
As always, we don't exist, then we do, then we don't but it certainly doesn't seem meaningless while spending time in that place you want to be, doing those things you want to be doing with people (or lack of people) you want to be with.
It comes down to semantics:
Does occupation/transcendence/losing ones' self = delusion?
Does occupying a consciousness with fun, enjoyable, stimulating, passionate occupation/meaning = deluding ones' self?
Can one find "meaning" in a "meaningless" existence?
There is no parlaying. There is no winning here. I'm a bit shocked that you would think the Elephant Man could have had a life worth living. He was exploited until his death and lived most of his life in horrible pain, emotional and physical. Would you really want to 'make-do' as someone like him? I don't think so. If you want to look at life as a game, it is a zero-sum game. And it is one rough lottery. But there is nothing to be won in this lottery. The only thing every alive thing can do is reduce its amount of suffering imposed on itself from being born into the world. Every moment is an escape from the present moment, a projection into the future, an imagining of what one ought to get in order to be satiated. All motivation is born from deprivation. A deprived state of being needing to be removed. Pleasure is a negative because it is the removal of a deprivation, which is the basic state of being. Were we to need to do nothing to sustain our bodies we would do nothing and kill ourselves out of boredom.
Yes, "changing channels" is living with illusions. To protect ourselves from harm we are automatically going to do this. We cannot live while being truly conscious of things as they really are. Reality is the void. "We define only out of despair, we must have a formula... to give a facade to the void." To live is to deceive oneself over and over again.
pleasure and happiness could also be translated as the recognition that one grows stronger (thus not negative or motivation-depriving, because a healthy individual always feels the need to become even better). Deprivation is a strange word because you can't really be deprived of something you never had. If it's my will to become stronger/better/faster/bigger it's not because I'm deprived of anything but because the will to power -applied to all living things- is the driving force. A truly strong man can embrace life even while nullifying his illusions (not suggesting that it's really me doing this even if I try)
new shit has come to light... a-and... shit! man...
Did Nietzsche seem pleased to you in the last years of his life, when he went completely mad?
You can be deprived of something you have never had. Have you never felt deprived of sex before you have had it for the first time? How about a romantic relationship? Was there not a deprivation previous to its first experiencing?
If you want to become any of those things it is because you are currently deprived of it--at least to the extent to which you want them. In order for you to seek them you need to first imagine that you will be better off as such, and if you can be better off it means you had to be worst off, thus deprived from the better state.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
On July 01 2012 08:10 SakiSaki wrote:
Oh cmon loco. Yes we are not here for anything, there is no grand purpose. The world is in many ways a dark and evil place. But there is also happiness and beauty and things are in many ways getting better. Not saying that will keep going forever but we do live in the least violent of times and many 3rd world countries are making extraordinary progress.These changes in the world are many times driven forward by people believing we can make the world better(an attitude that you obv despise).
You might be "right" and they might be wrong, naive disillusional or w/e but I will still side with them any day. So what if our existence is meaningless, me and and majority of the worlds population are still happy to be experiencing it.
Oh I agree, in many ways it is getting better. Just recently here in Canada they lifted the ban on physician-assisted suicide. This is a really wonderful thing for all of those people who are terminally-ill at the moment and were previously denied having a dignified, painless death.
I do not despise people who do their best to improve the lives of people. How could I live with myself thinking like that? What I despise is self-important people who create inspirational content and the others who feel it is their duty to share it to inspire others to be excited about the future. The future is a lie, and I think all human societies have had the exact same propensity to see their salvation in the future. It's just that when God took the door people replaced it with science. Both are wrong-minded. I think it was Einstein who said we couldn't solve the problems we created with the same mentality that created them, but this is exactly what has always been happening and today is no different.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
On July 01 2012 06:24 patti wrote:
amen to that. if I remember loco/marius dynamic correctly, I'm surprised loco even responded to marius specifically
I'll take the time here and respond to you. I'd say the difference between me and you are quite similar to the gap between me and Loco Poco.
Yeah, fairly accurate.
You're welcome <3
Lol, ill also take a moment; I was referring to your incessant need for attention and validation. It's pretty clear that any response from loco to you makes you wet.
My need for attention and validation is extremely low, I just recently took some tests for it with my shrink. I don't feel the urge most people do.
His responses doesn't make me wet, but they sometimes worry me a little. It seems he's one of the few people on lp who can fire personal insults, mock, go out of line freely, and "always" get away with it. Usually when people go overboard, or are extremly aggressive to someone on the forum, one of the brighter invidiuals steps up and defends, stick up for whoever was recieving unwarranted abuse, flame and/or ridicule.
(Not that he often goes out of his way to do any of those, and I think he's mostly treated me with respect and dignity, just a few insults here n there. But he makes up for it by writing a lot of good shit too).
On July 01 2012 13:18 Loco wrote:
Did Nietzsche seem pleased to you in the last years of his life, when he went completely mad?
You can be deprived of something you have never had. Have you never felt deprived of sex before you have had it for the first time? How about a romantic relationship? Was there not a deprivation previous to its first experiencing?
If you want to become any of those things it is because you are currently deprived of it--at least to the extent to which you want them. In order for you to seek them you need to first imagine that you will be better off as such, and if you can be better off it means you had to be worst off, thus deprived from the better state.
If we're gonna play this game, Schopenhauer lived to become more than 70 years old =)
Nietzsche was sick for a long time, which led him to madness, even if he had shot himself this wouldn't mean anything over what he was saying. After all N. viewed suicide as perhaps the last honorable action of a person who understands that his life can't be lived proudly anymore.
People want to be/do great in several activities, my point is that they want to because that's the way their will to power manifests. Saying that because they want it they are deprived of it, so that deprivation can be named the root of all actions is a weird way to look at it but we could be simply playing with words here and the pessimistic/optimistic outlooks they carry.
new shit has come to light... a-and... shit! man...
On July 01 2012 06:24 patti wrote:
amen to that. if I remember loco/marius dynamic correctly, I'm surprised loco even responded to marius specifically
I'll take the time here and respond to you. I'd say the difference between me and you are quite similar to the gap between me and Loco Poco.
Yeah, fairly accurate.
You're welcome <3
Lol, ill also take a moment; I was referring to your incessant need for attention and validation. It's pretty clear that any response from loco to you makes you wet.
My need for attention and validation is extremely low, I just recently took some tests for it with my shrink. I don't feel the urge most people do.
His responses doesn't make me wet, but they sometimes worry me a little. It seems he's one of the few people on lp who can fire personal insults, mock, go out of line freely, and "always" get away with it. Usually when people go overboard, or are extremly aggressive to someone on the forum, one of the brighter invidiuals steps up and defends, stick up for whoever was recieving unwarranted abuse, flame and/or ridicule.
(Not that he often goes out of his way to do any of those, and I think he's mostly treated me with respect and dignity, just a few insults here n there. But he makes up for it by writing a lot of good shit too).
Where have I personally insulted/abused you exactly?
Well, I do think your personal fixation on pop psychology and self-help is ridiculous, but how is my voicing it so unacceptable?
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
You're brighter than me, you know exactly where, and how many times. ( + whatever insults flew me by)
I don't have a fixation on it, and even though I keep my subjects lighter when I write about them in my blog. That doesn't mean I spend all my time on it, I'd say 0,3% of my time is spent on it, but then again 80% of all estimates are made up on the spot, so I might be off by a little.
Weird, some guy who took a small positive thread and started posting grotesque pictures of deformed humans is telling me that a little light hearted, positive blog writing is "ridiculous".
Would you mind not vaguely linking me to wikipedia pages (and ones that I am obviously familiar with, too). If you have something to say or think I can learn from you put it in your own words and I will try my best to understand it. Sending me scattered information through wikipedia and not even mentioning what you think I should look at is completely useless. Also, if your assessment of my personality and worldview were as accurate as you think they are, you would have probably linked me to this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depressive_realism
You have a fixation on it. That estimate is completely laughable... your past 4 or 5 blogs and the threads you made are all about self-improvement and your favorite sources are always pop-psychology/self-help articles. That stuff is mostly all worthless and annoying, and I am sorry if you find it mean, but it just is. If you bring this type of shit into a philosophical debate you will be laughed at and there's no way of avoiding it. This industry thrives off of ignorant people who are not intellectually capable of taking up serious philosophical studies or are "too busy" and just want to feel better about themselves in day to day life.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
Loco, you twisted Lebo's words with the deprivation concept. You cannot be deprived, at a loss or otherwise of anything you have never known to exist. Clearly, very different than what you proposed.
The deprivation concept transitions with your view of the future. Your words/view prophesying the future as a lie is a proposition that does not differ at any point with respect to the feel-good inspiring videos. Unless you want to define what Future is? You would agree that predicting the result of the future is futile so we can get that out of the way. It is difficult to discern your actual view since you do not define it, instead I read fragmented ideas.
I will define Future from my view by relating it to the past:
Since there is no 'timeline of events' for the future, talking about human's paths of destruction/fallacies/illusions are as irrelevant as irrelevancy is defined. Because you believe in evolution, you can see that it is not the false 'reality' of our lives or the universe that matters, it is the progression of time on the universe. Everything that has sparked evolution-progression, from the start of the universe, to the creation of life on earth, was a result from what? You mentioned earlier something along the lines of 'dumb luck', while close to my view, you have a more absolute and narrowed focused view. It was a spontaneous reaction, the result of the evolution of time, progressing to a point that allowed for this event to result. If you have studied the cosmos, our result is not unexpected. You don't even need to study the cosmos, a simple knowledge of mathematics tells you just by the result of us having this debate, proves how plausible life is. Thus, how plausible life proliferates in the universe shouldn't be a debate. If you believe we are actually the only 'intelligent' life or only life itself, than that view is as self-absorbed as the people you speak of.
I have defined spontaneous reactions through the evolution-progression of time on the universe and I believe this an absolute. I believe that definition is a proper use of absolute thinking. The absolute concept of spontaneous reaction evolving over time is our only future and has been the driving force of human's evolution. This spontaneous result is the same in external events, like our discovery of fire, as they are from internal events (Stroke of genius, Eureka moments) from your quoted Einstein.
