Liquid Rising - Page 2

What annoys me about foreign progamers is that most of them are pretty lazy and don't really treat starcraft as a job and more as a hobby. Koreans are not just magically better at starcraft its just that they work so much harder and take it much more seriously. Foreigners focus more on entertainment than skill and they get paid way more than Koreans even though they don't accomplish jack shit. I respect guys like Naniwa, Huk, Sase because they are willing to put in the effort to become better and sacrificed a lot to move to Korea so that they can train hardcore. Lots of foreign "pros" today are still somewhat relevant because of beta where there wasn't that much of a skill gap but they haven't really improved yet they still get a lot of attention from the community because they can speak English


For the documentary I thought it was done poorly as it pretty much was a 90minute long interview. I can watch documentaries about almost anything and something about starcraft should have entertained me the whole thing but I had to stop watching just because it got so boring about the teammates just talking about each other. A documentary should have shown us what happens and not people telling us what happened. Didn't really learn anything new from the interviews about the team and it really didn't do a great job portraying starcraft to people that don't know anything about it which documentaries should be able to do.

this is just a trailer but it looks a lot more promising as a esports documentary

double post

Havnt watched it yet but it you dont appriciate TL and all its done for starcraft and esports in general you can just go fuck yourself you 12year old fucking unapriciative fucking cuntfuck(yes airang im looking at you)

ROFL. self delusional geeks.

>implying im not allowed to type this way

a fascinating documentary into the lives of young people with autism.

Interesting thread, feel like giving my 2 cent as well.

I liked SC2 in the beginning, both watching pros play and playing myself. Didnt take that long untill i kinda gave up playing (not only because i didnt like the game, it took time away from poker and studys as well) but i also stopped enjoying watching streams, nowdays i can only watch the TOP NOTCH games like MVP or MKP in a really big tourney like MLG or something, or i get insanely boored. What I'm hinting at is that yes i agree SC2 isnt a very good game neither for playing nor watching compared to brood war. Its simply overhyped.

I also feel like a lot of the foreigner pros are overpayed and kinda freerolling life without proving anything at all, sadly that goes for most of the TL-team (well i dont know what they are getting paid, but they get kept in the rooster and send worldwide to compete in tournaments without any results for forever). It hurts thinking that Idra is actually making a bunch of money of this game, comparting to what he said he would achieve in SC2 to what he actually did... LOL!

About TL, first of all i have to agree with SakiSaki, they have given us a lot in the past and big credz to them for that. They also gave us LP <3. But today they have grown to big, to many retards as anywhere when something gets more mainstream. I read a few selected threads, otherwise i stay far away from TL forums.

Lastly: Wow i got sick nerdchills from the past just reading the nicknames of Slayer, Sven, Saft and such, those were the times...

i beat slayer in sc1 once. boom

On June 29 2012 18:43 Arirang wrote: Ugh, your response is a mess. Grats to ignoring the fact that foreign pros are dodging competition and people love them still (hahaha). Grats to giving shoutouts to a known maphacker LOL. Grats for being as good as ElkY during his prime. Seriously, who cares if you were. Grats to being wrong of the fact that foreigners are "catching up", when in reality, they were the closest during the beginning of SC2, and now they're being ditched behind again. Grats for being that guy who supports this mess and buys into the hype of mediocrity. eSports yehhhhh!

Most pro's are doing the most +EV thing, and why in heavens name would you not love Stephano over any of the Koreans. The most loved Korean by far is MC, and that's because he's got som flair, personality to go with his skills. (Not dissing the other koreans, just saying they're a little passive).

Even though he was a maphacker, he was still better than 99,99% outside korea. And I knew he was maphacking 12-13 years ago. Flash once stood up and peaked over at one of his team mates once, durty maphacker him!! Roarr LOALEOAELEOL

Next one is just another insult, some shield you got there. Never ment it that way, just ment I was around the skill level of someone who could lose 2-4 to him, something along those lines. A slight over-exagerration to make a point. There were a lot of other people who were better who deserved to go. Just an opinion though.

And you're wrong on the next one as well, we were the closest when Stephano was ranked 2nd Zerg in the World, When Huk took 2 MLG's in a row and was showing strong showings in GSL at the same time.

Probably not much point responding at the last bit either, more insults. But I guess that makes you feel "less mediocre".