Man is not doomed by his very nature, because he cannot control the very nature of spontaneous events. So, your quote by Einstein is merely a variable but not the whole equation of the future. The future is defined by spontaneous events, the X part of the equation. Evolving the universe and everything in it towards something we do not know and none of us will ever live to see. But to say it's inevitably bad is as wrong as inevitably good. The idea of history endlessly repeating is not true and impossible because within the Future, lies spontaneity towards something different.
-----------------
My hypothesis is, we should not celebrate the future in relation to ourselves becoming 'better' as that selfishness is irrelevant. We should selflessly celebrate the future as the future is the creator of all. The Future is our 'God' and the 'science' you proclaim to be wrong, though science cannot be described as wrong as its very designation is to evolve, is the true religion.
I have learned from poker that being at the table is not a grind, the grind is living and poker is how I pass the time
Would you mind not taking everything literally? (No need for this here, you know very well that I know you're familiar with it too lol).
Somehow I think you got the joke with the links, but you took the time to write 3 sentences with crap about it, so I'll repay the favor.
My own words... Not sure if I should bite or not, you're the one who's mimicking deep philosophical thinkers, always quoting to some sentences they've said in one of their best books. I'm much more of free-flow writer than you.
And pop-psychology/self-help articles is a lot better than pop-sucidical/negative over seriousness shit. Too much negativity and douchebaggery is worthless as well.
Being laughed at is something you're afraid of, not me, that's why you never loosen up. You brought the most "shit" into this conversation with your pictures and whatnot.
The last part feels more like something personal to you, you probably was like the people you describe, then you started studying the hell out of it, reading books. And now that you feel "competent" in the area, you derrail most threads, and try and seek out these "arguments", debates, whatever you want to call them to make yourself feel smarter.
Fyi (hope im using the term right), there is a much higher road to take when "talking" to people than the one you're currently on.
2012-02-29 22:25:38 Is 5 blogs ago... Over 4 months, 5 articles.
One is a rant blog, one is about concepts from Terence McKenna, hardly self imp. And the rest are mixes of everything. Your assessment is flawed and wrong, just wanted to point that out. Even though you have a strong will, and you write with conviction, it's still poo and a sense of certainty on your behalf, not "accurate" or "fact" as you like claiming most shit you come with is. (sry for calling it shit, got a little emotional there, but I'm calm now).
I write a lot faster than average, if I were to put up everything I write and chat about It'd be around 1000 articles in those 4 months.
Also, even though you're correct in a lot off the stuff you've taken from the books you've read, still doesn't mean you can be wrong in the other 30% of the stuff you just make up, or assume.
On July 01 2012 16:51 Highcard wrote:
Loco, you twisted Lebo's words with the deprivation concept. You cannot be deprived, at a loss or otherwise of anything you have never known to exist. Clearly, very different than what you proposed.
I have not twisted his words. It is just our understanding of the concept that is conflicting. Like yours and my own here. "You cannot be deprived, at a loss or otherwise of anything you have never known to exist." But I'm saying that you do know that these things exist since you want them. I'm saying that if a desire, a 'want' is not met, deprivation follows. But since we all have wants that are not actually fulfilled we live in a constant state of deprivation from many different things at many different moments throughout our lives. A desire is not something that merely manifests on top of a content state, although it is possible (so-called instrumental desires often will), but it is also manifested from a deprived state. And clearly, the content state is not continually so. The strongest desires, the terminal ones - or means to an end ones - obviously manifest from a deprived state, from a state of lack. Even though we do not necessarily feel deprived for it, because we are fulfilling more than not at a particular time, it remains a lack. You do not have and you want to have. I am deprived of a sexually gratifying experience therefore I will seek one out. I am not thinking of seeking one out while I am currently experiencing it and fulfilling that desire, on the other hand. The motivation is born out of the lack of the thing desired. It may just be that the word 'deprivation' comes off as confusing.
Just wanted to clear that up before addressing the rest of your post which is a bit more lengthy and I'm not going to be able to read/respond to it right now.
-----
Edit: Ah, maybe this will be clearer, I just found how Schopenhauer said it:
"All willing springs from lack, from deficiency, and thus from suffering. Fulfillment brings this to an end; yet for one wish that is fulfilled there remain at least ten that are denied. Further, desiring lasts a long time, demands and requests go on to infinity, fulfillment is short and meted out sparingly. But even the final satisfaction itself is only apparent; the wish fulfilled at once makes way for a new one; the former is a known delusion, the latter a delusion not as yet known. No attained object of willing can give a satisfaction that lasts and no longer declines; but it is always like the alms thrown to a beggar, which reprieves him today so that his misery may be prolonged till tomorrow. Therefore, so long as our consciousness is filled by our will [which is as long as we are will-filled living beings], so long as we are given up to the throng of desires with its constant hopes and fears, so long as we are the subject of willing, we never obtain lasting happiness or peace. Essentially, it is all the same whether we pursue or flee, fear harm or aspire to enjoyment; care for the constantly demanding will, no matter in what form, continually fills and moves consciousness; but without peace and calm, true well-being is absolutely impossible." (Die Welt, vol I, p 196)
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
On July 01 2012 16:52 Mariuslol wrote:
Would you mind not taking everything literally? (No need for this here, you know very well that I know you're familiar with it too lol).
Somehow I think you got the joke with the links, but you took the time to write 3 sentences with crap about it, so I'll repay the favor.
My own words... Not sure if I should bite or not, you're the one who's mimicking deep philosophical thinkers, always quoting to some sentences they've said in one of their best books. I'm much more of free-flow writer than you.
And pop-psychology/self-help articles is a lot better than pop-sucidical/negative over seriousness shit. Too much negativity and douchebaggery is worthless as well.
Being laughed at is something you're afraid of, not me, that's why you never loosen up. You brought the most "shit" into this conversation with your pictures and whatnot.
The last part feels more like something personal to you, you probably was like the people you describe, then you started studying the hell out of it, reading books. And now that you feel "competent" in the area, you derrail most threads, and try and seek out these "arguments", debates, whatever you want to call them to make yourself feel smarter.
Fyi (hope im using the term right), there is a much higher road to take when "talking" to people than the one you're currently on.
Why do yo need a shrink if you are so good at psychoanalyzing people? Shouldn't you be the shrink?
And no, I didn't get "the joke". I would be surprised if anyone else in this thread has gotten it too. Let's make a poll about it actually.
Poll: Did you get Mariuslol's "joke" with the links?
(Vote): It was a joke?
(Vote): I'm pretty sure I did
(Vote): I skipped his post
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
as always i like to play a bit of freedom/choice/action/attitude devil's advocate.
re: elephant man
There is no denying that that would be a pretty shitty starting point/situation but he certainly had the opportunity to parlay that into making some scratch and trying to find some meaning. He could find an elephant woman or women w/ elephant man fetishes online, join a freak show circuit and make some friends, w/e he wants to try and experience, accomplish, acquire, build.
Starving kids in Africa is much tougher. How much reason, agency, responsibility can small children really have?
When faced with that reality it's hard to know what to think especially since most people, myself included, "delude" themselves by just not thinking about it. Changing the channel or riding a different ride like I have said in previous posts.
Currently, I have about 0 impact utility wise on making any sort of dent in that situation. I could make it my life's work to try and become a famous billionaire so i would have some impact utility wise in changing the situation but the situation is still probably going to be shitty. That sounds extremely frustrating and depressing.
Life can be extremely frustrating and depressing no matter what you do so I just try to take the evidence and information available and try and make choices based on that evidence/information that lead to the opposite of frustrating and depressing outcomes.
As always, we don't exist, then we do, then we don't but it certainly doesn't seem meaningless while spending time in that place you want to be, doing those things you want to be doing with people (or lack of people) you want to be with.
It comes down to semantics:
Does occupation/transcendence/losing ones' self = delusion?
Does occupying a consciousness with fun, enjoyable, stimulating, passionate occupation/meaning = deluding ones' self?
Can one find "meaning" in a "meaningless" existence?
There is no parlaying. There is no winning here. I'm a bit shocked that you would think the Elephant Man could have had a life worth living. He was exploited until his death and lived most of his life in horrible pain, emotional and physical. Would you really want to 'make-do' as someone like him? I don't think so. If you want to look at life as a game, it is a zero-sum game. And it is one rough lottery. But there is nothing to be won in this lottery. The only thing every alive thing can do is reduce its amount of suffering imposed on itself from being born into the world. Every moment is an escape from the present moment, a projection into the future, an imagining of what one ought to get in order to be satiated. All motivation is born from deprivation. A deprived state of being needing to be removed. Pleasure is a negative because it is the removal of a deprivation, which is the basic state of being. Were we to need to do nothing to sustain our bodies we would do nothing and kill ourselves out of boredom.
Yes, "changing channels" is living with illusions. To protect ourselves from harm we are automatically going to do this. We cannot live while being truly conscious of things as they really are. Reality is the void. "We define only out of despair, we must have a formula... to give a facade to the void." To live is to deceive oneself over and over again.
What's the difference between deceiving and distracting, satiating, or even healing?
If one is feeling pain they take an aspirin. If one is hungry they can eat. If one is thirsty they can drink. There is no deception there. If one is feeling the pain of existence well they can go through easy ones like sleep, eat, drink then if that doesn't work they can try other remedies. Is deception the best word?
Short Story:
Male and female partners are sitting in a room.
Female: "You know that life's a bitch and then you die right? We don't exist, then we randomly exist, then at some point we don't exist and there isn't any meaning to it."
Male: "Yup, so let's smoke this green, drink this champagne, eat these chocolate covered strawberries and fuck."
Male and Female smoke that green, drink that champagne, eat those chocolate covered strawberries and lose themselves in fucking.
The End.
Is this some big deception/facade or is it just 2 ppl tryin to live and healing the pain of existence?
If it is some big deception/facade what is the problem?
If it is some big deception/facade, out of curiosity what do you like to do to deceive yourself?
I've got 2,5 shrinks, it's mostly to due with (not sure if this is the English term for it), somatic suffering. And a chronic sleeping disorder. My body also doesn't take up molecyles that are difficult to take up. Because I'm always pumping out adrenalin, non adrenalin and kortisol. My mind is always racing, and I have a very hard time not thinking about stuff. (Other than that I'm pretty awesome).