On June 29 2012 19:10 SakiSaki wrote: Havnt watched it yet but it you dont appriciate TL and all its done for starcraft and esports in general you can just go fuck yourself you 12year old fucking unapriciative fucking cuntfuck(yes airang im looking at you)

Seconded.

Arirang's a major douchebag. Topic is about a documentary and fucking cunt goes on a tirade against SC2 and teamliquid which has nothing to do with the topic. Then whines about moderating over at TL where they actually ban idiots like him making it a better place.

I agree with a lot of what Arirang is saying. Marius I think you just respect TL/Nazgul/Meat and the people who generated that great game of SC1 but what the game is now is just garbage. Arirang is def right about it being LOL that they glorify these pros who are still getting annihilated by koreans. The entire korean SC community hasn't even transferred into SC2 yet and just imagine how empty the foreigner scene will be once that happens in Korea

I still think they did an excellent job with the campaign and story line though. Man, I wish I could delete my memory of it and keep playing it over and over again in an infinite loop. Good times

^ yup

watching documentary now. barely know anyone in it besides naz/nony/day 9, but its enjoyable 15 minutes in

I don't agree with the negative posts here since they have failed to realize how SC2 sucks balls and it's not the documentary's fault.

I like watching SC2 games and I don't think it sucks balls. Obviously SC1 was better but that doesn't mean you can't enjoy SC2.

People are so negative/cynical all the time on this website.

On June 29 2012 20:46 whamm! wrote: I don't agree with the negative posts here since they have failed to realize how SC2 sucks balls and it's not the documentary's fault.

You actually watched it? Rofl

On June 29 2012 21:12 Twisted wrote: I like watching SC2 games and I don't think it sucks balls. Obviously SC1 was better but that doesn't mean you can't enjoy SC2. People are so negative/cynical all the time on this website.

Sad but true. And we dont even realize it. Yes I said we cos that includes me too.

On June 29 2012 21:12 Twisted wrote: I like watching SC2 games and I don't think it sucks balls. Obviously SC1 was better but that doesn't mean you can't enjoy SC2. People are so negative/cynical all the time on this website.

thats what the variance in poker does to us =)

^ you might be joking, but that could possibly be it. Everyone chasing the $$$ but just couldnt get enough.

On June 29 2012 15:48 Arirang wrote: Yeah, it's an opinion as is with you thinking this game is great. And much like you, I find a lot of sports boring as well, but I respect the design of the game and its complexity, and its potential to become something even more amazing than what it is today. However, as for SC2, not only do I find it boring, I don't respect its game design at all. I genuinely find this game to be super mediocre and if it weren't for the franchise; Starcraft, it would not have garnered as much success as it had today. I view it more or less as a fraudulent success based on the most dedicated fans in video game history. TL, much like any other big gaming hubs is full of players with shitty opinions that think they're too important (hey, kinda like me!). But they actually think their silver league bullshit is legit as long as their grammar is correct. Have you played any games with players from TL community? Horseshit bad. Largely because it's like a new hip thing to like SC2 and League of Legends (lol im such a nerd). No hate on that really, games are becoming more mainstream and that's great. But TL's mods ban for any sort of flame even if it's legit. Hence the celebration of mediocrity, where shit players run wild talking what they wanna say without some sensible person shutting them up. It's like Reddit. Fake nice, and circle jerkery. Imagine TalentedTom getting banned for his funny little remarks on dumb hands that gets posted. Foreign pros have always struggled in SC scene, yes. And perhaps they are more successful now than they have ever been in SC history. Though, that's not saying much when none of the foreign pros really are anywhere in a global scale. I don't follow the scene much anymore, but a quick look at top 10 of S-Code shows me no foreigners. Hahaha, what a joke. Oh man, let's make a documentary about Joe Blow who failed upwards, yeah that's real interesting. You know, even when foreigners struggled in SC, Giyom was up there and so was Elky. Could we really say the same about current jokes we call pros. They consciously make the decision to leave Korea where competition is at its fiercest and get mad when Koreans enter MLG. You got jokes like this guy who is a sponsored pro: http://i.imgur.com/QPJw3.jpg. A lot of these frauds make enough money from streaming and I don't think they really care at getting better anymore. Now, I don't know that, but it sure feels like that when they dodge competition and leave Korea. Tryhard is a pretty bad vocab, my mistake. In reality, the foreign pros don't really try hard at all. Back then, it was all about getting into Korea. That was the dream. Is it anymore? No foreigner really wants to go to Korea. It's too hard there to win. If that shit isn't lame I don't know what is. Welcome to dodge city. Let's look at another gaming scene; fighting games. Japan used to body US free in every tournament. For decades they've been doing that. But not anymore. US caught up because these players are legit, they play for real. There's not even any money in the scene, and the same players has been around for tens of years. They play for the love of the game and competition. Can there be anything more boring and fake as SC2 scene? All this hype and excitment built on fraudulent players who are mediocre and have no love for the game? Defrag, I only use ">" as a bulletpoint. Users commonly use this to footnote and such, so I don't know what the issue is. Don't be a nazi, thanks.

It's really great when uninformed retards open their mouth about shit they obviously have spent no time actually researching.

1) Korea, unlike SC1, has LESS big tournaments than the rest of the world. The most prestigious tournament is in Korea, yes, but the majority of big events are outside. Korean pros are travelling OUT of Korea for events - going to Korea is for practice.

2) List of progamers who have spent time in Korea:
Me (about 2 years, but I havent done shit worth mentioning in a long time)
Huk (almost 2 years)
SaSe (about 1 year)
Naniwa (about 1 year)
Haypro (about 1 year)
TLO
Ret
Sheth
MorroW
Select (on and off, lots of time)
ToD (on and off)
Grubby (one month)
Stephano (one month, is coming back for the next GSL I believe)
Thorzain (spent a couple of months last summer, is coming back now)
IdrA (not that much for SC2 as for SC1, but still a reasonable amount of time)
Nightend
Deathangel
SjoW
QXC
Cytoplasm
... Others Im no doubt forgetting

Results from these players in GSL:
2x GSL Semi Finals (me)
3x GSL Ro8s (Naniwa, Huk, IdrA)

Yeah, it's complete bullshit to say people don't want to go to Korea - lots and lots and lots of people go there just for practice, it makes very little sense for most people to move there permanently with the lack of tournaments, but some still try for the glory.

Don't get me wrong, there's a lot of things to actually complain about for SC2, and it's sad how much easier it is to get attention as a non-korean pro (though this is going to change with the Korean SC1 scene switching to SC2, Koreans will get good contracts etc too now), and many 'pros' are indeed not taking it as seriously as they could - just like in SC1. But your points are mostly bullshit and simply show that you don't actually follow the scene at all.

Another thing you completely, for some reason, fail to recognize is that there's 3 Korean players in the documentary... Yeah.
HerO:
Dreamhack Winter 2011 - 1st place
NASL S2 - 2nd place
GSL Semi-Finalist

TaeJa:
Code S ro8 at the moment, just all-killed Prime

Zenio:
Been code S forever, 3rd place IEM Kiev

I havent watched this documentary even though I was in it, but I really don't think 'failing upwards' is fair considering there are some very good results spread out among the members of this team.

Note: Before anyone brings up how horrible I am nowadays at this game, yes, I am and no it doesn't change anything.

On June 29 2012 20:21 Daut wrote: watching documentary now. barely know anyone in it besides naz/nony/day 9, but its enjoyable 15 minutes in

>:

On June 29 2012 20:09 RaiNKhAN wrote: I agree with a lot of what Arirang is saying. Marius I think you just respect TL/Nazgul/Meat and the people who generated that great game of SC1 but what the game is now is just garbage. Arirang is def right about it being LOL that they glorify these pros who are still getting annihilated by koreans. The entire korean SC community hasn't even transferred into SC2 yet and just imagine how empty the foreigner scene will be once that happens in Korea I still think they did an excellent job with the campaign and story line though. Man, I wish I could delete my memory of it and keep playing it over and over again in an infinite loop. Good times

The campaign was UTTER SHIT, what the fuck. Brutal rape of SC1 story and some extremely fucking cringeworthy dialogue.

TianYuan that was an awfully long reply to just chime in with "But don't get me wrong guys"

Either stick to ur guns or dont argue. There is nothing more cliche in 2011-2012 forum argument than when people say 'don't get me wrong but'. It is the exact same kind of crap that we've seen with "No offense, but".

You can't take both sides of this and win/win everywhere. When did you make the GSL semi-finals btw? I've been following GSL for about two years now and I don't remember seeing you unless you were one of the korean guys