I think I'm so good at analyzing people because I can relate to any of the suffering they may have endured. (If I've insinuated having analyzed you, that's been a joke btw). I also don't judge or analyze people via a forum, pm so forth. I also haven't done it in awhile.
That's one of the reasons I've got the somatic suffering. I put myself so much in someone elses's shoes that my body copies their ailments. And I start to get whatever it is they're suffering from. Only helped 1 person the last 7-8 months because of it. Someone I knew over the internet lost his wife, who he's been with for 6 years. I let him stay here for 5 days and fixed him up.
Most of the shrinks want me in a position to help people as well, although I'm humble and I feel I'm not smart enough, not qualified enough, or that it's beyond me. I also don't like the thought of all that responsibility.
So when I talk to people, and the way I listen let's them slowly but surely remove all the layers and shields. And once they're talking to me for real, I mostly listen, then I think about it for hours, then I get ideas and I know what to search for. Usually the next day I've got a lot of good shit to tell whoever I was helping.
Why do you need a poll, you want affirmations again? Like you do with all your quotes? Now you want to ridicule me further? Pffth, and I who had you in such high regards =p (I still do, but just in a very narrow field, you're not as awesome as I had hoped. Might be biased, since you keep on insulting me).
Making another post b/c it would have been disjointed to add at the end of the other one.
There is no parlaying. There is no winning here. I'm a bit shocked that you would think the Elephant Man could have had a life worth living. He was exploited until his death and lived most of his life in horrible pain, emotional and physical.
You are not and never will be the Elephant Man so how do you know how he felt?
Would you really want to 'make-do' as someone like him?
I don't know. I've never been the Elephant Man.
I don't think so. If you want to look at life as a game, it is a zero-sum game. And it is one rough lottery. But there is nothing to be won in this lottery. The only thing every alive thing can do is reduce its amount of suffering imposed on itself from being born into the world. Every moment is an escape from the present moment, a projection into the future, an imagining of what one ought to get in order to be satiated. All motivation is born from deprivation. A deprived state of being needing to be removed. Pleasure is a negative because it is the removal of a deprivation, which is the basic state of being. Were we to need to do nothing to sustain our bodies we would do nothing and kill ourselves out of boredom.
But we do need to do something to sustain our bodies. Can you go more in depth on why pleasure is a negative?
On July 01 2012 16:51 Highcard wrote:
First, thank you for the thoughtful response. It is always nice to see. But you have assumed some wrong things in your post. Let's start with this:
[quote]Unless you want to define what Future is? You would agree that predicting the result of the future is futile so we can get that out of the way. It is difficult to discern your actual view since you do not define it, instead I read fragmented ideas.
I definitely do not agree with this. I do believe we can predict our future. But that is clearly not the same as the future of the universe itself. I have said what I expected from humanity, and it was pretty clear that those expectations are very low, but I have not elaborated on what I expect will happen to humanity in the end. Unlike you, I am confident that by peering into the past we get to see what is to come in the future. Are there many factors that we cannot monitor and expect? Sure. But it changes little in this one equation. I am no mathematician, and I do not need to be to know that human motivation, as was previously mentionned by lebowski, always stems from self-interest. The presence of evil, of human greed and selfishness will not be altered through some "spontaneous reaction", and they will keep precipitating us towards our doom faster and faster. I think in many ways we are remarkable creatures with a remarkable past, but man has already given the best of himself; he has no future. The other animal species would have lasted millions of years if it weren't for mankind, but the human adventure simply cannot be indefinite.
It is interesting because long ago, the end of humanity took an eschatological sense, it was linked to the idea of salvation; nowadays we consider it as a fact (well, the ones who know best should), without any religious connotation, it is inscribed in our previsions. We know that it can end. And since then, all idea of progress has had something rotten in it.
I will define Future from my view by relating it to the past:
Since there is no 'timeline of events' for the future, talking about human's paths of destruction/fallacies/illusions are as irrelevant as irrelevancy is defined. Because you believe in evolution, you can see that it is not the false 'reality' of our lives or the universe that matters, it is the progression of time on the universe. Everything that has sparked evolution-progression, from the start of the universe, to the creation of life on earth, was a result from what? You mentioned earlier something along the lines of 'dumb luck', while close to my view, you have a more absolute and narrowed focused view. It was a spontaneous reaction, the result of the evolution of time, progressing to a point that allowed for this event to result. If you have studied the cosmos, our result is not unexpected. You don't even need to study the cosmos, a simple knowledge of mathematics tells you just by the result of us having this debate, proves how plausible life is. Thus, how plausible life proliferates in the universe shouldn't be a debate.
I don't know why you say the things you say and end with "just the result of us having this debate proves how plausible life is." No, it doesn't. It proves one occurrence over billions of years. That is clearly not very plausible.
If you believe we are actually the only 'intelligent' life or only life itself, than that view is as self-absorbed as the people you speak of.
I do think it is very unlikely we are the only life that exists considering how vast the cosmos is, but the evidence remains the evidence.
Man is not doomed by his very nature, because he cannot control the very nature of spontaneous events.
Well, that is the point. He is doomed by his very nature because he cannot control nature, no matter how much he tries. Our fate can be no different than the one of 99.9% of the species that have appeared on earth and gone extinct. The only real question is how and how fast it is going to happen. When people talk about building a better future, they are merely hopeful that we don't destroy the planet ourselves. But whether we do or don't, our end remains written, as certainly as yours and mine are certain. And God, I just hope this talk will not lead to a debate on transhumanism because I'm not singing up for that.
The idea of history endlessly repeating is not true and impossible because within the Future, lies spontaneity towards something different.
While there are unimaginable possibilities, 'spontaneity' remains limited. There are laws of nature that spontaneity will not and cannot touch. You have to consider that whatever the possibilities, like that of man evolving into something beyond material form, he will no longer be man. The fate of man as we know it is sealed.
The Future is our 'God' and the 'science' you proclaim to be wrong, though science cannot be described as wrong as its very designation is to evolve, is the true religion.
I have not said that "science is wrong", this is you misquoting me. I have said that when God took the door it has led people to instead put their faith in science and that it is simply the same wrong-minded attitude with a different target. Hope this clarifies a few things.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
There is no parlaying. There is no winning here. I'm a bit shocked that you would think the Elephant Man could have had a life worth living. He was exploited until his death and lived most of his life in horrible pain, emotional and physical.
You are not and never will be the Elephant Man so how do you know how he felt?
Would you really want to 'make-do' as someone like him?
I don't know. I've never been the Elephant Man.
I don't think so. If you want to look at life as a game, it is a zero-sum game. And it is one rough lottery. But there is nothing to be won in this lottery. The only thing every alive thing can do is reduce its amount of suffering imposed on itself from being born into the world. Every moment is an escape from the present moment, a projection into the future, an imagining of what one ought to get in order to be satiated. All motivation is born from deprivation. A deprived state of being needing to be removed. Pleasure is a negative because it is the removal of a deprivation, which is the basic state of being. Were we to need to do nothing to sustain our bodies we would do nothing and kill ourselves out of boredom.
But we do need to do something to sustain our bodies. Can you go more in depth on why pleasure is a negative?
Oh come on, don't play this game. You know exactly how you would feel if you woke up in his condition, assuming you know enough about the condition, you can imagine it.
The second question is the equivalent of telling me that I am not on the verge of dying in a concentration camp so I have no idea if the people in this situation find their life worth living. Again, come on.
As for your request, I am pretty tired of being in this thread and have spent a lot of time on it today, so I really don't want to elaborate. If you want to look into the matter more closely please go and read 'On the Sufferings of the World' by Arthur Schopenhauer. It is quite short and you can find it here: http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/On_the_Sufferings_of_the_World
or if you prefer listening to it:
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
On July 01 2012 19:27 RiKD wrote:
Making another post b/c it would have been disjointed to add at the end of the other one.
There is no parlaying. There is no winning here. I'm a bit shocked that you would think the Elephant Man could have had a life worth living. He was exploited until his death and lived most of his life in horrible pain, emotional and physical.
You are not and never will be the Elephant Man so how do you know how he felt?
Would you really want to 'make-do' as someone like him?
I don't know. I've never been the Elephant Man.
I don't think so. If you want to look at life as a game, it is a zero-sum game. And it is one rough lottery. But there is nothing to be won in this lottery. The only thing every alive thing can do is reduce its amount of suffering imposed on itself from being born into the world. Every moment is an escape from the present moment, a projection into the future, an imagining of what one ought to get in order to be satiated. All motivation is born from deprivation. A deprived state of being needing to be removed. Pleasure is a negative because it is the removal of a deprivation, which is the basic state of being. Were we to need to do nothing to sustain our bodies we would do nothing and kill ourselves out of boredom.
But we do need to do something to sustain our bodies. Can you go more in depth on why pleasure is a negative?
Oh come on, don't play this game. You know exactly how you would feel if you woke up in his condition, assuming you know enough about the condition, you can imagine it.
The second question is the equivalent of telling me that I am not on the verge of dying in a concentration camp so I have no idea if the people in this situation find their life worth living. Again, come on.
As for your request, I am pretty tired of being in this thread and have spent a lot of time on it today, so I really don't want to elaborate. If you want to look into the matter more closely please go and read 'On the Sufferings of the World' by Arthur Schopenhauer. It is quite short and you can find it here: http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/On_the_Sufferings_of_the_World
or if you prefer listening to it:
Thank you for the reading suggestion. If it does not answer my questions I hope at some point in the future you can elaborate and discuss some more. Always a pleasure (and/or stimulating deception).
Loco let me ask you with your pessimistic view, would you rather have not been born? How many of the miserable people on this miserable earth would rather have nothing instead of their life experience?
I guess that almost everyone alive today would rather experience life than have nothing, including yourself.
You are confusing facts with current knowledge, those two are not identical.
I started out with nothing and I still got most of it left
as always i like to play a bit of freedom/choice/action/attitude devil's advocate.
re: elephant man
There is no denying that that would be a pretty shitty starting point/situation but he certainly had the opportunity to parlay that into making some scratch and trying to find some meaning. He could find an elephant woman or women w/ elephant man fetishes online, join a freak show circuit and make some friends, w/e he wants to try and experience, accomplish, acquire, build.
Starving kids in Africa is much tougher. How much reason, agency, responsibility can small children really have?
When faced with that reality it's hard to know what to think especially since most people, myself included, "delude" themselves by just not thinking about it. Changing the channel or riding a different ride like I have said in previous posts.
Currently, I have about 0 impact utility wise on making any sort of dent in that situation. I could make it my life's work to try and become a famous billionaire so i would have some impact utility wise in changing the situation but the situation is still probably going to be shitty. That sounds extremely frustrating and depressing.
Life can be extremely frustrating and depressing no matter what you do so I just try to take the evidence and information available and try and make choices based on that evidence/information that lead to the opposite of frustrating and depressing outcomes.
As always, we don't exist, then we do, then we don't but it certainly doesn't seem meaningless while spending time in that place you want to be, doing those things you want to be doing with people (or lack of people) you want to be with.
It comes down to semantics:
Does occupation/transcendence/losing ones' self = delusion?
Does occupying a consciousness with fun, enjoyable, stimulating, passionate occupation/meaning = deluding ones' self?
Can one find "meaning" in a "meaningless" existence?
There is no parlaying. There is no winning here. I'm a bit shocked that you would think the Elephant Man could have had a life worth living. He was exploited until his death and lived most of his life in horrible pain, emotional and physical. Would you really want to 'make-do' as someone like him? I don't think so. If you want to look at life as a game, it is a zero-sum game. And it is one rough lottery. But there is nothing to be won in this lottery. The only thing every alive thing can do is reduce its amount of suffering imposed on itself from being born into the world. Every moment is an escape from the present moment, a projection into the future, an imagining of what one ought to get in order to be satiated. All motivation is born from deprivation. A deprived state of being needing to be removed. Pleasure is a negative because it is the removal of a deprivation, which is the basic state of being. Were we to need to do nothing to sustain our bodies we would do nothing and kill ourselves out of boredom.
Yes, "changing channels" is living with illusions. To protect ourselves from harm we are automatically going to do this. We cannot live while being truly conscious of things as they really are. Reality is the void. "We define only out of despair, we must have a formula... to give a facade to the void." To live is to deceive oneself over and over again.
What's the difference between deceiving and distracting, satiating, or even healing?
If one is feeling pain they take an aspirin. If one is hungry they can eat. If one is thirsty they can drink. There is no deception there. If one is feeling the pain of existence well they can go through easy ones like sleep, eat, drink then if that doesn't work they can try other remedies. Is deception the best word?
Indeed, there is no deception there. But you are merely naming animal pleasures and assuming that those two humans are having at it like other animals. The nonhuman animal is truthful in doing all these things because that is all that he does and desires. He is merely driven by the will without engaging in thought about it. This is not the case with us, so you are not taking into account the meaning horizon, that necessary dimension in the life of the human being, which is what introduces the self-deceit. To constantly look for meaning when there is none in actuality is to deceive oneself. This is not a choice at all, this is what being human is.
I would say that distracting is just avoidance of what is. Deceiving is believing in something different from the truth. The second is obviously a lot worse because it will change the emotions felt by the observer. A good example is the comforting "it was God's plan" when some tragedy happens.
Short Story:
Male and female partners are sitting in a room.
Female: "You know that life's a bitch and then you die right? We don't exist, then we randomly exist, then at some point we don't exist and there isn't any meaning to it."
Male: "Yup, so let's smoke this green, drink this champagne, eat these chocolate covered strawberries and fuck."
Male and Female smoke that green, drink that champagne, eat those chocolate covered strawberries and lose themselves in fucking.
The End.
Is this some big deception/facade or is it just 2 ppl tryin to live and healing the pain of existence?
If it is some big deception/facade what is the problem?
If it is some big deception/facade, out of curiosity what do you like to do to deceive yourself?
Well, like I just said, there is no other choice. It is not the doing, not the activities themselves that are deceiving, but the meaning conferred to them. Living and self-deceit are inseparable because for as long as you live it is "equivalent to an act of faith, a protest against the truth, an interminable prayer." And "as soon as they consent to live, the unbeliever and the man of faith are fundamentally the same, since both have made the only decision that defines a being."
But some rare human beings have managed to see things as they really are; most of them for short periods, because the individual cannot survive in nothingness.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
On July 01 2012 22:08 Zorglub wrote:
Loco let me ask you with your pessimistic view, would you rather have not been born? How many of the miserable people on this miserable earth would rather have nothing instead of their life experience?
I guess that almost everyone alive today would rather experience life than have nothing, including yourself.
I would have rather, yes, but I don't dwell on it ever. It's a useless thought to have. If I'm so miserable I would rather just end my life than complain about it.
And as for the second question, Schopenhauer had an interesting thought-experiment. Were we to have the power, we could ask dead people if they wanted to come back to life, and they have the choice to accept or decline, and we could grant them their wish. How many do you think would choose to come back rather than stay in peaceful rest?
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
Why didn't you end your life then? Why do you keep hanging on?
What is this nothingness? Can nothingness even exist without its opposite everything? If so, how would you know it is nothingness when you don't have anything to compare it with?
Personally I would rather have something instead of nothing, but that is just me.
I started out with nothing and I still got most of it left
What do you mean why? I just told you I would if I were miserable enough.
"What is nothingness" etc., is a philosophical inquiry that is fun to look into and I don't have any brief answer for you there. But you would know because it cannot be compared to anything else, it is the experience of Nirvana in Buddhism or Moksha in Hinduism -- liberation from the will.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
Loco, do you still play poker? If so what's the point? I remember you being a very good player before but I find it hard to imagine with your views now that you would be motivated enough to grind out sessions on a regular basis. I mean, poker is really hard enough now even for optimists.
On July 01 2012 22:37 Loco wrote:
What do you mean why? I just told you I would if I were miserable enough.
"What is nothingness" etc., is a philosophical inquiry that is fun to look into and I don't have any brief answer for you there. But you would know because it cannot be compared to anything else, it is the experience of Nirvana in Buddhism or Moksha in Hinduism -- liberation from the will.
Apparently you aren't miserable enough to kill yourself, thus you, like almost everybody else on this earth would rather have your life experience, than nothing. So life does at least give meaning/pleasure etc. to make it worth more than nothing.
A concept that is noncomparable is nonsensical, because all we can do in our human existence is to compare things. If you can not tell what a thing/concept/idea etc. is NOT, then that thing/concept/idea makes no sense at all. It is undefineable in logic, just like divide by zero in mathematics. In Physics it would be like general relativity without anything to relate to. In social sciences we call them women.
You mention Buddhism and Hinduism, I would recommend you examine concepts like "Brahman", "Dharma" and "Maya" in Hinduism and compare it with Schopenhauer's "The world as will and representation". If you view this from an optimistic point of view, the world has endless possibilities and opportunities, it is just up to you to use your will and representation to unleash them.
I started out with nothing and I still got most of it left
While we are at Nirvana and Moksha, let me ask you a question I have pondered myself. Would you rather cease to exist completely or have the experience you do now? Would you rather live your exact same life again or experience nothing? What is worse than nothing?
Only eternal torment and extreme misery are worse than nothing, and even the most unlucky humans have points of happiness and pleasure in their lives. For most humans these good times makes up for the miserable moments and makes the overall experience of life better than experiencing nothing.
I started out with nothing and I still got most of it left
I had to skip past a bunch of this thread because I have a nasty disgust with grotesque photos
but u said human modivation stems from self interest.. this is not true, this is an ideal that most people become accustomed to living in 21st century... imagine begin born into a generation 100 years ago at the start of the world wars, you would be drafted into a war to defend the ideals of your nation. perhaps you choose to flee because your self-interest thought it be the right choice, but millions of solider united amongest different nations to defend against an evil tyranny.
the point is you need to be thankful for the generations before you that gave up their lives for your freedom to pursue your own life and your own self interests.
look at this evil motherfking picture imagine having to give up your freedom to his ideals, your lucky.
or imagine being born 200+ years from now when technology surpasses the pace for self destruction and we find planets we can inhabit and colonize. people are going to sign up regardless of their self-interest because they beleive in a greater purpose beyond themselves. We live in a generation with no purpose, only purpose is our lives (tyler durden yo?).. but seriously we have the freedom to do what we like and this is the greatest gift you can receive. personally I dont care what other people do with their time and money, yes it pains me to see a waste of breath but at the end I dont care. its what I do with my time and money that matters to me, and what i want out of my future.
On July 01 2012 06:24 patti wrote:
amen to that. if I remember loco/marius dynamic correctly, I'm surprised loco even responded to marius specifically
I'll take the time here and respond to you. I'd say the difference between me and you are quite similar to the gap between me and Loco Poco.
Yeah, fairly accurate.
You're welcome <3
Lol, ill also take a moment; I was referring to your incessant need for attention and validation. It's pretty clear that any response from loco to you makes you wet.
My need for attention and validation is extremely low,
On July 01 2012 22:54 whamm! wrote:
Loco, do you still play poker? If so what's the point? I remember you being a very good player before but I find it hard to imagine with your views now that you would be motivated enough to grind out sessions on a regular basis. I mean, poker is really hard enough now even for optimists.
Actually I don't. I posted hands when I played. But even when I did I have always had problems being motivated. Of course you are right, I find nothing more soul-crushing than having to play this game. Luckily I don't have to. It is definitely a game better suited for optimists and worldly-ambitious people. I am neither.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
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goose58 United States. Jul 02 2012 16:17. Posts 871
I agree and disagree with lots of things that have been said in this thread by various posters.
I do find it rather ironic that Loco champions himself as a realist then makes sensationalist posts about rare diseases affecting a tiny fragment of the total population. Even if we believed the hype that he portraits in that post, he comes to the erroneous conclusion that diseased people don't want to live. This is inaccurate. He is simply projecting his beliefs onto an entire population.
So sorry that you're apathetic Loco. First world problems, I guess.
Enjoy the ride while it lasts because as everyone in this thread knows, we are all gonna die. Might as well make the best of it.
Instead of incessantly bitching, you could perhaps, improve yourself and the world around to make this journey towards death a little more enjoyable. Oh, but that's not edgy enough.
Also, I think MariusLOL has made some pretty good posts and insightful comments. Then again, I respect people who try to better themselves.
On July 02 2012 15:17 goose58 wrote:
I agree and disagree with lots of things that have been said in this thread by various posters.
I do find it rather ironic that Loco champions himself as a realist then makes sensationalist posts about rare diseases affecting a tiny fragment of the total population. Even if we believed the hype that he portraits in that post, he comes to the erroneous conclusion that diseased people don't want to live. This is inaccurate. He is simply projecting his beliefs onto an entire population.
So sorry that you're apathetic Loco. First world problems, I guess.
Enjoy the ride while it lasts because as everyone in this thread knows, we are all gonna die. Might as well make the best of it.
Instead of incessantly bitching, you could perhaps, improve yourself and the world around to make this journey towards death a little more enjoyable. Oh, but that's not edgy enough.
Also, I think MariusLOL has made some pretty good posts and insightful comments. Then again, I respect people who try to better themselves.
People cannot better themselves. They can only be influenced by strong motives that overpower criminal motives. "Real moral reform is not at all possible, but only determent from the deed...." And just look at Marius' posts to me, his blatant hypocrisy where he tells me there is a higher road than the one I choose to communicate with people, all the while having petty resentment towards me and taking jabs at me and my philosophy. Point proven.
I actually remember you from a thread not far back where you were the only one siding with d_smart_s. I couldn't care less who you respect and what your opinions are on the matters presented in this thread. I don't think anybody cares either that you "agree and disagree with a lot of posters" if you are incapable of elaborating on anything that was said. Completely useless statement.
And about the claim I was being sensationalist: I have taken one example of one person with one disease for the purpose of proving that life isn't all grand for everybody. One example is enough to prove my point, there was no reason for me to come up with more. This person could have been you. No, this person is you. There is no difference. You and I had a better roll in the lottery of life, whereas many other people didn't and pay for people like you to "enjoy the ride". And you are not even willing to acknowledge that, so fuck you and your deluded "it's just a minority that suffers hell"-mentality. And I didn't know that Merrick's condition was that rare, that was brought up by another poster. I thought from memory that he had Elephantiasis, and that isn't nearly as rare, as I have shown from the statistics previously.
"Even if we believed the hype that he portraits in that post, he comes to the erroneous conclusion that diseased people don't want to live. This is inaccurate." More proof that you are full of shit. I have never once said that and I do not believe this. One of my heroes is Jason Becker, I have made a thread about him in the past; he suffers from ALS and there is a point in the thread where I was really mad at Baal because he said he should kill himself because his life sucked. I said that he actually had no idea about that and that he was in fact wrong. And why in the hell would I believe that when I am aware that there are people like this Jesus freak who oppose the RTD movement because of his own subjective experiences with "his wonderful quality of life and the support of his family, friends and church."?
I am well aware that many fellow sufferers find life worth living. But many others don't, and they are the ones being overlooked by people like you. Plus, what do you know about me? How do you know that I don't actually have a disease that has ruined my life? You don't, and you are an asshole. No wonder d_smart_s likes you.
Oh, and if other people like goose58 want to take the piss because I am obviously wrong and pleasure outweighs the pain in the world, why don't you argue this point properly instead of this kind of shit? Here, just take the popular example given by Schopenhauer that I posted above, the one of two animals, "one of which is engaged in eating the other." Is there a balance there? Or is the pleasure of the animal devouring the other greater than the pain experienced by the one being eaten alive? Or is it the opposite? I also challenge you to watch the documentary below and see if your view holds. Also bear in mind that, according to USDA sources, close to 20 billion animals were raised and killed for food in the US alone in 2010-2011, and up to 50% of the world's food is thrown in the trash.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
Last edit: 02/07/2012 19:06
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Stroggoz New Zealand. Jul 02 2012 18:42. Posts 5365
eh, i think about the lottery on the outcome of humanity, the trillions of trillion sided dice rolls happening every second, and things like determinism for hours on end every day. it's not a depressing thing to think about for me, even though believing in these things means i cannot take pride in anything i do.
Anyway, i don't see any reason to be pessimistic about reality.
One of 3 non decent human beings on a site of 5 people with between 2-3 decent human beings
That's odd. Isn't there a pretty good reason posted just above you?
Anyway, philosophical pessimism doesn't imply that everything is shit and depressing, just that the suffering outweighs the pleasure in this world. Doesn't mean you can't enjoy anything.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
On July 02 2012 15:17 goose58 wrote:
I agree and disagree with lots of things that have been said in this thread by various posters.
I do find it rather ironic that Loco champions himself as a realist then makes sensationalist posts about rare diseases affecting a tiny fragment of the total population. Even if we believed the hype that he portraits in that post, he comes to the erroneous conclusion that diseased people don't want to live. This is inaccurate. He is simply projecting his beliefs onto an entire population.
So sorry that you're apathetic Loco. First world problems, I guess.
Enjoy the ride while it lasts because as everyone in this thread knows, we are all gonna die. Might as well make the best of it.
Instead of incessantly bitching, you could perhaps, improve yourself and the world around to make this journey towards death a little more enjoyable. Oh, but that's not edgy enough.
Also, I think MariusLOL has made some pretty good posts and insightful comments. Then again, I respect people who try to better themselves.
On July 02 2012 15:17 goose58 wrote:
Also, I think MariusLOL has made some pretty good posts and insightful comments.
you mean in this thread? lol come on. which comments would you say have been insightful and/or good?
i mean his random stream of consciousness writing style is entertaining for some of his blog stories, but i still have no idea wtf his point is/was in this thread, other than that he apparently gets annoyed with loco very easily for some reason.
Truck-Crash Life
1
Stroggoz New Zealand. Jul 02 2012 19:41. Posts 5365
On July 02 2012 18:09 Loco wrote:
That's odd. Isn't there a pretty good reason posted just above you?
maybe that is a good reason for some people, but it may be because i have a different chemical balance in my brain than other people, shit like that does not get me depressed or make me feel pessimistic.
i havn't really researched into philosophical pessimism but it seems like a rather subjective philosophy to me because a belief that one suffers more than the pleasure they get really is swayed by the bias of ones own brain. I tend to only follow philosophies that are universal truths, and this is not one for me because i wish i had been born.
as an added note i'm not really sure if i believe in determinism anymore because it seems to conflict with quantum mechanics, or so i've been told by my physicist brother. i'm no expert in this stuff.
One of 3 non decent human beings on a site of 5 people with between 2-3 decent human beings
Yes spitfiree, and patti, they aren't just strong, they are the truth.
Stroggoz, you are the one who is being subjective and who is swayed by the biases of his brain here. Look at what you say: "Because I am happy to exist, a philosophy that states that suffering outweighs pleasure must be wrong." There is no ounce of objectivity in your post. You can't start first with your feelings about your own existence and project it onto the world. If you observe the world of phenomena and do not get deceived by your personal experience the truth of it is obvious. And no, quantum physics do not disprove determinism.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
Last edit: 02/07/2012 20:14
1
Stroggoz New Zealand. Jul 02 2012 20:26. Posts 5365
On July 02 2012 19:10 Loco wrote:
Yes spitfiree, and patti, they aren't just strong, they are the truth.
Stroggoz, you are the one who is being subjective and who is swayed by the biases of his brain here. Look at what you say: "Because I am happy to exist, a philosophy that states that suffering outweighs pleasure must be wrong." There is no ounce of objectivity in your post. You can't start first with your feelings about your own existence and project it onto the world. If you observe the world of phenomena and do not get deceived by your personal experience the truth of it is obvious. And no, quantum physics do not disprove determinism.
yeah, i know im being subjective. everyone is when it comes to pessimism or optimism, and that's what i just said. that's why i find it hard for there to be any objectivity behind pessimissim . Like i said, i only follow philosphies that are universal truths. A lot of people find life worth living and a lot of people don't. How does one find that pessimism is realism from that?
One of 3 non decent human beings on a site of 5 people with between 2-3 decent human beings
On July 02 2012 19:10 Loco wrote:
Yes spitfiree, and patti, they aren't just strong, they are the truth.
Stroggoz, you are the one who is being subjective and who is swayed by the biases of his brain here. Look at what you say: "Because I am happy to exist, a philosophy that states that suffering outweighs pleasure must be wrong." There is no ounce of objectivity in your post. You can't start first with your feelings about your own existence and project it onto the world. If you observe the world of phenomena and do not get deceived by your personal experience the truth of it is obvious. And no, quantum physics do not disprove determinism.
yeah, i know im being subjective. everyone is when it comes to pessimism or optimism, and that's what i just said. that's why i find it hard for there to be any objectivity behind pessimissim . Like i said, i only follow philosphies that are universal truths.
No, that's not how it works, because philosophy is a science. In the words of Schopenhauer: "Philosophy ... is a science, and as such has no articles of faith; accordingly, in it nothing can be assumed as existing except what is either positively given empirically, or demonstrated through indubitable conclusions."
When we talk about philosophical pessimism, we talk about more than individual bias, we talk about a field of study--a science. The individual's optimism and pessimism are outlooks on the world, they are attitudes which depend on your beliefs and temperament, they are not philosophies, and therefore not to be relied upon in serious inquiries such as is the task of philosophy.
A lot of people find life worth living and a lot of people don't. How does one find that pessimism is realism from that?
Because of the observable enormous amount of suffering in the world.
I just saw this, how do you explain that a speech like this is given to the youth of Colombia?
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
And just look at Marius' posts to me, his blatant hypocrisy where he tells me there is a higher road than the one I choose to communicate with people, all the while having petty resentment towards me and taking jabs at me and my philosophy. Point proven
LoL, you really got the wrong idea of me. There is a much higher road. Petty resentment, I never talked trash about you or about you to anyone, and when my dad asked me what I did yesterday, I said "ahh, pulling my hair out, this guy with incredible rich vocabulary is close, but wasting it". With a respectful envious voice.
The jabs is to see if I can predict your reaction, if you saw through the layers you'd find them comical instead of getting offended. (When I get offended it's because of an emotional rise then and there, and I go away, and I don't post right after, I wait till I'm not, often).
Your philosophy is cool and awesome (although a bit too dark for my taste, I still indulge in it, listen to some of the stuff, watch links etc). What I lol about is you just "hijack" threads and then change them into a debate, kinda like I was just standing there all handsome n cool, and before I know it you've bent me over and before I come to my senses I realize you've pulled down my pants about to pound me.
Oh, and it gives more of a sting to it, sounds more awesome if you remove the "Point proven". That's something D_smart would do (no joke, since you do sound really cool when you're all high and mighty". It was splendid till I got there. And I can understand why 80% of the people who read that line would nod and go "yea, Marius so petty and resentful".
WHICH IM NOT, I'm colorful and awesome!!
So there!!!
HAh.....
Ps, but I still feel a little stupid, but that's got nothing to do with you. More like a default <3
On July 02 2012 18:19 brambolius wrote:
Loco, marius, tutz, simply out of curiosity, might I ask how old you are ?
If I lived on Mars I'd be around 60, I also have gotten a few grey hairs at the side of my hair, but I'm not starting to grow bald yet. I've got a lot of hair. (Not on my back or anything). You might not see them unless you go really close.
Let me find a picture, I can post a picture taken a few days ago, yay.
I've nagged for a bit to get my brother and his new gf to come with me for a walk in the forest. And I finally tricked them. I'm the one with the glasses. I don't need them all the time, but I like having them on, I get +5 int by using them I think.
Funny how some people take themelves and the world too seriously and they think their right. But you know what? Those same people, in reality, came out to be...
On July 02 2012 20:34 Mariuslol wrote: And just look at Marius' posts to me, his blatant hypocrisy where he tells me there is a higher road than the one I choose to communicate with people, all the while having petty resentment towards me and taking jabs at me and my philosophy. Point proven
LoL, you really got the wrong idea of me. There is a much higher road. Petty resentment, I never talked trash about you or about you to anyone, and when my dad asked me what I did yesterday, I said "ahh, pulling my hair out, this guy with incredible rich vocabulary is close, but wasting it". With a respectful envious voice.
The jabs is to see if I can predict your reaction, if you saw through the layers you'd find them comical instead of getting offended. (When I get offended it's because of an emotional rise then and there, and I go away, and I don't post right after, I wait till I'm not, often).
Your philosophy is cool and awesome (although a bit too dark for my taste, I still indulge in it, listen to some of the stuff, watch links etc). What I lol about is you just "hijack" threads and then change them into a debate, kinda like I was just standing there all handsome n cool, and before I know it you've bent me over and before I come to my senses I realize you've pulled down my pants about to pound me.
Oh, and it gives more of a sting to it, sounds more awesome if you remove the "Point proven". That's something D_smart would do (no joke, since you do sound really cool when you're all high and mighty". It was splendid till I got there. And I can understand why 80% of the people who read that line would nod and go "yea, Marius so petty and resentful".
I don't have the wrong idea, I judge what I see, and what I saw there was accurate. You were being hypocritical. Even if I did insult you in the worst ways, you could have just turned the other cheek, but that is not what you did, and yet you said that I could treat others better. So could you.
It doesn't matter what you say about me and trust me when I say I have not been offended by anything you have ever said to me. In order to be offended by what someone says to me, I have to esteem this person as being at least my equal, if not superior to me. As I do not treat you as such, none of your words affect me. So please stop saying that I was offended by you, you are deceiving yourself. If you get offended by people, you give too much consideration to their opinions.
I added 'point proven' because I said that people couldn't better themselves before that, and since you are so focused on self-improvement and still manage to be hypocritical, I added it.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
ahh, you judge, I just perceive. It's only "accurate" because you're a PESSIMIST, and it's just an utility, a sense of certainty. Just your opinion. You're being a dick, and none those negative thingys you keep calling me.
And when you describe me in a negative words I just go ÔÔ. The voice in your head and your perception of the world is extremly skewed, and in a dark, evil, negative way.
And I don't judge you or anyone else above or beneath me, maybe that's the difference. That's why I talk with the same respect to Tutz when I think he's being a big lol, as I do to you, as I talk to Nazgul. I treat people the same.
You're doing it all wrong, this general forum is semi casual, and we're using slang and sometimes we argue, try to go all political n shit, then someone comes and breaks it off, or we cool down. You come in with words, seriouness and crap x20 too serious, doing your best to try and make yourself come out all awesome, it's you who's missing the mark.
On July 02 2012 20:57 Mariuslol wrote:
ahh, you judge, I just perceive. It's only "accurate" because you're a PESSIMIST, and it's just an utility, a sense of certainty. Just your opinion. You're being a dick, and not those negative thingys you keep calling me.
No. You see... you judge, because to exist is to evaluate and emit judgments, just like you just did after saying you "just perceive". You judged that it is only accurate because I am a pessimist. That was not just a perception, you see? You also then judged that I was being a dick.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
On July 02 2012 20:38 BILAT_POWER!!! wrote:
I wish someone would get back from the dead and tell us what's really going on.
As someone already mentioned in the thread, you should know, you go there every night before entering REM sleep.
Oooooh. Cool! Cant wait to that again later.
One thing I can say is right now is, I love being alive again. But that could change next time I 'wake up'. But then again, it can go back to 'I love being alive again'.
On July 02 2012 21:07 Mariuslol wrote:
You got what I ment, I know you did, but you're being a scrotum.
Why don't you go work on that appology post instead?
It is wrong to assume that people think the way you do, and have hidden motives in responding to you. I have none. I didn't get what you meant, just like I didn't get your "joke" with the links, and a bunch of other stuff because you are very confusing to deal with. Be direct and do not conceal things if you wish to be understood better, instead of putting the blame on someone who reads your words and judges what has been said in them as accurately as he can.
And who do I have to apologize to and what for? You see, that's what I mean when I say that you are confusing to deal with. I have absolutely no idea what you are talking about right now with this.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
Maybe because you draw all your assumptions on the words, and not the way it gets put forth, scenario, pause/speed of the posts, history of the person, sarcasm, behind the lines, pitch of the guy's thoughts writing the words, or anything that's important when writing to eachother. (Don't quote me on this, but isn't just the words 5-10% of what's actually being said)?
Stop telling me what to be and not be, I don't want to be anything like you've been in this thread. But I still think there's A LOT of good shit in you (just tucked away a little atm), maybe you're suffering, a lot, and this is one of the ways you deal with it. Instead man up, shoot me a pm, and share your problem, and instead you'll get love, warmth and help.
Instead of shooing away one of the friendliest Norwegians you'll ever meet lol
Ps, I appreciate your effort of trying to judge what I say as accurately as you can. Even though you miss the mark by quite a bit.
when I read your posts, or anyone else who writes something that looks like they've put some time and effort into. The most fun things is trying to picture the person writing it, what voice he hears it in. Where he lives, his situation, is he annoyed, is he tense, is he arrogant, is he trolling. Then read it, then reply to it.
Not saying this is how it's suppose to be done, but a little insight in how I do it.
Oh, I haven't read a lot of philosophy, all my stuff is from just a couple. But I feel strongly about "Nature" being neutral.
So if you fill your head with a lot of doom and gloom, nasty pictures. Most of your thoughts is about babies being eaten by gay black people, aids, rabies.
Look at tubes with deformed humans, and try to "switch" most topics into something that you feel very strongly about (Your philosophy). Don't you think that'll be what you think of, and act out on most of the time?
If you're so awesome at reading, understading complex litterature, can't you instead fill that brain of yours up with more awesome stuff, uplifting stuff. Just so you won't suffer, then "contribute" try to find cures for shit, help people in need. Move around, make the neurons give you new impulses, new thoughts, new chemical mixes in your body, maybe you'll feel like you're in love with something again, and that shit stays in there for ages.
Just questions, not hatin or anything. Just a little curious.
I added 'point proven' because I said that people couldn't better themselves before that, and since you are so focused on self-improvement and still manage to be hypocritical, I added it.
Isn't that just a guess, or you jumping to conclusions? People can better themself, by leaps and bounds.
And you're still over exaggerating the part about self-improvement, but in your head it's kind of like a bad word, you use it like an insult, you mock it. I think it's admirable when people try to better themself. Or are "brave" enough to try, speak up, do. Instead of being a bit of a noob.
On July 02 2012 21:35 Etherone wrote:
just wanted to interject here with heisenbergs uncertainty principle ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uncertainty_principle) since this is the quantum mechanical proof that debunks determinism.
as for everything else, I don't know why you even bother arguing with marius.
On July 02 2012 21:32 BILAT_POWER!!! wrote:
^ I told you, Loco reminds me of my cousin who turned out to be gay. Just saying.
I'm pretty sure he's not gay, but we'd get a rise out of listening to what kind of porn his wanks too, and how he does it. All Nihilistc/pessimisstic people got the craziest masturbation habits.
But when it comes to relationships and girls, they want emotions involved, respect, a bond n so forth. Not just casual sex, that's not intriguing or complex enough.
On July 02 2012 21:32 BILAT_POWER!!! wrote:
^ I told you, Loco reminds me of my cousin who turned out to be gay. Just saying.
I'm pretty sure he's not gay, but we'd get a rise out of listening to what kind of porn his wanks too, and how he does it. All Nihilistc/pessimisstic people got the craziest masturbation habits.
But when it comes to relationships and girls, they want emotions involved, respect, a bond n so forth. Not just casual sex, that's not intriguing or complex enough.
Not saying he is. Just saying beneath some person's way of thinking is something underneath that makes them think that way.
On July 02 2012 21:35 Etherone wrote:
just wanted to interject here with heisenbergs uncertainty principle ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uncertainty_principle) since this is the quantum mechanical proof that debunks determinism.
as for everything else, I don't know why you even bother arguing with marius.
Quantum indeterminacy =/= free will. Not knowing where the electron is does not affect the outcome of biological reactions. Just because we cannot tell where an electron is, or sort out some of the craziness of quantum mechanics, that doesn't mean that we aren't still bound by their laws. Randomness doesn't rid the fact that we're still controlled by it, all our actions determined and human agency an illusion.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
Why did you dig that up palak? Not that I mind, but I'm not sure what brought you to search for it. Is it just so that brambolius guesses my age? And I'm about to be 25 brambolius... I really saw no reason to reply just to mention that.
Also shame that you didn't quote the other pic I was mimicking, that was the funny part.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
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palak United States. Jul 03 2012 15:00. Posts 4601
I was figuring ppl could always look up the pic u r mimicking...I like the juxtaposition of ur philosophical determinism with that picture ...I have nothing of actual value to contribute to the discussion (aka i suck at philosophy)
dont tap the glass...im about ready to take a fucking hammer to the aquarium
It's important to be able to laugh (and especially at oneself) when you have a sinister outlook on life. Laughter is an act of superiority, a triumph over the universe, a marvelous thing that reduces things to their just proportions...
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
We have no cause to reject the possibility of the existence of organisms endowed
with such properties that would make of them -- the direct embodiment of the universal mind -- a perfection inaccessible to our own (human) mind. . . .
Because, we have no right to maintain that man is the last expression of the divine
creative thought.
Our reason must accept in all necessity an infinite and eternal Mind which rules
and governs the ocean of life. . . . Thought and creative ideation, in full agreement
with the laws of unity and causation, manifest themselves plainly enough in
universal life without the participation of brain-slush. . . . Directing the forces and
elements toward the formation of organisms, this organizing life-principle
becomes self-sentient, self-conscious, racial or individual. Substance, ruled and
directed by the life-principle, is organized according to a general defined plan
into certain types. . . .
He explains this belief by confessing that never, during his long life so full of study, observation,
and experiments, could he --
acquire the conviction, that our brain could be the only organ of thought in the
whole universe, that everything in this world, save that organ, should be
unconditioned and senseless, and that human thought alone should impart to the universe a meaning and a reasonable harmony in its integrity.
And he adds a propos of Moleschott's materialism:
Howsoever much fish and peas I may eat, never shall I consent to give away my
Ego into durance vile of a product casually extracted by modern alchemy from the
urine. If, in our conceptions of the Universe it be our fate to fall into illusions,
then my "illusion" has, at least, the advantage of being very consoling. For, it
shows to me an intelligent Universe and the activity of Forces working in it
harmoniously and intelligently; and that my "I" is not the product of chemical and
histological elements but an embodiment of a common universal Mind. The latter,
I sense and represent to myself as acting in free will and consciousness in
accordance with the same laws which are traced for the guidance of my own
mind, but only exempt from that restraint which trammels our human conscious
individuality.
The limitless and the eternal, is not only a postulate of our mind and reason, but
also a gigantic fact, in itself. What would become of our ethical or moral principle
were not the everlasting and integral truth to serve it as a foundation!
On July 03 2012 13:14 brambolius wrote:
I asked a simple question, I didnt ask for a Rube Goldberg machine.
Also, I highly doubt that you are 112.8 years old. That's how many earth years would have passed for a sixty year old martian......so........ye.......
Oh, I think you did the math the wrong way. You can't always get what you ask for, each time I ask Loco for something I get the opposite. We humans are funny that way.
On July 03 2012 14:28 Loco wrote:
It's important to be able to laugh (and especially at oneself) when you have a sinister outlook on life. Laughter is an act of superiority, a triumph over the universe, a marvelous thing that reduces things to their just proportions...
Yay, made me clap. I'm so proud of you lol.
Made an observation. (Just ran and doubled checked in the mirror to make sure).
Me and Loco kinda look a like lol, strikingly similar I'd say. What do you guys think about that!
I think you guys will get along irl. Internet forums make you half troll and shit. It is different irl cos you are being who you really are when you're really talking to the guy.
I hope none of you guys take everything here seriously. Also I noticed pm's usually make me who I really am when I send pm's to someone. Dont know about the others.
Or I think Loco and Mariuslol is the same person trolling/leveling everyone. If so, you are my hero.
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goose58 United States. Jul 03 2012 21:24. Posts 871
On July 02 2012 16:30 Loco wrote:
People cannot better themselves.
Wrong, this is asinine and betrays your lack of knowledge on the topic. Are you really taking this stance?
I actually remember you from a thread not far back where you were the only one siding with d_smart_s. I couldn't care less who you respect and what your opinions are on the matters presented in this thread. I don't think anybody cares either that you "agree and disagree with a lot of posters" if you are incapable of elaborating on anything that was said. Completely useless statement.
So you're saying that d_smart is incorrect in every statement he makes? I suppose by your accord that every statement you make is correct? This is inaccurate, even the smartest man on earth makes mistakes.
Yes, I agree and disagree with a lot of posters in this thread. It's a waste of time pointing out every damn example. I agree with some of your points, and disagree with others.
And about the claim I was being sensationalist: I have taken one example of one person with one disease for the purpose of proving that life isn't all grand for everybody. One example is enough to prove my point, there was no reason for me to come up with more. This person could have been you. No, this person is you. There is no difference. You and I had a better roll in the lottery of life, whereas many other people didn't and pay for people like you to "enjoy the ride". And you are not even willing to acknowledge that, so fuck you and your deluded "it's just a minority that suffers hell"-mentality. And I didn't know that Merrick's condition was that rare, that was brought up by another poster. I thought from memory that he had Elephantiasis, and that isn't nearly as rare, as I have shown from the statistics previously.
A lot of the posts you make are sensationalist, and therefore inaccurate. Painting the world as pointless and black is the same thing as painting the world rosy and perfect. Life contains both good and bad. Pleasure and pain. Surely you don't disagree with this. The only thing worth arguing is the ratio of "good" to "bad".
I fully agree that we are extremely lucky people. This is not a novel viewpoint.
"Even if we believed the hype that he portraits in that post, he comes to the erroneous conclusion that diseased people don't want to live. This is inaccurate." More proof that you are full of shit. I have never once said that and I do not believe this. One of my heroes is Jason Becker, I have made a thread about him in the past; he suffers from ALS and there is a point in the thread where I was really mad at Baal because he said he should kill himself because his life sucked. I said that he actually had no idea about that and that he was in fact wrong. And why in the hell would I believe that when I am aware that there are people like this Jesus freak who oppose the RTD movement because of his own subjective experiences with "his wonderful quality of life and the support of his family, friends and church."?
You stated:
"I'm a bit shocked that you would think the Elephant Man could have had a life worth living. He was exploited until his death and lived most of his life in horrible pain, emotional and physical. Would you really want to 'make-do' as someone like him? I don't think so."
I inferred this as "diseased people don't want to live". Perhaps I was wrong to assume that. Now is your chance to expand or correct this statement.
I am well aware that many fellow sufferers find life worth living. But many others don't, and they are the ones being overlooked by people like you. Plus, what do you know about me? How do you know that I don't actually have a disease that has ruined my life? You don't, and you are an asshole. No wonder d_smart_s likes you.
Oh, and if other people like goose58 want to take the piss because I am obviously wrong and pleasure outweighs the pain in the world, why don't you argue this point properly instead of this kind of shit? Here, just take the popular example given by Schopenhauer that I posted above, the one of two animals, "one of which is engaged in eating the other." Is there a balance there? Or is the pleasure of the animal devouring the other greater than the pain experienced by the one being eaten alive? Or is it the opposite? I also challenge you to watch the documentary below and see if your view holds. Also bear in mind that, according to USDA sources, close to 20 billion animals were raised and killed for food in the US alone in 2010-2011, and up to 50% of the world's food is thrown in the trash.
Wrong, this is asinine and betrays your lack of knowledge on the topic. Are you really taking this stance?
I actually remember you from a thread not far back where you were the only one siding with d_smart_s. I couldn't care less who you respect and what your opinions are on the matters presented in this thread. I don't think anybody cares either that you "agree and disagree with a lot of posters" if you are incapable of elaborating on anything that was said. Completely useless statement.
So you're saying that d_smart is incorrect in every statement he makes? I suppose by your accord that every statement you make is correct? This is inaccurate, even the smartest man on earth makes mistakes.
Yes, I agree and disagree with a lot of posters in this thread. It's a waste of time pointing out every damn example. I agree with some of your points, and disagree with others.
And about the claim I was being sensationalist: I have taken one example of one person with one disease for the purpose of proving that life isn't all grand for everybody. One example is enough to prove my point, there was no reason for me to come up with more. This person could have been you. No, this person is you. There is no difference. You and I had a better roll in the lottery of life, whereas many other people didn't and pay for people like you to "enjoy the ride". And you are not even willing to acknowledge that, so fuck you and your deluded "it's just a minority that suffers hell"-mentality. And I didn't know that Merrick's condition was that rare, that was brought up by another poster. I thought from memory that he had Elephantiasis, and that isn't nearly as rare, as I have shown from the statistics previously.
A lot of the posts you make are sensationalist, and therefore inaccurate. Painting the world as pointless and black is the same thing as painting the world rosy and perfect. Life contains both good and bad. Pleasure and pain. Surely you don't disagree with this. The only thing worth arguing is the ratio of "good" to "bad".
I fully agree that we are extremely lucky people. This is not a novel viewpoint.
"Even if we believed the hype that he portraits in that post, he comes to the erroneous conclusion that diseased people don't want to live. This is inaccurate." More proof that you are full of shit. I have never once said that and I do not believe this. One of my heroes is Jason Becker, I have made a thread about him in the past; he suffers from ALS and there is a point in the thread where I was really mad at Baal because he said he should kill himself because his life sucked. I said that he actually had no idea about that and that he was in fact wrong. And why in the hell would I believe that when I am aware that there are people like this Jesus freak who oppose the RTD movement because of his own subjective experiences with "his wonderful quality of life and the support of his family, friends and church."?
You stated:
"I'm a bit shocked that you would think the Elephant Man could have had a life worth living. He was exploited until his death and lived most of his life in horrible pain, emotional and physical. Would you really want to 'make-do' as someone like him? I don't think so."
I inferred this as "diseased people don't want to live". Perhaps I was wrong to assume that. Now is your chance to expand or correct this statement.
I am well aware that many fellow sufferers find life worth living. But many others don't, and they are the ones being overlooked by people like you. Plus, what do you know about me? How do you know that I don't actually have a disease that has ruined my life? You don't, and you are an asshole. No wonder d_smart_s likes you.
Oh, and if other people like goose58 want to take the piss because I am obviously wrong and pleasure outweighs the pain in the world, why don't you argue this point properly instead of this kind of shit? Here, just take the popular example given by Schopenhauer that I posted above, the one of two animals, "one of which is engaged in eating the other." Is there a balance there? Or is the pleasure of the animal devouring the other greater than the pain experienced by the one being eaten alive? Or is it the opposite? I also challenge you to watch the documentary below and see if your view holds. Also bear in mind that, according to USDA sources, close to 20 billion animals were raised and killed for food in the US alone in 2010-2011, and up to 50% of the world's food is thrown in the trash.
Yes, I am really taking this stance. This shouldn't be mistaken as me saying people cannot improve their abilities in doing things, that much should be obvious enough. What I am saying is that people's characters cannot be modified, that their nature is unalterable, because the will is not something that you control, it is, in fact, a force that controls you entirely and has shaped your individuality as it is. This is why we say that true friendship is accepting someone like he is, and not making the foolish mistake of expecting the other person to change. It's about as wise to expect a person to change his ways as it is to expect a dog to stop barking.
None of us really are lucky, we just like to think we are when in fact we are just less unfortunate than others, and this is what offers people the greatest comfort--that there are always people who are worse off than themselves. But we will all experience anguish and die, and the most enlightened ones will also suffer existentially for all their lives. This is no luck.
You have inferred wrongly. What I said is that this was one example (among many others) of a life not worth living. A person who, because of his disease, has been abandoned by his family, never had any friends, never had any of his romantic and sexual needs met, and who has been exploited by people until his death and who therefore suffered immense pain both physically and psychologically for all his life - and I really do mean unrelenting suffering - did not have a life worth living. Any being who is deprived of the freedom to pursue his own interests and realize himself in life did not have a life worth living. This doesn't mean that everyone with an illness has suffered the same fate, that is why I have chosen that person in particular.
And if you were the only one to agree with d_smart_s in a thread, chances are you are not a very smart person.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
Last edit: 03/07/2012 23:02
1
goose58 United States. Jul 04 2012 01:01. Posts 871
On July 03 2012 21:57 Loco wrote:
Yes, I am really taking this stance. This shouldn't be mistaken as me saying people cannot improve their abilities in doing things, that much should be obvious enough. What I am saying is that people's characters cannot be modified, that their nature is unalterable, because the will is not something that you control, it is, in fact, a force that controls you entirely and has shaped your individuality as it is. This is why we say that true friendship is accepting someone like he is, and not making the foolish mistake of expecting the other person to change. It's about as wise to expect a person to change his ways as it is to expect a dog to stop barking.
Where's the proof that a person's character cannot be modified? This seems to be just your opinion. People's behavior improve and decline depending on who they are. Many criminals have learned the errors of their ways and reformed. Many people have regrets and learn from their past.
Character: "The mental and moral qualities distinctive to an individual".
Morals: "A person's standards of behavior or beliefs concerning what is and is not acceptable for them to do".
None of us really are lucky, we just like to think we are when in fact we are just less unfortunate than others, and this is what offers people the greatest comfort--that there are always people who are worse off than themselves. But we will all experience anguish and die, and the most enlightened ones will also suffer existentially for all their lives. This is no luck.
Well someone out there is lucky, and vice-versa. It's a statistical fact..
You have inferred wrongly. What I said is that this was one example (among many others) of a life not worth living. A person who, because of his disease, has been abandoned by his family, never had any friends, never had any of his romantic and sexual needs met, and who has been exploited by people until his death and who therefore suffered immense pain both physically and psychologically for all his life - and I really do mean unrelenting suffering - did not have a life worth living. Any being who is deprived of the freedom to pursue his own interests and realize himself in life did not have a life worth living. This doesn't mean that everyone with an illness has suffered the same fate, that is why I have chosen that person in particular.
Who are you to say when a life is worth living? Some people are diseased and in pain but want to live. Some people are very healthy/successful yet want to die.
And if you were the only one to agree with d_smart_s in a thread, chances are you are not a very smart person.
A smart person can and will be wrong at some point, and vice-versa.
I am a person with common sense. It is common sense for me to assume that you would not find life worth living if you were being abused in a concentration camp and everyone you knew including your whole family had just been murdered. Similarly, I also assume that you would not enjoy life were you to find yourself in this person's condition, and I believe you would find little reason to wish to stick around, especially if you are an atheist. It is of no importance that there are deluded believers who think that their lives are worth living in the worst situations that can befall a human being. To use them and make an argument from popularity is a sure sign of stupidity. And the people who are "healthy and successful" and want to die are just a testament to the insatiable nature of man, and the fact that nothing you will ever do will bring you lasting happiness. They are just more evidence that suffering outweighs pleasure in life - a truth that someone who is no longer blinkered like a child will come to realize.
As for your initial request, sadly it is not something that can be quickly demonstrated to someone who is not familiar with the topic at hand. I believe that a proper study into the area of free will and determinism, as well as the psychological concept of sublimation, will help you find your answer. I do not have the time nor the motivation to dumb down and put in easy-to-swallow format the works of people who have demonstrated beyond the shadow of a doubt that what I have said on the matter is true. I would recommend precise works if I believed you were genuinely interested but I don't believe you are, so I will just say that those who wish to know of them can just PM me.
fuck I should just sell some of my Pokemon cards, if no one stakes that is what I will have to do - lostaccount
On July 03 2012 13:14 brambolius wrote:
I asked a simple question, I didnt ask for a Rube Goldberg machine.
Also, I highly doubt that you are 112.8 years old. That's how many earth years would have passed for a sixty year old martian......so........ye.......
Oh, I think you did the math the wrong way. You can't always get what you ask for, each time I ask Loco for something I get the opposite. We humans are funny that way.
First of all, there is no "We humans", you reacted the way you did by choice, I'm guessing to be funny/smart or whatever. That's You, not We, gettit?
Secondly, you bungled your little joke/riddle/whatever, deal with it and post your age lol.
On June 30 2012 18:05 FvL wrote:
We're living in a world that seems to get worse every day. We're the 80's/90's generation, and we're raised believing that everything is designed to grow/get better. Now, when things aren't going our way, we're easily getting disillusioned. We create or believe conspiracy theories to elucidate our "not-so-perfect-world". Sure, previous generations messed things up for us. Some people got extremely wealthy by doing unethical things. But we're the generation who's job it is to make things right. So stop fantasising and get a grip.
You're not a victim. No more reptilians/illuminati talk. The future is ours.
goose58 United States. Jul 04 2012 19:23. Posts 871
On July 04 2012 01:49 Loco wrote:
I am a person with common sense. It is common sense for me to assume that you would not find life worth living if you were being abused in a concentration camp and everyone you knew including your whole family had just been murdered. Similarly, I also assume that you would not enjoy life were you to find yourself in this person's condition, and I believe you would find little reason to wish to stick around, especially if you are an atheist. It is of no importance that there are deluded believers who think that their lives are worth living in the worst situations that can befall a human being. To use them and make an argument from popularity is a sure sign of stupidity. And the people who are "healthy and successful" and want to die are just a testament to the insatiable nature of man, and the fact that nothing you will ever do will bring you lasting happiness. They are just more evidence that suffering outweighs pleasure in life - a truth that someone who is no longer blinkered like a child will come to realize.
As for your initial request, sadly it is not something that can be quickly demonstrated to someone who is not familiar with the topic at hand. I believe that a proper study into the area of free will and determinism, as well as the psychological concept of sublimation, will help you find your answer. I do not have the time nor the motivation to dumb down and put in easy-to-swallow format the works of people who have demonstrated beyond the shadow of a doubt that what I have said on the matter is true. I would recommend precise works if I believed you were genuinely interested but I don't believe you are, so I will just say that those who wish to know of them can just PM me.
Yea.. you are really smart and you're opinions are so unique and anyone who disagree's with you is dumb. Gotcha.
wooow wtf? I thought this was the no masturbating thread...
I was all set to do a dirty slut thai hooker drive by post but now see for_sure_this_is_the_wrong_thread... .. so where did all that go? did it expl0de? ^^=
prematurely? ^^"
I'll just leave this here then...
The probability of someone watching you is proportional to the stupidity of your action.
On July 03 2012 13:14 brambolius wrote:
I asked a simple question, I didnt ask for a Rube Goldberg machine.
Also, I highly doubt that you are 112.8 years old. That's how many earth years would have passed for a sixty year old martian......so........ye.......
Oh, I think you did the math the wrong way. You can't always get what you ask for, each time I ask Loco for something I get the opposite. We humans are funny that way.
First of all, there is no "We humans", you reacted the way you did by choice, I'm guessing to be funny/smart or whatever. That's You, not We, gettit?
Secondly, you bungled your little joke/riddle/whatever, deal with it and post your age lol.
Heh, no, not to be funny, it's a mundane, average, relatable "saying". The humour in it was that it's bland and not funny, so that makes it funny, since It's rare I end sentences like that.
It doesn't matter too much to me if other laugh or find things I say or do amusing, it's a small added bonus. (Doesn't take much to get me laughing though, I lol each time Loco writes a complicated sentence, or Baal is strict, rough and moody, or when I get to Byrnesam's name when scrolling down, before seeing whatever pic he's got for us next).
It's not really a joke or a riddle, it's a lol, to make you google it, and you'll come up with something close to 687 days or so to orbit the sun, 365 is what the Earth takes.
I also start smiling immeadeatly in public if someone is really tall, I almost get excited, since they tend to stumble, trip, or their hands move in a funny uncoordinated way, or they walse around lol.
Oh and BTW, plz lrn2syntax, and read what you quoted me on again.
Then read your reply to the quote, see anything wrong ? It's like a game, or a lol, see? You get to figure out your own screw-ups which make it seem like you don't even read what other people are writing.
You are just too triggerfinger-happy to go ahead and post more rainbow-bouncy-boop-balloon-starship-sprinkles-hey-Hey-HEY trash.
Anyway, it's clear there is no talking to you so I'll just leave you with this image, it's a lol.
Contact Users: 823 Active, 0 Logged in - Time: 12:17
United States. Jul 01 2012 03:18. Posts 4080
...I have nothing of actual value to contribute to the discussion (aka i suck at philosophy)
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